Whippy Meucci Shafts - Really?

Jody B said:
Ok Mr dm,
I have a question for you. Have you ever thought about a high powered rifle and whether or not there is any flex to the barrel?

There is this little thing called harmonic/distortion/balance and it affects rifle barrels,golf clubs,pool cues or any other object with a shaft or barrel or tube. Study it there will be a pop quiz later.
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NOPE, if you want to know the truth...I've NEVER thought about it.

I studied it and I feel like Tommy Lee getting ready to take his Chemistry exam at Nebraska. :confused: ;)
 
drivermaker said:
I keep seeing people post how "whippy" Meucci shafts are. What the hell does this mean...can somebody explain it to me? How are you measuring the amount of flex? What tools do you have to do this? Which way is the shaft flexing and how much is bending to create this "WHIP"? WHERE is it bending upon impact and how much force is needed to create this bend or whip?

QUOTE]

Have you ever seen Bob Brynes video on pool. He shows a simple test you can do to test how whippy a cue is. Basically you hold the cue between your arm and body and with the hand on the other arm you bang the side of the cue. You watch how much the tip vibrates and the more vibration means a more whippy or spindly cue. You can also just hold the cue vertical and slightly bend the cue and see how easily it bends.
I can tell instantly how whippy a cue is by hitting with it. I've found some one piece house cues as stiff as my predator and I've seen many cues at my billiard supply store that are very whippy and I would not even consider using. I guess its just personal preference.
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christopheradam said:
drivermaker said:
I keep seeing people post how "whippy" Meucci shafts are. What the hell does this mean...can somebody explain it to me? How are you measuring the amount of flex? What tools do you have to do this? Which way is the shaft flexing and how much is bending to create this "WHIP"? WHERE is it bending upon impact and how much force is needed to create this bend or whip?

QUOTE]

Have you ever seen Bob Brynes video on pool. He shows a simple test you can do to test how whippy a cue is. Basically you hold the cue between your arm and body and with the hand on the other arm you bang the side of the cue. You watch how much the tip vibrates and the more vibration means a more whippy or spindly cue. You can also just hold the cue vertical and slightly bend the cue and see how easily it bends.
I can tell instantly how whippy a cue is by hitting with it. I've found some one piece house cues as stiff as my predator and I've seen many cues at my billiard supply store that are very whippy and I would not even consider using. I guess its just personal preference.
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How does bending a cue by hand with considerable brute force apply to striking a cue ball at around 10 mph? How much bend is going to occur during that speed?
Where does "whippiness" even come into play? To get a CB moving at normal shooting speed doesn't take much of a force at all...SURELY not enough to bend the shit out of a shaft!

Getting a cue to vibrate is no big deal...they ALL do it! Every single one. The human eye isn't able to really discern that kind of rapid movement. Go back to the links in my first post on vibrations for determining flex in a golf club and the equipment used. You also have "ZONE" frequencies and flex throughout the shaft. Tell me your test for flex and bend and how you determine it 10 inches down the shaft?

There have been others on here that have felt a Predator was "whippy" when they tried one. I still want to know what "whippy" means. It's a totally bullshit term and description.
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drivermaker said:
How does bending a cue by hand with considerable brute force apply to striking a cue ball at around 10 mph? How much bend is going to occur during that speed?
Where does "whippiness" even come into play? To get a CB moving at normal shooting speed doesn't take much of a force at all...SURELY not enough to bend the shit out of a shaft!
.
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I would say it comes into play more at the higher speed shots.

drivermaker said:
Getting a cue to vibrate is no big deal...they ALL do it! Every single one. The human eye isn't able to really discern that kind of rapid movement. Go back to the links in my first post on vibrations for determining flex in a golf club and the equipment used. You also have "ZONE" frequencies and flex throughout the shaft. Tell me your test for flex and bend and how you determine it 10 inches down the shaft?
.
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Maybe not discern the amount of vibration but you can discern how long it vibrates for.
I don't have a test for 10 inches down the shaft. I guess you could break it over your knee and measure how far it flexes before it breaks :).

drivermaker said:
There have been others on here that have felt a Predator was "whippy" when they tried one. I still want to know what "whippy" means. It's a totally bullshit term and description.
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I guess Whippy means different things to different people then. I would definitaly classify a 314 as stiff.
 
In Your Dreams

Koop said:
Ken,

Which shaft is this? Is the new one from Bill Stroud? I have heard great things about the Universal shaft and I am considering one in the future.

Thanks,
Koop
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CUES DO NOT AIM ANYTHING. CUES ARE ALSO NOT SENTIENT. IT'S A PIECE OF WOOD, FOR CHRIST'S SAKE. JUST LIKE QUANTUM PHYSICS WILL NOT IMPROVE YOUR GAME ONE FRIGGIN IOTA. GET OFF THE DIME AND COBBLE TOGETHER AN AIMING SYSTEM THAT REALLY DOES DO EVERYTHING POSSIBLE ON A POOL TABLE. THEN YOU WILL NOT NEED TO OWN FORTY FRIGGIN CUES. YOU GUYS ARE FROM OUTER SPACE, AND SERIOUSLY NEED TO SAVE YOUR MONEY TO RENT A PADDED ROOM SO YOU CAN'T HURT YOUR SELVES.
 
sonia said:
JUST LIKE QUANTUM PHYSICS WILL NOT IMPROVE YOUR GAME ONE FRIGGIN IOTA.
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GASP!!! WHAT??!!! Do you want to shut down all of the great Ph.D. instructors and 3/4 of this forum?? HOW DARE YOU!! ;)
 
sonia said:
CUES DO NOT AIM ANYTHING. CUES ARE ALSO NOT SENTIENT. IT'S A PIECE OF WOOD, FOR CHRIST'S SAKE. JUST LIKE QUANTUM PHYSICS WILL NOT IMPROVE YOUR GAME ONE FRIGGIN IOTA. GET OFF THE DIME AND COBBLE TOGETHER AN AIMING SYSTEM THAT REALLY DOES DO EVERYTHING POSSIBLE ON A POOL TABLE. THEN YOU WILL NOT NEED TO OWN FORTY FRIGGIN CUES. YOU GUYS ARE FROM OUTER SPACE, AND SERIOUSLY NEED TO SAVE YOUR MONEY TO RENT A PADDED ROOM SO YOU CAN'T HURT YOUR SELVES.
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Nice to see I got a rise out of you Hal :)

I'll be calling again soon.

Dave (from that town in MA)
 
When a ball is struck, the cue ball is away before any bending of the cue happens.

So it only seems logical that the endmass is the only thing that will have an effect on what the ball does when struck off center.
 
Wake Up And Smell The Coffee

Sharkey said:
What was the point of this thread? So that you can ask a bunch of questions that no one really cares about and then blast into anyone that tries to give you their honest opinion but doesn't care about how you test you ummmm shaft. You have the gaul to say someone else just wants attention! I bet you are one of those people that run to your computer first thing in the morning so you can see who has been talking about you. Get a life, well besides this pathetic one and let the forum get back to helping people instead of antaganizing them. This forum has gotten way to "clickish" and has really stopped helping people.
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EXACTLY HOW ARE YOU GOING TO HELP POOL PLAYERS? THEY HAVE PLAYED FOR MANY YEARS AND HAVE NOT IMPROVED. AS FAR AS I CAN SEE. HELL, THEY DO NOT APPEAR TO HAVE THE WILL AND DETERMINATION OR BRAINS TO EVER IMPROVE THEIR PRESENT STATUS. DO YOU HAVE THE GAME AND KNOWLEDGE TO TEACH THESE PLAYERS? AND WHAT EXACTLY WOULD YOU TEACH THEM?
 
last time i checked there was still no machine capable of the discernment of the human eye. the human body is a creation of unrivaled beauty and it should never be underestimated. at least thats what i think...
 
djkx1 said:
last time i checked there was still no machine capable of the discernment of the human eye. the human body is a creation of unrivaled beauty and it should never be underestimated. at least thats what i think...
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Oh boy...you're a real winner. OK...how about prove it and tell me how many cpm's (cycles per minute) a golf shaft is moving when twanged. We'll then check it on a computer with a laser light to determine who is off.

How about going to the next NASCAR event and tell how fast everyone is going around their qualifying lap to the nearest 1/100 mph.

Better yet...how about memorize everything that's on your computer on every website available and give us a report back tomorrow.

And last but not least, make sure you have your eyes checked by an opthamologist to make certain they're exactly the same as another person who might be testing whatever it is. :rolleyes:
 
christopheradam said:
I would say it comes into play more at the higher speed shots.

Maybe not discern the amount of vibration but you can discern how long it vibrates for.
I don't have a test for 10 inches down the shaft. I guess you could break it over your knee and measure how far it flexes before it breaks :).
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And what speed shots would that be before it happens? Average break speed by an amateur is probably about 19-23 mph. And that's rearin' back and firing it. Do you think anybody ever comes close to that in normal play?
I'd say you'll definitely have bend in a break shot, but I also have known some power break players that have broken with a Meucci and had no ill effects at all.

What are your split second time frames in length of vibration to determine the different categories of flex? How are those categories also broken down?
 
drivermaker said:
Unless you have some sort of machine like we use above in golf, how do you really know what you have and what the difference is between one or the other?
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Can you just hang a known weight on the end and measure the shaft deflection at the tip? The more shaft deflection, the "whippier."


T.
 
TeddyJ said:
Can you just hang a known weight on the end and measure the shaft deflection at the tip? The more shaft deflection, the "whippier."


T.
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That used to be the old way of measuring for flex. A graph or chart located behind it would then determine what the flex was based on known and validated measurements which categorized them. It's not as accurate.
 
Egg McDogit said:
maybe whippy isn't the right description. how about wet noodle hit?
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That also presents problems for those like yourself because it could fall under
el dente and you wouldn't have a clue.
 
drivermaker said:
That also presents problems for those like yourself because it could fall under
el dente and you wouldn't have a clue.
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eh what's that old man? I think you musta cooked your brain til it was el dente.
 
Egg McDogit said:
eh what's that old man? I think you musta cooked your brain til it was el dente.
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Watch your mouth young punk...wasn't it another old man in Leesburg that cleaned your ass out every which way including sideways and made you look like a know nothing hack?? (don't claim amnesia on me now)
 
They Are Whippier, here's why...

I just did this little experiment. I wedged the butt of various cues under the rubber of my table and used a box to support the joint area of the cues. I took a fairly heavy 4' water level, and supported it across the tips toward the center of the level. The level tipped toward the Meucci's every time when it was close to the center (meaning there was more weight to shift). I tested various Meucci's against Schons, Predators, and house cues. The stiffest cues were house cues. Schons and Predator were equal, and Meucci's were the softest.

Mind you, you need some weight on it to see the difference. Meucci has a long, straight cylinder shape for the 16" toward the tip. They only taper out about 1mm. A House cue tapers out 3 or 4 mm in the same length. This "cone" shape of a house cue is much stiffer than the cylinder shape of a Meucci.

Here's a picture of my set-up. The Meucci is the cue on the left. The cue on the right is my Predator shafted JossWest.

Meucci_test.JPG
 
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