Why do the Universal cues (that come with the Smart Shaft) have such low resale value

J

justinb386

Banned
I am curious why there is hardly any interest in the Universal cues (the higher end ones that came with the Universal Smart Shafts attached to them)?

They have very low resale values, and I wonder why.

Everytime I see a used one for sale (and that is very rare to see one for sale), there is never any interest from buyers out there.

Is it because they are not American made cues?

I have a feeling that they are not being made anymore, because I know that the smart shafts are no longer being made.

I am also curious if anyone knows where they (or were) made.

I seen European sites that have them for sale (in the links that I found below), so maybe they are made somewhere in Europe?

http://buffalo.nl/en/shop/billiards-1/pool-cues/pro-pool-cues/universal-cues

http://www.samleisure.co.uk/universal-pool-cues/

Maybe the Universal cues are more popular in Europe, because they are sponsored by European players.

Thanks for any opinions about the quality of their cues, and where they may have been made (if anyone knows).
 
i don't think these are the same shafts or are associated with bill stroud/universal smart shafts
 
justinb386 said:
I
They have very low resale values, and I wonder why.
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They don't seem that expensive to start with and they appear to be a production cue. I would imagine that most would not view them as collectable and much like driving a new car off the dealer's lot there can be a substantial depreciation.
 
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It seems like hardly anyone has heard of Universal cues, so I am guessing that is probably why they have a non existent resale value. Maybe they are much more popular in Europe. I used to shoot with a Universal Smart Shaft, and it played better than any other shaft I ever shot with. It had a really amazing hit. Maybe the Moori tip that come on the shafts had something to do with the great hit.

dr9ball said:
They don't seem that expensive to start with and they appear to be a production cue. I would imagine that most would not view them as collectable and much like driving a new car off the dealer's lot there can be a substantial depreciation.
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Bill Stroud created the Universal Smart Shaft - this was a shaft with two features, one is that it has piezoelectric cloth embedded in it to dampen vibration. For what reason I am not sure right now. I have one, it's decent. The second feature is that they were made so that the joint insert could be changed at will so that the shaft could fit any cue.

In China the company that made the shafts Taican, appropriated the Universal brand and started their own line of cues with it. Basically instead of Lucasi, in China the cues are called Universal cues. Same logo. The cues generally do NOT come with the Smart Shaft. They come with normal shafts.

Now I think that the Universal line in China is very divergent with any cues that were carried by Cue and Case under that name. I haven't really kept up with the huge amount of cue designs out there these past couple years. But I see lots of Universal cues here in China. My guess as to why they are not in the USA and thus relatively unknown has to do with the relationship between Taican and Cue and Case and not wanting to step on each other's toes or something like that.

As for resale value, two words, production and China. No matter what the product is those two things in combination usually drop the resale of items quite a bit for all but the best brands. Regardless of whether the quality is pretty good or not if a cue is from China it's looked down on by a lot of folks. That's just the reality of the market. If you want a good cue to play with that functions well and is a good bargain then there are some excellent cues coming out of China now with some great inlays and very good construction. But don't buy them looking to resell them for anywhere near what you paid. Unlike decent custom cues production cues and especially Chinese ones don't hold value.
 
justinb386 said:
It seems like hardly anyone has heard of Universal cues, so I am guessing that is probably why they have a non existent resale value. Maybe they are much more popular in Europe. I used to shoot with a Universal Smart Shaft, and it played better than any other shaft I ever shot with. It had a really amazing hit. Maybe the Moori tip that come on the shafts had something to do with the great hit.
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They do seem to be quite popular over here in Europe, especially with being endorsed by Ralf Souquet (he has his own signature range).
I haven't tried one myself but I have friends who play that have and they've said the shafts are extremely similar to a Predator 314-2, main difference is the cost!

EDIT - The top end one they seem to do in the Souquet range works out at about $750.
 
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I will be receiving the Universal UN-40 Pool Cue (in the link below), and the billiard warehouse notes that the cues does come the the Universal Smart Shaft, so I really hope that you are wrong about the Universal Cues coming standard with just a regular maple shaft. The only reason I ordered the cue was for the Universal Smart Shaft. The Smart Shafts really have an amazing hit. I really love them.

http://www.billiardwarehouse.com/cues/lucasi/universal-un40-pool-cue.htm

JB Cases said:
Bill Stroud created the Universal Smart Shaft - this was a shaft with two features, one is that it has piezoelectric cloth embedded in it to dampen vibration. For what reason I am not sure right now. I have one, it's decent. The second feature is that they were made so that the joint insert could be changed at will so that the shaft could fit any cue.

In China the company that made the shafts Taican, appropriated the Universal brand and started their own line of cues with it. Basically instead of Lucasi, in China the cues are called Universal cues. Same logo. The cues generally do NOT come with the Smart Shaft. They come with normal shafts.

Now I think that the Universal line in China is very divergent with any cues that were carried by Cue and Case under that name. I haven't really kept up with the huge amount of cue designs out there these past couple years. But I see lots of Universal cues here in China. My guess as to why they are not in the USA and thus relatively unknown has to do with the relationship between Taican and Cue and Case and not wanting to step on each other's toes or something like that.

As for resale value, two words, production and China. No matter what the product is those two things in combination usually drop the resale of items quite a bit for all but the best brands. Regardless of whether the quality is pretty good or not if a cue is from China it's looked down on by a lot of folks. That's just the reality of the market. If you want a good cue to play with that functions well and is a good bargain then there are some excellent cues coming out of China now with some great inlays and very good construction. But don't buy them looking to resell them for anywhere near what you paid. Unlike decent custom cues production cues and especially Chinese ones don't hold value.
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Hrm, the link you posted to your cue has an insert with 4 windows talking about the Universal Smart shaft. There is a big black box over the first window, I wonder what they don't want to advertise.
 
Yeah, lol, I was wondering the same thing, but I do not really care, because I love the Smart Shaft.

PaulieB said:
Hrm, the link you posted to your cue has an insert with 4 windows talking about the Universal Smart shaft. There is a big black box over the first window, I wonder what they don't want to advertise.
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PaulieB said:
Hrm, the link you posted to your cue has an insert with 4 windows talking about the Universal Smart shaft. There is a big black box over the first window, I wonder what they don't want to advertise.
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i'm guessing that window may have featured the USS adapter(s)
 
PaulieB said:
Hrm, the link you posted to your cue has an insert with 4 windows talking about the Universal Smart shaft. There is a big black box over the first window, I wonder what they don't want to advertise.
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They don't want you to see the 12 year old Chinese kid that makes the shafts. :eek:
 
measureman said:
They don't want you to see the 12 year old Chinese kid that makes the shafts. :eek:
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that old?! nah, by then, China has them bred for other things (pool schools, dumpling schools, math schools, harder math schools). they leave the shafts to the 5-6 year olds
 
justinb386 said:
I will be receiving the Universal UN-40 Pool Cue (in the link below), and the billiard warehouse notes that the cues does come the the Universal Smart Shaft, so I really hope that you are wrong about the Universal Cues coming standard with just a regular maple shaft. The only reason I ordered the cue was for the Universal Smart Shaft. The Smart Shafts really have an amazing hit. I really love them.

http://www.billiardwarehouse.com/cues/lucasi/universal-un40-pool-cue.htm
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I meant the ones sold here in China, which are made by the same company that made the one you are buying, and bearing the Universal logo don't come with the Smart Shaft.

I am sure BW's stock has the shaft with it if that's what they advertised.

What I was really trying to convey is that there are Universal Smart Shafts and Universal cues and that per my experience here the Universal cues don't come with the Smart Shafts. I don't know how it works for the European market. I really am now getting into deeper water than I intended because I haven't been paying a lot of attention to Universal these past couple years.

I am sure you will be very happy with your cue though. My USS-shaft plays well.
 
bstroud said:
The Universal cues are a cheap Chinese cue.

They are not associated with the Universal Smart Shaft.

Bill Stroud
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Thanks for chiming in Bill. (I think there are a few threads here begging for your comments btw.)

The thing is that the Universal brand name is being associated with the Universal Smart Shaft at least in Europe. Below is a description of the cue lifted from one of the links above.

Universal Souquet Series 111-1
This stunning cue has a grey stained curly maple forearm with a thick ebony ring at its base. The forearm contains 3 elongated, floating ivorine sword inlays with ebony veneers; each sword contains decorative cocobolo and 'abalone shell' inlays.
There are double silver nickel, ebony and ivorine rings either side of the finest quality polished Irish linen grip, with a mirror finished stainless steel joint bracketed by 2 thick silver nickel rings.
The unique radial pin provides advanced contact between the butt and shaft, which minimizes vibration and provides the ultimate in balance and control. Combined with the Kamui tip and steel joint, this cue produces a very firm hit, which provides extra confidence and feel when playing every shot.
This cue features the Low Squirt (LS) version of the Universal SmartShaft. It has an 8 piece radial construction with an XTC ferrule and space age, piezoelectric fabric designed to produce less deflection and increase accuracy.

I bolded the relevant part.

This is the logo they are using and it's the same as what's used here in China and the cues are the same all coming from Taican.

universal.png


So for consumers it appears that at least in Europe the cues are being sold with the SmartShafts.
 
Chopdoc said:
That would seem to be the final word on the matter.

.
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It would have been except for the fact that Universal is brand of cues that IS associated with the Universal Smart Shaft in the product descriptions.

It's kind of like me talking about Instroke now when I have been gone from brand for almost a decade. I can only speak authoritatively about what went on when I was actively on board. What they do now, what the quality level is, what the models are, who they do business with etc.... is pretty much all beyond my knowledge other than being an outsider looking in same as most everyone else. Sure I have a little bit of an "in" so to speak in that the billiard industry is smallish and sometimes we share clients but even though I founded Instroke and designed just about all the models they still make my association with them is long gone.

Maybe Bill will say something but it's my understanding that although he did create the Smart Shaft he doesn't have anything to do with the Universal brand. I welcome correction as do the consumers.
 
If you look at the last 2 Universal cues (in the link below), than you can clearly see that they come with the Universal Smart Shaft (with the same exact matching ring work).

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=293895&highlight=universal+cues

So at least the higher end Universal cues (that retailed in the $800 price range) did in fact come with the Universal Smart shaft (as you can see in the link above). Maybe the Chinese are starting to make a high quality cue, so maybe you are wrong about them being cheap cues.

bstroud said:
The Universal cues are a cheap Chinese cue.

They are not associated with the Universal Smart Shaft.

Bill Stroud
Click to expand...
 
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