When is a cue maker no longer a custom cue maker?

Shooter08

Shooter08

Runde Aficianado
Silver Member
If a individual cue maker starts out making cues and becomes successful, if he or she hires a couple of employees to assist in daily operations and minimal cue building tasks when do you decide they are no longer a custom cue builder? If a custom builder decides to introduce a line of models he tries to keep in stock to make a living, is he no longer a custom builder? My personal daily player is a Runde Custom. Bob Runde made every cue at Schon prior to leaving and his cues are highly desirable, but a lot of people call Schon a Production Cue Company. Now Evan works on every cue that goes out the door at Schon and will build a custom to your specs if you contact them. Are cue builders doomed by their success and to be labeled the dreaded "Production Cue Company" if they have a desire to not sit in a room by themselves? Looking for your opinion and why you feel the way you do.
 
custom

adjective
1.made or done to order for a particular customer.
"a custom guitar"

My opinion;
A custom cue is defined as a cue that was ordered and made with specifications specified by a customer.
A production cue is defined as a cue that has been produced in a certain quantity.
Limited Edition cues do not qualify as custom.
A semi-custom cue is defined as a production cue that was ordered with slight alterations (stain, wrap, shaft diameter, or tip).

I've always heard the term "cuemaker" not "custom cuemaker".
In order to be a custom cuemaker, one would have to never a production cue.

Joss makes production cues, but has made custom cues. Do you see them as custom or production?
Leon Sly makes custom cues, but has made a number of cues as a batch that are all similar. Do you see him as custom or production?

IMO, I don't give two shits if they are custom or production. I care if they make a quality product.
 
This is exactly my point. If Sly (builder name used for example purposes only) decides to post a standard line of 10 cues on his site and is able to ship them on a regular basis how does this make him any less of a custom cue builder? IMHO a Production Cue company is along the lines of Viking, Cuetec, Players, etc...., I cannot speak of Joss because I am not familiar with their operation, but I do know Schon has no more than 5 employees and Evan works on every cue. Does this mean Evan needs to build 1 to 5 Unique cues a month on average to have Schon be considered a custom cue builder? Or are most people defining a custom cue builder incorrectly? Success should not make a Custom Cue Builder be known as a Production Cue Company.
 
Shooter08 said:
This is exactly my point. If Sly (builder name used for example purposes only) decides to post a standard line of 10 cues on his site and is able to ship them on a regular basis how does this make him any less of a custom cue builder? IMHO a Production Cue company is along the lines of Viking, Cuetec, Players, etc...., I cannot speak of Joss because I am not familiar with their operation, but I do know Schon has no more than 5 employees and Evan works on every cue. Does this mean Evan needs to build 1 to 5 Unique cues a month on average to have Schon be considered a custom cue builder? Or are most people defining a custom cue builder incorrectly? Success should not make a Custom Cue Builder be known as a Production Cue Company.
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It can certainly be interpreted differently depending on the situation but if the majority of the cues you sell are duplicates you've certainly moved away from the custom moniker. Catering to mass buyers through a catalog ordering system is definitely more in line with production rather than custom.

I don't think it has to be by single order though. You don't have to take orders. Each cue can be unique and a builder could in theory build what he wants to build then sell it rather than stock piling orders. That wouldn't be any less "custom" than taking an individual order.
 
DAVE_M said:
custom

adjective
1.made or done to order for a particular customer.
"a custom guitar"

My opinion;
A custom cue is defined as a cue that was ordered and made with specifications specified by a customer.
A production cue is defined as a cue that has been produced in a certain quantity.
Limited Edition cues do not qualify as custom.
A semi-custom cue is defined as a production cue that was ordered with slight alterations (stain, wrap, shaft diameter, or tip).

I've always heard the term "cuemaker" not "custom cuemaker".
In order to be a custom cuemaker, one would have to never a production cue.

Joss makes production cues, but has made custom cues. Do you see them as custom or production?
Leon Sly makes custom cues, but has made a number of cues as a batch that are all similar. Do you see him as custom or production?

IMO, I don't give two shits if they are custom or production. I care if they make a quality product.
Click to expand...

There you go. Good answer.
 
Here are the first two that came to my mind.

Judd
Black Boar

I still consider them both to be custom cue makers.
 
A custom cue at its essence has to be customized in some way, shape, or form. If lots of other people are walking around with the exact same cue you have, it's not customized.

I would call someone a production cue maker if a majority of the cues they sell are based on a model with no material customizations. I don't care if it's made in a factory or by a single craftsman; if it's one of a line of identical cues, it's production.

Now, there's nothing wrong with production cues. Many of them play very well. I've seen well-made factory cues that have tighter tolerances than some custom cues (especially new/beginner custom cue makers).
 
If you make cues then sell them, that's production. If the cue is designed and sold (for all intensive purposes) before it is built, it is custom. Your answer then lies in whether the cue maker in question does more of the former, or the latter.
 
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I had the pleasure of visiting Evan Clark a couple of months ago. He has only 2 or 3 employees now. He said that he will make a you a custom cue but rather work with dealers. He does not like worrying about if it is exactly what the customer wanted. He is a very kind man, a bit older than I thought. If you saw his shop, I think you would be surprised. Located in a rather not so nice area, "stuff" everywhere in the shop. I would love to look through the dusty shelves to see what gems have been buried.

I guess my point is that I had a preconception of what production was and related it to a factory or an assembly line or automated process. I know he does not consider himself a production cue maker. It is just him and a couple of guys making cues in a dingy old building. Schon may or may not be a production cue, but it should not be a negative either way.
 
I think the question of whether a "custom" cue maker is even considered a cue maker any longer if it becomes virtually impossible for a normal person to call up and get a cue within a year from them for less than several thousands of dollars. I don't even know what to call someone that makes cues for rich people with no time frame. Hobbyist? Artist?

"pssshhhhhh.... he'll get it when he gets it.... Imma artist!!!"

Respectfully and with not one single ounce of sarcasm,

Lesh
 
Shooter08 said:
If a individual cue maker starts out making cues and becomes successful, if he or she hires a couple of employees to assist in daily operations and minimal cue building tasks when do you decide they are no longer a custom cue builder? If a custom builder decides to introduce a line of models he tries to keep in stock to make a living, is he no longer a custom builder? My personal daily player is a Runde Custom. Bob Runde made every cue at Schon prior to leaving and his cues are highly desirable, but a lot of people call Schon a Production Cue Company. Now Evan works on every cue that goes out the door at Schon and will build a custom to your specs if you contact them. Are cue builders doomed by their success and to be labeled the dreaded "Production Cue Company" if they have a desire to not sit in a room by themselves? Looking for your opinion and why you feel the way you do.
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You Mad Bro? Don't be mad because they sold out and wanted to make money faster. and went the mass production route, like you said there just wanting to become successful. I don't know much about the history of Schon and there product line up, but I would consider them to be in the same category as the other top of the line production companies granted I think they are a better quality cue then the others. but I like there cues and have zero things to say bad about them but when you can buy there cues out of a billiard magazine its not a good sign. As for there Runde series I would say those are a limited edition cues not custom but for sure a good looking series of cues. But that's just my opinion and that's not to say your cue isn't worth any thing, I just would think to call up Schon to have a custom cue made.
 
TSW said:
I would call someone a production cue maker if a majority of the cues they sell are based on a model with no material customizations. I don't care if it's made in a factory or by a single craftsman; if it's one of a line of identical cues, it's production.
Click to expand...

South West cues would be a good example of this.

Now, I'm certain I have pissed off those who have paid the stupid money
to get one, and yes I have owned three of them when the stupid money was 2K
not what it is now.
 
Definitely not mad "bro". I am a Schon dealer and love their cues. I just get tired of people seeming to talk down about them and other small successful custom cue builders who have a stock line available. People who knock these type of cue builders call them "Production Cues" like they are somehow inferior to a cue made in a one man shop. I guess if they wanted they could have a 5-10 year waiting list and charge a minimum of 3-5k a cue and everyone would want one. I think some newer uneducated cue buyers may learn some valuable information from this thread. I really don't think if you want to shoot with a non-ld shaft you are going to find a better playing cue than a STL1 for the money. That being said I would recommend having the tip of your preference installed if you like something softer.
 
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