Why pay to recover table

deanoc said:
why pay....
to get it done right the first time
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I do however agree that paying to get it done right the first time can also be a major gamble, like the OP mentioned...he may just start charging others for the same work he did on his own pool table thus...adding another name to the list of hacks already taking money from unsuspecting customers whom are looking to hire a "Pro" to work on their pool table....as if that list isn't already long enough as it is.
 
Kevin3824 said:
Makes a person wonder what it really takes to call yourself a pool table mechanic and start doing it for profit? At least with auto mechanics there is a certification process. I could never understand how an auto mechanic can charge 65 an hour without even a high school diploma and you see managers at McDonalds making 30-40k a year with masters degrees in restaurant management.
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I think auto mechanics are under paid. How many jobs do you need to spend a minimum of $60k in tools just to get started and more every year as manufacturers build cars that are always requiring the use of new tools The schooling needed never stops, a good mechanic has to keep up with the new technology. Of course it also depends on the kind of mechanic you are referring too, just like with pool tables there are hacks "who work on cars" but rarely fix them. I agree with you that "parts changers" are over paid mechanics but the guys that really understand how cars and their related systems work are under paid, one thing a real good mechanic has is job security, he could get fired or quit in the morning and have an equal or better paying job by that afternoon.
 
fastone371 said:
I think auto mechanics are under paid. How many jobs do you need to spend a minimum of $60k in tools just to get started and more every year as manufacturers build cars that are always requiring the use of new tools The schooling needed never stops, a good mechanic has to keep up with the new technology. Of course it also depends on the kind of mechanic you are referring too, just like with pool tables there are hacks "who work on cars" but rarely fix them. I agree with you that "parts changers" are over paid mechanics but the guys that really understand how cars and their related systems work are under paid, one thing a real good mechanic has is job security, he could get fired or quit in the morning and have an equal or better paying job by that afternoon.
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I agree with you 100%. A potential customer of mine don't have to like me in order to hire me but, I do however have to not dislike the customer, or they'll never have enough money to hire me because I do have the ability to pick and choose which jobs I take on because my waiting list will always be longer than my ability to catch up.
 
realkingcobra said:
Where's those pictures of your table:thumbup:
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Here's my work. Man you should see the modifications I did to this baby. Level as hell after 2 years too!!!

I would never think of calling in anyone, I'm really proud of how I do things!! :wink:

JC

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mvp said:
It makes me sick what people are paying to setup tables, I think I might take this on as a side job. People really should try and do this themselves at least once before calling a installer. I'm really anal when it comes to setting up mine and my friends table from using machinest levels on the frame work, then the slate. Corner squares for 90* corners and straight edges for the side rails. The hardest part is folding the rails. Which I think someone could easily skip the rails if they were scared to mess up the first time.
Try it once!!!! Level, square,cover with cloth! Watch YouTube if you need, only takes a few hours. Enough pool league guys at least 1 of em knows how to do it, have him help you, play on his table setup for a season then strip it down and do it to your standards! My rant is over! Please carry on
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I feel exactly the same way about appendectomies.
 
mvp said:
It makes me sick what people are paying to setup tables, I think I might take this on as a side job. People really should try and do this themselves at least once before calling a installer. I'm really anal when it comes to setting up mine and my friends table from using machinest levels on the frame work, then the slate. Corner squares for 90* corners and straight edges for the side rails. The hardest part is folding the rails. Which I think someone could easily skip the rails if they were scared to mess up the first time.
Try it once!!!! Level, square,cover with cloth! Watch YouTube if you need, only takes a few hours. Enough pool league guys at least 1 of em knows how to do it, have him help you, play on his table setup for a season then strip it down and do it to your standards! My rant is over! Please carry on
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There are a numbers of good reasons not to do it yourself, #1 being if you F/U a cut of Simonis you are out some $300.00 trying to "save money". As far as learning how to recover your table on the interweb, how do you know the people you are watching know what they are doing? By the assumption nobody has ever been wrong on the interweb???? I earn far more money in my garage at home doing side jobs than I will spend recovering my table which actually makes it a bargain for me to have someone do it, many people who excel at their trade should be able to do the same. As far as who does my table it will only be someone highly recommended by the forums here. I set my table up the first time, it turned out nice but I think it could be even nicer, thats why I am willing to pay someone to do it.

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That is the popular Simonis green on my table, not blue/green as it looks, color always turns out funny, maybe its the big florescent light?
 
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I was just looking at new felt and was thinking I could probably do it myself. I'm am extremely mechanically inclined. I tie my own fishing flies, lures, build fishing rods, do most of my mechanical work on my jeep, home repairs, furniture repair, etc.

I like doing things myself because often I do it better because its mine and I take the time to do right.

I also totally get having things done, so its right, especially if I screw it up could be v costly or result in permanent damage.

So I'm still on the fence.

How often do you guys replace your felt? If I replaced my felt every other year or more I would absolutely learn to do it myself.

If I had to pay $300 you can bet ur arse I'd do it myself, even if I screwed it up and had to buy all new felt. I got a friend who told me if I help pull staples from rails he'd charge me $75 I didn't want to pay that.
 
realkingcobra said:
I agree with you 100%. A potential customer of mine don't have to like me in order to hire me but, I do however have to not dislike the customer, or they'll never have enough money to hire me because I do have the ability to pick and choose which jobs I take on because my waiting list will always be longer than my ability to catch up.
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This is the entire issue in a nutshell. I know you are one of the best mechanics in the world, however, it is almost impossible to find someone that is even decent, so why not learn to do it yourself? Ive watched two sets of guys work on my table in the last two months. The first team were absolute hacks, and the second guy was better but not great. We all dont want to, or cant, wait for a proper mechanic to choose us as their customer, so what are we to do? Pay incompetent people to do inferior work, or learn to do it ourselves and at least get it done, as well, for less money? The answer is obvious to me.
 
strmanglr scott said:
I was just looking at new felt and was thinking I could probably do it myself. I'm am extremely mechanically inclined. I tie my own fishing flies, lures, build fishing rods, do most of my mechanical work on my jeep, home repairs, furniture repair, etc.

I like doing things myself because often I do it better because its mine and I take the time to do right.

I also totally get having things done, so its right, especially if I screw it up could be v costly or result in permanent damage.

So I'm still on the fence.

How often do you guys replace your felt? If I replaced my felt every other year or more I would absolutely learn to do it myself.

If I had to pay $300 you can bet ur arse I'd do it myself, even if I screwed it up and had to buy all new felt. I got a friend who told me if I help pull staples from rails he'd charge me $75 I didn't want to pay that.
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I guess it depends on how much you play, how well you maintain the table and when you think you need it changed. I think if you properly maintain your table, keep it covered when not in use and play 10-20 hours a week, you can easily go 5 years between recovering and your cloth will still be in better condition than the cloth at a pool hall that has been on the table for a year. Maybe significantly more.

Of course, if you play in a lot of high end tournaments and want your table with like-new cloth all the time, you are going to have to recover it more often.

And I wonder if it really costs you $300 to get it done properly. When you factor in the retail cost to you of 9' Simonis (say $330 plus taxes) if you get someone to do it for $500 (probably "taxes in" for cash) it might really cost you $150.
 
A friend and I took at stab at setting up my own table. Not really "being cheap" but really to see if we could do it. I had recently "restored" an old Diamond Pro myself. I don't know if restored is the right word but the top was a rosewood color dymondwood but the skirt and legs were more of an natural oak color. Sand them all down, stained them to match the top. It came out great... so I figured, F it may as well set it up myself too.

I got some good tips from Steve Leistikow, bought a nice machinist level, a staple gun and some bondo and gave it a try.

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Overall, it came out fine. It's not the worst table I've played on. It's pretty close to perfectly level. Balls don't roll off. Putting cloth on the rails was by far the hardest part. Especially over the pocket facings. They're not perfect but they're fine. The only bad part though is the slates. There's a tiny bump in the bondo that I didn't feel with my hand but can see it when a ball is moving super slow over it.

Also in one place, the cloth isn't as tight as I'd like it to be... I should probably take the rails off, pull it tighter and re-staple but it's not a big deal.

Next time, I'll let a pro do it. It's a lot of work and not easy but it was a fun challenge. I'm glad the table plays good enough that it doesn't bother me to play on so, it's fine until I need to replace the cloth.
 
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I enjoy doing my own work too, although I don't own a table and will probably never need to cover one. I do all my own carpentry, electrical and plumbing (completely re-wired two homes and re-plumbed one). Early in my adult life I had a few experiences where I hired a "pro" and got a horrible result. I figured "I've got an 8th grade diploma...I'll figure out how to do it myself."

The problem occurs when you open "it" up and find out that the last person to work on it did a hachet-job (that's like a hachet-knot: the only way to untie it is with a hachet :D). Now you have to confront problems that aren't covered in the book or DVD :angry:

I'll admit that my primary motivation is that I'm cheap...but the cost of a table mechanic is pennies compared to electricians and plumbers.
 
strmanglr scott said:
I was just looking at new felt and was thinking I could probably do it myself. I'm am extremely mechanically inclined. I tie my own fishing flies, lures, build fishing rods, do most of my mechanical work on my jeep, home repairs, furniture repair, etc.

I like doing things myself because often I do it better because its mine and I take the time to do right.

I also totally get having things done, so its right, especially if I screw it up could be v costly or result in permanent damage.

So I'm still on the fence.

How often do you guys replace your felt? If I replaced my felt every other year or more I would absolutely learn to do it myself.

If I had to pay $300 you can bet ur arse I'd do it myself, even if I screwed it up and had to buy all new felt. I got a friend who told me if I help pull staples from rails he'd charge me $75 I didn't want to pay that.
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I got my table for Xmas of 07'. We just bought a new house a few months back and had to move the table. It had green cloth and I wanted to switch it to Simonis Blue.
Anyhoo, the green cloth was still in great shape after almost 9 years of playing. My Fargo rate is 660 so I do get in there and practice a bit, not to mention having some buddies come over to play from time to time. A home table should go for at least 7 years before needing new cloth.
Now....if you practice a lot of jump shots it may need replacing sooner.
 
mvp said:
It makes me sick what people are paying to setup tables, I think I might take this on as a side job. People really should try and do this themselves at least once before calling a installer. I'm really anal when it comes to setting up mine and my friends table from using machinest levels on the frame work, then the slate. Corner squares for 90* corners and straight edges for the side rails. The hardest part is folding the rails. Which I think someone could easily skip the rails if they were scared to mess up the first time.
Try it once!!!! Level, square,cover with cloth! Watch YouTube if you need, only takes a few hours. Enough pool league guys at least 1 of em knows how to do it, have him help you, play on his table setup for a season then strip it down and do it to your standards! My rant is over! Please carry on
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A standard recover isn't terribly expensive.

How do you value your time?

When considering such things I usually take that into consideration unless it's something I just want to do for enjoyment or a hobby.

Like when my wife says "Take the day off and let's go do X. I have a coupon so it's cheap!" Then I remind her how much the actual cost is when you factor in how much I lose for one day of work missed." I still can't understand how and why she never, and I mean literally never, considers that.

An experienced person can do it better and faster anyway, for sure.


There are many considerations.

In my case, it probably isn't even close to being worth me spending the time to try unless I just wanted the enjoyment of the project.


I am just surprised at how miffed you are at the notion of paying somebody to do something that isn't terribly expensive for skilled work.



.
 
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It's not cost prohibitive if you have one table. But 10 x $500 is a kick in the wallet. Brian.
 
a1712 said:
It's not cost prohibitive if you have one table. But 10 x $500 is a kick in the wallet. Brian.
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If you've got 10 tables you must have a pretty big house, so that should be chicken feed!

On a more serious note, if you have a business the cost of a recover every year should be the cost of doing business. Also, out of curiosity, wouldn't a hall doing 10 tables get a better price per table?
 
I can see that some of the professional's may be insulted but they had to do it for the 1st time once also! I'm no pro but have done at least 50 or so including local bowling alley that has 5 9ft gold crowns. RKC asked what I do for a living and I'm a machinest (CNC mills& Lathes etc) and my hobbys are woodworking and mechanics. I'll dig up some table pics
 
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