Why Do So Many Bar Room Recreational 8-Ball Players Cling to the Nonsense Outdated Rules?

[ShootingArts]

The most ridiculous rule is having to call the ball going in "clean" or not. When I first heard it I thought they meant not hitting another ball, what they meant is that you had to call the rail or facing if the ball was going to contact it. They really wanted to get their money's worth out of those games.

I was alone, avoiding trouble to avoid a fight and maybe a visit to a local jail which would probably result in a fine that happened to amount to everything I had on me. I was making a loop, from near Baton Rouge LA, up into Mississippi and Arkansas maybe a bit of Tennnessee or Alabama, then drop down to the gulf coast and follow it back west to get home again.

Most places had similar rules to what I played in bars in Baton Rouge but that trip across the upper part of the gulf coast states tried my patience so bad I never went thataway to gamble again! "Call everything." "You didn't call brushing the rail before it went in." "You didn't call hitting the inner rail." I am pretty sure I got called for running over the spot a time or two without calling it! I had to keep reminding myself that I was making money everywhere I found an action table. Might have been a few dollars or might have been pretty nice. Thing was, after learning one set of weird rules I would go two miles down the road and be met with a whole nuther set of rules!

One of my favorite "strange rules" was concerning the last ball and the eight when playing eight ball. Some places were just call the eight and pocket and it was legal. Some the object ball had to fall in the pocket first.

I have to admit that after a few road trips I delighted in catching strangers with the screwed up rules of my local bar. "That's not the way we do it in Houston!" "You aren't in Houston."

On the road I had learned never to pass up a pool table, a nothing looking spot might yield the biggest score of the trip. Mostly I just had to beat them with whatever rules they threw at me including some I knew they were creating on the spot and snickering at the dumb stranger. The dumb stranger was still winning more than he was losing and it was fun to catch them with their own rule later in the session. One thing I forgot about, the eight ball. Some places you have to bank the eight, some places you have to pocket the eight in the same pocket you pocketed your last ball in. Some places, sometimes you have to do both!

Hu

 

[DynoDan]

I was alone, avoiding trouble to avoid a fight and maybe a visit to a local jail which would probably result in a fine that happened to amount to everything I had on me. I was making a loop, from near Baton Rouge LA, up into Mississippi and Arkansas maybe a bit of Tennnessee or Alabama, then drop down to the gulf coast and follow it back west to get home again.

Most places had similar rules to what I played in bars in Baton Rouge but that trip across the upper part of the gulf coast states tried my patience so bad I never went thataway to gamble again! "Call everything." "You didn't call brushing the rail before it went in." "You didn't call hitting the inner rail." I am pretty sure I got called for running over the spot a time or two without calling it! I had to keep reminding myself that I was making money everywhere I found an action table. Might have been a few dollars or might have been pretty nice. Thing was, after learning one set of weird rules I would go two miles down the road and be met with a whole nuther set of rules!

One of my favorite "strange rules" was concerning the last ball and the eight when playing eight ball. Some places were just call the eight and pocket and it was legal. Some the object ball had to fall in the pocket first.

I have to admit that after a few road trips I delighted in catching strangers with the screwed up rules of my local bar. "That's not the way we do it in Houston!" "You aren't in Houston."

On the road I had learned never to pass up a pool table, a nothing looking spot might yield the biggest score of the trip. Mostly I just had to beat them with whatever rules they threw at me including some I knew they were creating on the spot and snickering at the dumb stranger. The dumb stranger was still winning more than he was losing and it was fun to catch them with their own rule later in the session. One thing I forgot about, the eight ball. Some places you have to bank the eight, some places you have to pocket the eight in the same pocket you pocketed your last ball in. Some places, sometimes you have to do both!

Hu

Reminds me of one snowbound xmas eve when several of us were gambling on a coin table, and because of the ongoing blizzard, the bar owner closed up early to get home to his family but left the adjoining room with the table unlocked. With no access to the cash register though (and thus no change), we pooled all our quarters and worked up new rules so as to stretch out the games. Can’t remember for sure, but I think we were calling EVERYTHING, banking everything, catching balls, playing last ball/pocket, etc, etc.,….you name it! I think it was morning before all the coins were finally gone (and the roads had been plowed, so we could leave).

 

[maha]

when you play in the bars for small stakes or in their little tournaments you usually have strange rules. so just go by them. and have fun.
when you go play golf with the guys/bad players, they take do overs and mulligans, and bump the ball everywhere. even when betting. do you get mad at that they arent playing by tournament rules?. if so you dont last long in the group.

if you get bigger pool action in a bar most all will set up the rules before you start.

 

[hang-the-9]

Over the long haul you are correct, but a lesser skilled player (than the others) can sometimes get lucky in ring games, if they get some fortunate rolls and they don’t get too greedy and get in/out at the right time, not unlike a poker game.

That is why to get a set Fargo rating you need 200 games in and not just the first set you play when someone puts you in the system. When I have to play someone with a spot, I would much rather play 8 ball than 9 ball. When it's an even game and a race to say 4 at least, I don't care which game it is. I don't want to play a 5-2 race even with a bad player that just needs a few crapped in 9 balls to win. In an 8-ball game, even if I mess up at the end of the run, there is a good chance I will still win the game due to them having to run out or try to play safes on me till they do run out. You make a mistake on the 8 or 9 in 9-ball and it's almost a guaranteed loss unless you get lucky.

 

[Island Drive]

OP, non-players get enjoyment out of just being at a table, talking and bumpin' em around. Often it's got Nothing to do with the game itself.

 

[CanadianGuy]

I've often encountered the misconception that ball in hand makes the games "too easy"
from the same people no less who could not run a table if given ball in hand one hundred times

hitting a rail after contact befuddles people (technically this rule could vanish imo just like snooker)

also seen scores of really bad players who play just often enough to think they are really good

a lifetime in Canada and I've never seen anything close to the cool bar room action I've read about here from guys like Keith, Matlock, etc......

 

[ChrisinNC]

OP, non-players get enjoyment out of just being at a table, talking and bumpin' em around. Often it's got Nothing to do with the game itself.

If that is true, then why do they seem to care so much about enforcement of the outdated rules they play by as opposed to just accepting and playing by sensible rules?

I have no problem with recreational 8 ball players who play slop and/or play cue ball behind the headstring on a scratch as long as the incoming player has a stripe/solid or an 8 ball to shoot at over the line, or can at least spot one of their balls that is behind the headstring.

But not allowing a player to spot their only object ball or 8 ball that is behind the headstring and requiring their opponent to kick down and back just to hit it makes absolutely no sense. The player that scratches is being rewarded for an ideal defensive shot, regardless of whether it is intentional or not.

 

[DeeDeeCues]

If that is true, then why do they seem to care so much about enforcement of the outdated rules they play by as opposed to just accepting and playing by sensible rules?

I have no problem with recreational 8 ball players who play slop and/or play cue ball behind the headstring on a scratch as long as the incoming player has a stripe/solid or an 8 ball to shoot at over the line, or can at least spot one of their balls that is behind the headstring.

But not allowing a player to spot their only object ball or 8 ball that is behind the headstring and requiring their opponent to kick down and back just to hit it makes absolutely no sense. The player that scratches is being rewarded for an ideal defensive shot, regardless of whether it is intentional or not.

Any competitive endeavor is governed by rules. The people you are talking about believe they are playing by the correct rules. Why shouldn't they believe that? Every tournament has different rules, case in point: where the nine ball is racked, or where you can break from. Or Earl wanting to eliminate side pockets.

It's your room, kick them out. You say it is a family friendly room, but so many of your posts are derogatory of your customers that it doesn't sound friendly to anyone.

 

[ChrisinNC]

Any competitive endeavor is governed by rules. The people you are talking about believe they are playing by the correct rules. Why shouldn't they believe that? Every tournament has different rules, case in point: where the nine ball is racked, or where you can break from. Or Earl wanting to eliminate side pockets.

It's your room, kick them out. You say it is a family friendly room, but so many of your posts are derogatory of your customers that it doesn't sound friendly to anyone.

I just like to vent on here, but believe me, I leave all our customers alone to have a pleasant experience and do whatever they like and play by whatever rules they choose, as long as they are not disrupting other customers or doing anything to potentially cause damage to the tables, the equipment or the facility.

And even then, as hard as it may be, I’ve learned to handle it very privately, discreetly and respectfully, so as not to embarrass or draw attention to them. As a non alcoholic grill / poolroom in a small market, I’m appreciative and respectful of all our customers, and can’t afford to lose any of them.

 

[DeeDeeCues]

I just like to vent on here, but believe me, I leave all our customers alone to have a pleasant experience and do whatever they like and play by whatever rules they choose, as long as they are not disrupting other customers or doing anything to potentially cause damage to the tables, the equipment or the facility.

And even then, as hard as it may be, I’ve learned to handle it very privately, discreetly and respectfully, so as not to embarrass or draw attention to them. As a non alcoholic grill / poolroom in a small market, I’m appreciative and respectful of all our customers, and can’t afford to lose any of them.

Cool.

 

[DynoDan]

If that is true, then why do they seem to care so much about enforcement of the outdated rules they play by as opposed to just accepting and playing by sensible rules?

I have no problem with recreational 8 ball players who play slop and/or play cue ball behind the headstring on a scratch as long as the incoming player has a stripe/solid or an 8 ball to shoot at over the line, or can at least spot one of their balls that is behind the headstring.

But not allowing a player to spot their only object ball or 8 ball that is behind the headstring and requiring their opponent to kick down and back just to hit it makes absolutely no sense. The player that scratches is being rewarded for an ideal defensive shot, regardless of whether it is intentional or not.

I agree. Because the ball made when scratching on a coin table can’t be retrieved/spotted, the traditional concept of ‘spot shot’ is just totally foreign to a generation that only played/learned on barboxes.

 

[tomatoshooter]

Proposed corrective action (Note: These steps must be performed in order)

Step 1: Ensure every bar in Poland and Taiwan has a pool table, and that the house rules there are close enough to WPA.

Step 2: Start World War III. Presumably, the current geopolitical dividing lines would make Poland and Taiwan major staging areas.

Step 3: Initiate a draft. This will put a large portion of the US bar age crowd from all over the country into these staging areas, areas that we've already groomed for 8-ball with proper rules to take place

Step 4: Win WW III (very important step), but only after our troops have had enough time to now prefer the WPA rule set for 8-ball

Step 5: Demobilize the troops, sending them back to into their own corners of the USA to spread the correct 8-ball rule set around

It's not to late to declare your candidacy for president.

 

[Sheldon]

While "bar rules" can be very unfair/ridiculous/hilarious

The only way they are unfair is if you get surprised by them, no? If both players know the rules isn't it fair by default?

 

[GoldCrown]

1960's..70's....My group spotted scratches/fouls...a ball came up. BIH behind the line. The closest ball to the line got spotted if no balls were over the line. Miss the 8 or scratch it's game.
Opponent did not have anywhere BIH for fouls/scratches.

 

[GoldCrown]

The only way they are unfair is if you get surprised by them, no? If both players know the rules isn't it fair by default?

Funny is when a player on the table next to you asks what is the rule when "this" just happened. I respond... Set the rules before starting the game.

 

[Sheldon]

Funny is when a player on the table next to you asks what is the rule when "this" just happened. I respond... Set the rules before starting the game.

This is why I like actually reading and researching rulesets. Then I can give them an informed answer.

 

[ChrisinNC]

1960's..70's....My group spotted scratches/fouls...a ball came up. BIH behind the line. The closest ball to the line got spotted if no balls were over the line. Miss the 8 or scratch it's game.
Opponent did not have anywhere BIH for fouls/scratches.

Miss making contact with 8-ball as loss of game is a brutal way to lose when your opponent still has 6-7 balls on the table as blockers.

Certainly makes you think twice about trying to run out early, unless you are confident you can complete the job.

Even non-intentionally one can still luck their way into putting you in a real bind, and intentionally they can really sew you up.

 

[maha]

as long as the rules are known by all parties, it makes it fair,

problem is those that come to the different venue want to bring their rules with them and think everyone should abide by them.

and most of those rules that are hated here also help the better player if he is smart enough to use them properly.

the key word is smart.

 

[ChrisinNC]

as long as the rules are known by all parties, it makes it fair,

problem is those that come to the different venue want to bring their rules with them and think everyone should abide by them.

and most of those rules that are hated here also help the better player if he is smart enough to use them properly.

the key word is smart.

And often those house rules are changed (temporarily) on the spot, to go against the outsider.

 

[maha]

yea chris, sometimes it happens. but most times you are stealing anyway so i just let it go.
playing game by game its no big deal.
when you are the outsider you have to climb a higher ladder. and also get out with the money.