spanky981 said:
These are not Whitten cases or marked as Whittens(like the fake hand bags are marked).. I think you need to reread the description.
Arent you the same guy who has a thread selling Flowers style cases . and also sells Thomas and centennial copy cases. explain the difference
Also, I have never hijacked any of your threads and dont understand why you would do this to mine.
I am sorry I should have stayed out of it. But since you asked then I will explain the difference.
First, Fellini/Gore/Centennial/George/McDermott/Kelli/Thomas/Engles --- GTF
This is a genre of cases started by leather workers long before Fellini cases ever came out. This general style of case belongs to no one. However in the billiard industry Fellini gets the credit because they were the first to bring an adaptation of it to market specifically made for cue cases. Successive cases in this style by the makers listed above have all been their interpretations of how this style should be made. Each has brought improvements of modifications that they felt/feel makes the cases BETTER THAN that which came before it. When I was asked to do the GTF cases I refused to simply copy the case and demanded that I be able to design a case in this genre that included my own, in my opinion, improvements and that is what I did.
Jay Flowers
The same thing applies to the Flowers style cases I am making. These are not copies, they are new cases made in the same basic style, western themed tooled leather, but with many differences to the original in construction and design. They are better than the original cases in many respects. I call them a tribute because that is exactly what they are and I give credit to Jay for bringing us this style just as a give credit to Bob Hemphil for bringing us the Fellini style of case.
The difference;
The case you are presenting here is not an improvement over the original, you make that a part of the description and we both know it to be fact.
It is not a tribute either as the only reason Whitten is mentioned is to make sure that you are covered when it comes to full disclosure. Nowhere on the case does it mention that Whitten is the originator of the design. When the case is sold then Whitten will have no credit from this case. The single reason for building this product is to trade on the signature look that an existing company designed and still sells. No attempt at all was made to change anything.
The difference is that when I offer something it is made to improve, to restore, to build up and to bring long lasting value to the customer.
When an inferior copy is offered even at a lower price it dilutes, destroys, and provides less value for the customer. It trades on the reputation built by the originator and conveys an implied promise that the product will be "just as good" without actually making that claim but then since the promise of quality is just implied it doesn't need to be guaranteed.
"These cases are nice.. Not as good as a Whitten but very comparable."
When you make a statement like this it is basically a cover your ass implication that the case is really "as good" as Whitten. wink wink.
When I owned Instroke I had to deal with statements like these almost every day. A good portion of my time was spent chasing down Ebay sellers who loved to sprinkle statements like this in their auctions. "Not an Instroke - but you can't tell the difference" and similar statements.
So not only were these people stealing by selling ripoffs of my designs they were also ripping off my quality promise to my customers by implying that their knockoffs were just as good. And that is the real difference and the real tragedy.
And the funny part is you are even knocking the other knockoffs by saying that your knockoff is the better value over the other more expensive ones.
One final point on value.
What is value? Value is how much trouble free use plus benefit of ownership that you receive when you purchase a product. Value often cannot be measured when you first purchase a product because you don't know how long it will last or what the company will do when it breaks. You buy from reputable companies because they have earned the reputation through providing long lasting products that they stand behind in the rare instances that something goes wrong.
So where is the value in purchasing a knockoff? Well there is the seeming cost savings, $400 Whitten vs. a $150 knockoff. $250 is a lot of difference up front.
However, when something breaks on the knockoff who fixes it? Does it get sent back to Taiwan? Or is it on the customer to do this? If the case somehow damages the cue who is responsible for it? Who will handle that issue? Or does the customer trade away any rights by purchasing a knockoff for a fraction of the price of the orginal. So you stick your $5000 Joss West into a knockoff and the factory worker drove the nail in wrong that day and your cue gets a nice long scratch in it. Suddenly that $250 savings is gone.
Who checks these cases? Who takes responsibility for how they are made?
Now, let's examine value from a longevity and cost of ownership standpoint. This one is my favorite.
Let's assume that the $150 knockoff goes two years before it starts breaking to the point of uselessness. The cost of ownership is then $75 per year.
If the $400 Whitten goes five years then the cost of ownership is $80 per year and comes with Whitten's reputation and guarantee every single day of that ownership. If it goes ten years then the cost to own a Whitten is $40 per year.
I have seen this very scene play out time and again with the Instroke vs. Instroke knockoffs.
Since I did all the shows for a period of almost ten years I got to see lots of customers year after year.
I saw people who made the decision to buy a knockoff for the cheaper price - even after making their comparisons to genuine Instrokes - I saw them come back the next year with their broken cases and purchase an Instroke and tell me that they should have bought the Instroke in the first place.
The best satisfaction I got was the people who came back year after year to show me that their case was still holding up and still going strong. Very often they would bring people with them and encourage their friends to purchase an Instroke. They would tell me stories about other friends who went the "cheap" route and regretted it.
So the difference is value and security. If you as a buyer invest in a name brand that stands behind it's promise of quality then you will never regret it. If you purchase untested knockoffs which make no promise and don't stand behind what they make (they can't afford to) then you will likely regret it.
As a seller you have to live with the fact that you are selling a product that you can't stand behind. Neither the producer nor the seller have enough profit to offer any customer service. You have to live with the fact that the only reason you are able to sell this product is because another company has spent the time, money, and effort to make it famous and bring it to market. The analogy here is the farmer plants and cultivates the crop and you come in behind him and pick every 4th ear of corn without doing any of the work to grow it and without paying for it.
Most people would define that as theft. That's the difference.
