Why don't all cuemakers line up ring work at the joint?

normally i agree but not here sorry. atristic eye??? comeone. its laziness or lack of knowledge.

ok since im the artist for now on every cue i make i will not face any joints so my cue flops around on the table like a fish. if i see it as "straight" as the artist its ok? sorry

if certin makers want to settle for mediocrity let them. more money in my perfectly aligned pockets
 
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manwon said:
Please tell me who made the rules, who was the first person to implement them as a standard, and where this was started?
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I'm not sure about the who, the when, or where...but I would imagine it was around the time when a customer was forced to ask for the points in his cue to be even.
 
It's like peanutbutter with no jelly. It works just fine but isn't very sweet.

Seriously, rings are hard work & time consuming. Worse yet, they are 110% cosmetic, not structurally required. Not lining them up at the end is like doing half the job. It makes no sense to me. Why go through the pain of decorating with rings if i'm not going to line them up? For me it's a standard, not an option. As mentioned, it's kinda like even points & well proportioned inlays & such. Of course it makes no structural difference but it sure makes the buyer feel like they got something worth having. It makes them feel content & gratified with the money they spent. I used to buy cues before I was a builder. I know what struck my fancy & those are things I strive for in the cues I build. To each their own. All I can do is state my own thoughts. We need variety. I don't understand the builders' logic that don't do it. But I don't judge them for it, either. Lord knows I do some things that they may not understand or agree with. It's a good thing. It gives buyers a wide range of choices.
 
dave sutton said:
normally i agree but not here sorry. atristic eye??? comeone. its lazyness or lack of knowledge.

ok since im the artist for now on every cue i make i will not face any joints so my cue flopps around on the tanle like a fish. if i see it as "straight" as the artist its ok? sorry

if certin makers want to settle for mediocrity let them. more money in my perfectly alined pockets
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And to the CMs who will settle with conformity because that is the way that everyone else does it, they are more than welcome to their safe little haven of comfort in commonality. Enjoy building your cookie-cutter cues.

Look, you all can build cues anyway you want, it doesn't affect me in the least. But please don't expect all the other CMs in the world to jump on your band-wagon and follow suit. It's NEVER been a ride that I've had any interest in taking.

The very idea of making a determination of a CMs skill level simply because of 'their choice' of ring placement is pathetic. It's not about laziness and it's not about lack of knowledge. If you truly believe that then you have something yet to learn. It IS about choice and personal preference. It's about having the freedom to build cues as you see fit without being dictated to by a small select group who feel that doing 'it' their way is the only way. What's equally pathetic is that half of this select little group aren't even CMs. What a mis-guided ego trip they must be on. I wouldn't let half of these critics chalk my cue let alone tell me how to build cues.

If you don't have the ability to think or act outside of the box, then please tell me, who is it that you go to for your creativity?
You can follow the herd or you can start a new herd; even if it's a herd of one.

Dave, your pockets my be "perfectly alined" (aligned) but your spelling is atrocious. But I guess that's what you mean by "lazyness or lack of knowledge." (laziness)
 
Since I posted my reasons I don't line them up from shaft to butt on every cue, I have still read several dogmatic statements saying they should always line up initially no matter what. Seems some people can never accept anything that goes against their grain. Having interchangeable shafts and 12 slots of silver, being able to pick your shafts on the spot and never having to send your cue in, in order to get a new shaft, seems like enough benefits that these dogmatic statements should go away.
 
KJ Cues said:
And to the CMs who will settle with conformity because that is the way that everyone else does it, they are more than welcome to their safe little haven of comfort in commonality. Enjoy building your cookie-cutter cues.

Look, you all can build cues anyway you want, it doesn't affect me in the least. But please don't expect all the other CMs in the world to jump on your band-wagon and follow suit. It's NEVER been a ride that I've had any interest in taking.

The very idea of making a determination of a CMs skill level simply because of 'their choice' of ring placement is pathetic. It's not about laziness and it's not about lack of knowledge. If you truly believe that then you have something yet to learn. It IS about choice and personal preference. It's about having the freedom to build cues as you see fit without being dictated to by a small select group who feel that doing 'it' their way is the only way. What's equally pathetic is that half of this select little group aren't even CMs. What a mis-guided ego trip they must be on. I wouldn't let half of these critics chalk my cue let alone tell me how to build cues.

If you don't have the ability to think or act outside of the box, then please tell me, who is it that you go to for your creativity?
You can follow the herd or you can start a new herd; even if it's a herd of one.

Dave, your pockets my be "perfectly alined" (aligned) but your spelling is atrocious. But I guess that's what you mean by "lazyness or lack of knowledge." (laziness)
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Amen!

Dick
 
cueman said:
Since I posted my reasons I don't line them up from shaft to butt on every cue, I have still read several dogmatic statements saying they should always line up initially no matter what. Seems some people can never accept anything that goes against their grain. Having interchangeable shafts and 12 slots of silver, being able to pick your shafts on the spot and never having to send your cue in, in order to get a new shaft, seems like enough benefits that these dogmatic statements should go away.
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Another, Amen!

Dick
 
cueman said:
Since I posted my reasons I don't line them up from shaft to butt on every cue, I have still read several dogmatic statements saying they should always line up initially no matter what. Seems some people can never accept anything that goes against their grain. Having interchangeable shafts and 12 slots of silver, being able to pick your shafts on the spot and never having to send your cue in, in order to get a new shaft, seems like enough benefits that these dogmatic statements should go away.
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It is not dogma, but a standard, a prerequisite for most before they will even pick up a cue to chalk. For me, not only should the ring work match, but in certian circumstances the ring work should align with the points as well. Esoteric maybe, but you either got me or you don't need me. Either way is fine by me.
 
qbilder said:
It's like peanutbutter with no jelly. It works just fine but isn't very sweet.
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I've heard that some even like(d) peanutbutter & bananas. Not exactly my cup of tea (or sandwich), but there you go; individuality and personal choice. Mike Webb uses a word for this type of discussion that I find to be very appropriate; "acceptance". We might all do well to try some.
 
KJ Cues said:
I've heard that some even like(d) peanutbutter & bananas. Not exactly my cup of tea (or sandwich), but there you go; individuality and personal choice. Mike Webb uses a word for this type of discussion that I find to be very appropriate; "acceptance". We might all do well to try some.
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You definitely are not from Georgia if you have never had Banana and Peanut Butter sandwiches. Try one sometime, you might like it. :)
But make sure you line up all the banana slices with each other or it may not taste right. :grin:
 
I inlay the rings on my shafts after they are threaded. I screw the shaft to the butt and mark a line where the rings should line up. I then start them slightly before that mark in hopes that a few months down the road, they will still line up.

However, if others don't want their rings to align, that is their choice. I'm not going to come on here and knock them as some have chosen to do. It's bad enough that we have the experts here that like to take their shots whenever they can, but a cue maker bashing another cue maker just because they don't do things the same way is pretty pathetic.
 
Tony Zinzola said:
I inlay the rings on my shafts after they are threaded.* I screw the shaft to the butt and mark a line where the rings should line up.* I then start them slightly before that mark in hopes that a few months down the road, they will still line up.However, if others don't want their rings to align, that is their choice.* I'm not going to come on here and knock them as some have chosen to do.* It's bad enough that we have the experts here that like to take their shots whenever they can, but a cue maker bashing another cue maker just because they don't do things the same way is pretty pathetic.
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You are right, there is a lot of pathetic stuff showing up lately.
 
Tony Zinzola said:
I inlay the rings on my shafts after they are threaded. I screw the shaft to the butt and mark a line where the rings should line up. I then start them slightly before that mark in hopes that a few months down the road, they will still line up.

However, if others don't want their rings to align, that is their choice. I'm not going to come on here and knock them as some have chosen to do. It's bad enough that we have the experts here that like to take their shots whenever they can, but a cue maker bashing another cue maker just because they don't do things the same way is pretty pathetic.
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Good post Tony.
 
Sugar

cueman said:
You definitely are not from Georgia if you have never had Banana and Peanut Butter sandwiches. Try one sometime, you might like it. :)
But make sure you line up all the banana slices with each other or it may not taste right. :grin:
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You'all need to sprinkle a little powdered sugar on them PB&B sandwhiches!!
Mmmm Good!
Dan
 
hangemhigh said:
It is not dogma, but a standard, a prerequisite for most before they will even pick up a cue to chalk. For me, not only should the ring work match, but in certian circumstances the ring work should align with the points as well. Esoteric maybe, but you either got me or you don't need me. Either way is fine by me.
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I consider a cue nothing more than a tool for moving a ball around. I build them for that express purpose and that purpose only. I would like these tools to look nice but I don't go out of my way, spending a lot of time on small cosmetic details that raise the price of this tool. I always align all of my rings in the butt with the points and always have. This takes no more time to do. I don't take the time to align the rings between shaft and joint as this does take time, no knowledge as some would like others to believe but it does take time. If someone who orders a cue from me they can certainly have these rings aligned if they prefer but they will pay extra for the time involved, even if it's only five minutes. With this being said, in the last 20 years and more than a 1000 cues built, I have never been asked to align these rings between joint and shaft and have never had a comment about them not being aligned. If you feel that these rings must be aligned that's absolutely fine with me. Find cue makers who will accommodate you. There are many who will and all who can. Those who feel that a cue maker is building a sub par tool because these rings are not aligned are absolutely clueless about playing cues construction and I'm glad that I don't have to deal with them. Most of these fellows are the same ones who want all the additional detail but then want you to knock the price down.

Dick
 
Why don't all

Hey, my single silver ring cues always line up. Maybe that's why Mr. Bushka used it so much.
Second, since I don't have an original Szam laying around, do his.
Inquiring minds want to know.
 
rhncue said:
I consider a cue nothing more than a tool for moving a ball around. I build them for that express purpose and that purpose only. I would like these tools to look nice but I don't go out of my way, spending a lot of time on small cosmetic details that raise the price of this tool. I always align all of my rings in the butt with the points and always have. This takes no more time to do. I don't take the time to align the rings between shaft and joint as this does take time, no knowledge as some would like others to believe but it does take time. If someone who orders a cue from me they can certainly have these rings aligned if they prefer but they will pay extra for the time involved, even if it's only five minutes. With this being said, in the last 20 years and more than a 1000 cues built, I have never been asked to align these rings between joint and shaft and have never had a comment about them not being aligned. If you feel that these rings must be aligned that's absolutely fine with me. Find cue makers who will accommodate you. There are many who will and all who can. Those who feel that a cue maker is building a sub par tool because these rings are not aligned are absolutely clueless about playing cues construction and I'm glad that I don't have to deal with them. Most of these fellows are the same ones who want all the additional detail but then want you to knock the price down.

Dick
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20 years ago there wasn't near as many cue makers as today. In that 20 year span the bar has been raised considerably. There are a few who seek to be the best they can be in every aspect of cue building, not dismissing any thing as extra work, but providing more than anyone could ever expect. Not only is that type of effort expected, it is rewarded handsomely. You do not have to participate, but in all fairness to you and others, you should be kept abreast on new trends.
 
Double Ringwork

There are a lot of ways to skin a cat and a lot of different ways to build a cue joint.

In all fairness to everyone; if a customer demands that all his ringwork line up then he should be sure to let the cuemaker know because some just don't feel that it is important.

I always have lined up my ringwork. Here is one of the ways I like to do it so that the customer can purchase an aftermarket shaft if he is so inclined without worrying about the ringwork matching.
 

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