Why not a 527 in straight pool??

T

tommyceilings

The Netherland Nihilator
Silver Member
With I think it being believed that both Danny and John having put up huge runs in SP, I'm wondering why can't a table the same way Willie played on it be set up somewhere and for 1 month both players can alternate access to the table with one day on and one day off.

What kind of action do you think from the pool world that would get on beating Willie.

Would it be like a boxing match, pick the day, would it be doesn't do it, but hits a certain number

Also, why not start taking money from every entry fee of anything related to SP, and start a fund for whoever breaks Willie's record. I can't take credit for that, someone touched on the idea earlier in another thread. There are plenty of reputable people and the fund could get quite large, like a break and run. You also have to ship an amount to try the run each time if the table is found to be of acceptable proportions.

If you do it that way you could involve people like the Cobra guy who certifies the table and cloth, someone who certifies the rack and balls, and an official scorekeeper and videographer.

Thoughts?
 
Someone is sure to point out that it has been broken, in practice, just wasn't in front of witnesses.
So let's get that out of the way. We'll rephrase... "why hasn't 526 been broken publicly?"

Well, Schmidt has said he doesn't have the motivation. He feels only a handful of people will care,
and there's no financial incentive (though if someone wants to start a kitty, I'm in).

He named a price in another thread that would motivate him to lock himself in a basement and just dedicate
his time to breaking it, but I can't recall the number. Like 50k?

But realistically, if you make it like the world's most boring job,
most players will probably quit unless the money is just impossibly good.

So, other than the time & money angle, why hasn't it been broken yet?

• only a handful of people in the world have the skill to do it.

• there's a good chunk of luck involved. Every break shot could have a horrible roll end it.
Just getting the opportunity to run that many, is like flipping heads 10 times in a row.
Let's say there's only a 2% chance of something horrible happening to end the run in any rack.
After 34 racks, that would mean you're about 50/50 to have your run end at some point.
Mosconi's run was 37+ racks.

• 8 foot is probably an ideal size for straight pool... small enough that long shots aren't much of an issue,
but not so small that the clustering is just too much to deal with. But player have
too much pride to try to break records on a nonstandard 'compact' table, they want
to break it on modern equipment so it's more relevant and impressive.
 
CreeDo said:
• 8 foot is probably an ideal size for straight pool... small enough that long shots aren't much of an issue,
but not so small that the clustering is just too much to deal with. But player have
too much pride to try to break records on a nonstandard 'compact' table, they want
to break it on modern equipment so it's more relevant and impressive.
Click to expand...

Mosconi's record of 526 was on an eight footer so making 527 on a nine footer would not break Mosconi's record but set a new one, albeit for nine footers.
 
The several players that years ago ran over 300 on a 5x10 is more impressive to me then a 526 on a 4x8.
 
measureman said:
The several players that years ago ran over 300 on a 5x10 is more impressive to me then a 526 on a 4x8.
Click to expand...

Could you name the players who run over 300 on a 10 footer? Irving Crane being the only one I know of.

Willie played on many tables including 10 footers. So he really could not help they had a 8' table at the venue. His only thing I ever heard he required was a Brunswick, as it was his sponsor. But 14.1 gets a little crowded on an 8' table, so there is also disadvantages.

Actually, looking at Billiards digest, Mosconi also run 309 balls on a 10 footer. Weird that it is the same amount Irving Crane run. Source http://www.billiardsdigest.com/new_current_issue/apr_10/untold_4.php
 
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Mosconi and Crane come to mind. I had read that Willie ran 368 on a 5x10.
Maybe someone else will chime in on 300+ runs on a 5x10. I did say several had done it. I'm thinking not more then a hand full.
 
I don't want to get away from the main topic.

Run 527 on an 8 foot table same conditions. I'm not going to try to debate if 9 or 10ft table is tougher or the pockets are not set up right. Trying to think of the same dimensions Willie did it on since it's the Gold Standard, and do it again.
 
measureman said:
Mosconi and Crane come to mind. I had read that Willie ran 368 on a 5x10.
Maybe someone else will chime in on 300+ runs on a 5x10. I did say several had done it. I'm thinking not more then a hand full.
Click to expand...

Greenleaf not sure how many tho. I think those are the only 3.
 
measureman said:
I found a site that said Greenleaf ran 287 but did not say the size table.
Probably 5x10 but ?
Click to expand...

276 for Greenleaf on 5x10 according to the Billiards Digest article. 309 for Mosconi, and 309 for Irving Crane.

I wanted to add, today's players should feel lucky these guys are not still around lol...
 
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tommyceilings said:
I don't want to get away from the main topic.

Run 527 on an 8 foot table same conditions. I'm not going to try to debate if 9 or 10ft table is tougher or the pockets are not set up right. Trying to think of the same dimensions Willie did it on since it's the Gold Standard, and do it again.
Click to expand...

I think today's players would need an incentive to even try. But records are meant to be broken. If Mosconi was still around, a young man, and in his prime, he might even demolish that record if he had a lot of incentive to do so.
 
tommyceilings said:
With I think it being believed that both Danny and John having put up huge runs in SP, I'm wondering why can't a table the same way Willie played on it be set up somewhere and for 1 month both players can alternate access to the table with one day on and one day off.

What kind of action do you think from the pool world that would get on beating Willie.

Would it be like a boxing match, pick the day, would it be doesn't do it, but hits a certain number

Also, why not start taking money from every entry fee of anything related to SP, and start a fund for whoever breaks Willie's record. I can't take credit for that, someone touched on the idea earlier in another thread. There are plenty of reputable people and the fund could get quite large, like a break and run. You also have to ship an amount to try the run each time if the table is found to be of acceptable proportions.

If you do it that way you could involve people like the Cobra guy who certifies the table and cloth, someone who certifies the rack and balls, and an official scorekeeper and videographer.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...


I really don't know.

But I do know this: going up to a 10' table changes things dramatically in terms of the needed ball pocketing accuracy and, of course, bigger CB movement for decent position play. I think stepping down to an 8' table presents similar, but different, challenges in terms of demanding more precision in positional play, break ball knowledge, and being able to bump into balls with greater control.

IOW, I'm not so sure that trying to run balls on an 8 footer is that much of a treat. The balls are going to clog up more, so you need greater depth of knowledge to get them open and stay in control. Willie was used to playing all on all different kinds of equipment, so he was good with whatever he came across, from room to room.

Lou Figueroa
 
I will definitely say that playing straight pool on a 10 footer will definitely teach you the correct way to play the game especially towards the end of the rack. Your patterns have to be much tighter so you don't have to rely so much on shot making ability to get on the break ball which sometimes you can get away with on the 9 footer. Also, just in general your shot selection will be dictated by your ability to reach shots which leads to more angled break shots resulting in a greater yield of the break. If you are fortunate enough to get some time on a 10 footer it will for sure let you know if you are playing the game correctly.
 
lfigueroa said:
I really don't know.

But I do know this: going up to a 10' table changes things dramatically in terms of the needed ball pocketing accuracy and, of course, bigger CB movement for decent position play. I think stepping down to an 8' table presents similar, but different, challenges in terms of demanding more precision in positional play, break ball knowledge, and being able to bump into balls with greater control.

IOW, I'm not so sure that trying to run balls on an 8 footer is that much of a treat. The balls are going to clog up more, so you need greater depth of knowledge to get them open and stay in control. Willie was used to playing all on all different kinds of equipment, so he was good with whatever he came across, from room to room.

Lou Figueroa
Click to expand...

Here is a quote from Marop in another thread. "Schmidt ran a 180+ on a Diamond Bar box in the OB booth with a borrowed cue at the Expo while he was just fooling around, he didn't even have a glove on, lol. He also ran a similar number (170 to 190, I can't remember the exact number) in the OB booth at the BCA."
 
measureman said:
The several players that years ago ran over 300 on a 5x10 is more impressive to me then a 526 on a 4x8.
Click to expand...

I bet they got a free water or two out of the deal too... Why is it more impressive? I would be more impressed at a high run on a bar table then anything else.
 
nine_ball6970 said:
Here is a quote from Marop in another thread. "Schmidt ran a 180+ on a Diamond Bar box in the OB booth with a borrowed cue at the Expo while he was just fooling around, he didn't even have a glove on, lol. He also ran a similar number (170 to 190, I can't remember the exact number) in the OB booth at the BCA."
Click to expand...


While very nice runs, he didn't exactly threaten any records, now did he, lol :-)

Lou Figueroa
 
RunoutJJ said:
I bet they got a free water or two out of the deal too... Why is it more impressive? I would be more impressed at a high run on a bar table then anything else.
Click to expand...

Have you ever played on a 5x10? I have and it's real tough.
 
Somebody mentioned it must be worth the players while to try.

I think from the table, cloth, balls, stick they use, maybe a bottled water company, all put up some funds, and any fees from the user trying to break the record go in the pot.

Something no one has addressed which I asked, how do you think the action would be. Picture one or 2 tables, and while I don't know any SP aficionados who gamble large amounts, I think there would be a good amount on if someone got out of a rack, total scores, etc.
 
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