What's your safety play on this shot?
- Thread starter klockdoc
- Start date
-- peerPeer said:
I understand what you are saying. Simplier is "better". But, for all practical purposes, try this shot on a table. I believe you will find it easier to control and more consistant than your diagram. The nine ball is "bigger" coming into the corner as the path in my diagram shows. It is easier to get a hook.
Oh, the 8 isn't even close to double hitting the cue ball. The cue is already hitting the third rail when the eight gets to the head rail.
Give it a try.
hitting the 8 thin is going to make it travel slower than the cb (they weigh the same so the if the 8 isn't hit full then the cueball will retain most of it's momentum) and with the inside english spinning it further left off the upper left rail is going to spin it further faster than the 8 is going to go. they shouldn't get close at all. and when you play the shot your way you make the side pocket pretty big for that cueball. not to mention if you hit it thicker to avoid the side you have a pretty good chance of leaving the 8 too close to that lower corner pocket. with the first shot even if you hit the 8 too thick or don't spin the cueball enough you're not going to leave the 8 near a pocket. you leave a bank or a shot where your opponent is going to really have to come with somethig to get out
poolplayer/klockdoc,
My issue with your 5 railer is the fact that it is going to play massivly different depending on the rails. Also, considering you are frozen to the 8, you have to shoot into the 8 a little to make sure you get contact, as shooting with a lot of inside english, the CB is going to "squirt" off to the right a little, so I have a feeling the the hit is going to be a little thicker than diagrammed. Which forces you to hit a little harder to get the full 5 rails. I just see this shot looking a LOT different day to day, heck.. Even hour to hour.
If you don't,
A. Leave your opponent on the rail
or
B. Hook him behind the 9
You aren't going to like it.
I like the masse safe better because, I can personally 100% guarantee that I am not going to scratch in the side, and I can get the cue ball near the bottom rail about 85%, and it's only that low because of the extreme angle.
I've played a little bit of billiards in South Korea and Tacoma, WA... So I am not afraid of using masse in regular games. I used to practice masse's of getting around an entire ball that I am frozen to without fouling.
This 5 railer might work for others, tho. I'm not saying it's a bad shot. I just don't like it for this situation.
Also, I absolutely, 100%, do not like coming off the 5th rail towards the 9 ball. The reason being, if you do not get the exact path you are looking for, you leave your opponent a foot and a half off the rail. He's gonna kill you if you do not leave the 8 on the rail.
Russ
Russ
My issue with your 5 railer is the fact that it is going to play massivly different depending on the rails. Also, considering you are frozen to the 8, you have to shoot into the 8 a little to make sure you get contact, as shooting with a lot of inside english, the CB is going to "squirt" off to the right a little, so I have a feeling the the hit is going to be a little thicker than diagrammed. Which forces you to hit a little harder to get the full 5 rails. I just see this shot looking a LOT different day to day, heck.. Even hour to hour.
If you don't,
A. Leave your opponent on the rail
or
B. Hook him behind the 9
You aren't going to like it.
I like the masse safe better because, I can personally 100% guarantee that I am not going to scratch in the side, and I can get the cue ball near the bottom rail about 85%, and it's only that low because of the extreme angle.
I've played a little bit of billiards in South Korea and Tacoma, WA... So I am not afraid of using masse in regular games. I used to practice masse's of getting around an entire ball that I am frozen to without fouling.
This 5 railer might work for others, tho. I'm not saying it's a bad shot. I just don't like it for this situation.
Also, I absolutely, 100%, do not like coming off the 5th rail towards the 9 ball. The reason being, if you do not get the exact path you are looking for, you leave your opponent a foot and a half off the rail. He's gonna kill you if you do not leave the 8 on the rail.
Russ
Russ
Russ Chewning said:
Russ, I think that if you tried the shot, you would see that it is not a difficult shot at all. The hit on the 8 is very minimal. It is hitting the cue ball just off center tangent line. Kind of like "fuzzing" a ball.
When I first saw this shot, it was about 5 years ago. Different times during those 5 years, I've shown this shot to many people. I have hit it on many different tables and had others shoot the shot. The outcome was similar in all cases. Kind of like what Jon said in his post when he practiced this shot. "I tried it 3 times and it worked all 3". Different table, different person.
As far as not leaving your opponent in the positions you describe, that works both ways, if you do not get where you need to with your shot.
I am sure you are very adept in masse shots and maybe that is the best shot suited for you. I am not saying that this is the only shot in this situation, but, another way to look at it.
I agree with you on staying close to the rail behind the 9 on the 5 railer. I was only showing what the outcome of the shot when the Canadian shot it against Rich. Coming in from my angle makes the 9 pretty "big" for the hook.
Have to admit, whether he tried to or not to leave it there, it was very impressive when it happened. Only he knows for sure.
Give it a try though. I think you will be surprised. One thing I have definately found out; is WEI tables don't actually play like "real" tables.
Some items to think about on your shot, (I haven't tried it, but, I will), from just looking at the WEI table.
1)The 8 ball is froze to the Q ball and the tangent line is going to the side pocket. (you can see this in my answer post table). In order to get below the side pocket, you will (as you stated) have to slightly masse or use low english to get below the side pocket.
2) When using low, you have to hit the 8 a little fuller than in my shot because you have draw. If hit too thin, the cue ball will not react to the english. With the balls being frozen and you shooting in that direction, you will be "pushing" the eight to the left, away away from the center of the table at the middle diamond. Probably at least 1/2 diamond..
If you hit too hard (in order to get your draw stroke to react and the 8 bounces slightly off the rail, you could leave your opponent a very easy shot on the 8 in the corner unless you also get lucky and hook him behind the 9. I think that the hook is a very small area coming in from that direction, don't you?But, give it a try next time you have a chance. I think you will be surprised.
Good Luck
Last edited:
Klockdoc, give yourself credit for a nice thread. The two shots that seem to have some backing here are both rock solid, and one's own abilities may dictate the percentages here. The multi-rail safe and the masse safe are both imaginative, solid shots and I'd guess that those that have read this thread learned something.