Would You Still Gamble With This Guy?

[ShootingArts]

GAG, (that doesn't look quite right!)

To be honest it looks like you got outmoved and outplayed. While you were fuming about the break he was making balls and you were missing them. There is always a rule in play and one I would use to run a tournament if someone found a way to bend and abuse the rules, "unsportsmanlike". Although he got the break again it didn't make the foul go away. So, he made the first foul. I'd tell him he was on one, break again. Now he is on two. Now he can make a break you both deem legal or it is loss of game.

When I was gambling with a guy that thought he could pull moves he moved several balls with his arm and claimed it wasn't a foul, we hadn't specifically talked about that prior to the game. When I got back to the table I raked every ball except the cue ball and money ball in a corner pocket then tapped in the money ball. My opponent was foaming at the mouth! "That is illegal! You can't do that!" I just looked at him, "we didn't specify it was illegal before the match."

Sometimes we have to fight fire with fire. I would let the gambling with this guy pause for awhile. I assume if you have a hard time finding people to gamble with so does he. When he comes to you I would play him. I would also tell him if he wants to use safe breaks or any other unconventional play it needs to be announced before you start or it is illegal. I would also do a little research and find some spots that aren't the advantage they appear to be.

Breaking rules, break from the kitchen. After the break either four balls have to have been forced to the rail, four balls pocketed, or three balls remain in the kitchen. A combination of these things will be legal but one ball can not be scored twice.

 

[Get_A_Grip]

GAG, (that doesn't look quite right!)

To be honest it looks like you got outmoved and outplayed. While you were fuming about the break he was making balls and you were missing them. There is always a rule in play and one I would use to run a tournament if someone found a way to bend and abuse the rules, "unsportsmanlike". Although he got the break again it didn't make the foul go away. So, he made the first foul. I'd tell him he was on one, break again. Now he is on two. Now he can make a break you both deem legal or it is loss of game.

When I was gambling with a guy that thought he could pull moves he moved several balls with his arm and claimed it wasn't a foul, we hadn't specifically talked about that prior to the game. When I got back to the table I raked every ball except the cue ball and money ball in a corner pocket then tapped in the money ball. My opponent was foaming at the mouth! "That is illegal! You can't do that!" I just looked at him, "we didn't specify it was illegal before the match."

Sometimes we have to fight fire with fire. I would let the gambling with this guy pause for awhile. I assume if you have a hard time finding people to gamble with so does he. When he comes to you I would play him. I would also tell him if he wants to use safe breaks or any other unconventional play it needs to be announced before you start or it is illegal. I would also do a little research and find some spots that aren't the advantage they appear to be.

Breaking rules, break from the kitchen. After the break either four balls have to have been forced to the rail, four balls pocketed, or three balls remain in the kitchen. A combination of these things will be legal but one ball can not be scored twice.

You're right. There isn't a single other guy from the teams that we play or other teammates that will play for money. Maybe the best player in town would, but it's much more convenient to play a teammate every week after leagues end.

I definitely should have made him re-break until at least 3 balls hit a rail. But I was fed up with the safety break and couldn't stomach to watch him do even more of them. LOL

I mentioned that he commented to me that he will do whatever he has to to win. Well, one match he literally screamed something about how I executed my last shot, when I was down on my next shot. I should have gotten back up, but instead I missed the shot. In that case, I wasn't super mad, as I figured that I should be able to block that out and not let if affect me.

I'm pretty sure we won't be playing again, as I have no more desire to be "nice" to him by giving him a huge spot. If we play again it will be nothing more that the Fargo fair match spot of 7-6, rack your own, 8 ball, and no safety breaking.


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[David in FL]

You're right. There isn't a single other guy from the teams that we play or other teammates that will play for money. Maybe the best player in town would, but it's much more convenient to play a teammate every week after leagues end.

I definitely should have made him re-break until at least 3 balls hit a rail. But I was fed up with the safety break and couldn't stomach to watch him do even more of them. LOL

I mentioned that he commented to me that he will do whatever he has to to win. Well, one match he literally screamed something about how I executed my last shot, when I was down on my next shot. I should have gotten back up, but instead I missed the shot. In that case, I wasn't super mad, as I figured that I should be able to block that out and not let if affect me.

I'm pretty sure we won't be playing again, as I have no more desire to be "nice" to him by giving him a huge spot. If we play again it will be nothing more that the Fargo fair match spot of 7-6, rack your own, 8 ball, and no safety breaking.


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I’m curious. Where are you that you can’t find any action at all?

 

[Get_A_Grip]

I’m curious. Where are you that you can’t find any action at all?

Playing out in the county leagues. I think I'm the second highest Fargo Rated player at only just over 600. The top player is around a 645.

The only pool room in the city closed due to COVID-19. I could probably venture out to a nearby state, but I pretty much only go out to play now on my 2 league nights in the county.


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[jviss]

Breaking rules, break from the kitchen. After the break either four balls have to have been forced to the rail, four balls pocketed, or three balls remain in the kitchen. A combination of these things will be legal but one ball can not be scored twice.

What rules are these? Four balls pocketed? Really? How about one?

 

[ShootingArts]

What rules are these? Four balls pocketed? Really? How about one?

Gambling rules are anything you please. I don't really expect anyone to make four balls, however four balls fits with "or a combination of these" Pocket one and two in the kitchen and you are fine. Pocket one and three balls hit a rail and you are fine. Three hit a rail and one in the kitchen and you are fine.

A person can still risk a soft break if they have it working and pocketing one ball if that is the only requirement. The break rules I am suggesting are to deal with his particular situation. In my opinion, a lot of the rules put in place to try to insure no soft breaks are caca. I was watching video of a women's event, I think in china. At least twice a lady broke plenty hard enough to have a legal break and the player pocketed a ball. Because of the way the balls hit each other she failed to meet the rule preventing soft breaks and the table passed to the other player. The match was refereed and the referee had no choice but to give the table to the other player. The players accepted this too. What they were doing was the only thing they could do with the rules in place. It was legal but it wasn't just. A rule from long ago trying to prevent soft breaks said that two balls must remain in the kitchen after the break. People could crush racks and sometimes not get balls to stay in the kitchen. The rules said they were bad breaks. The only thing the players could go with but not just.

That is where GetaGrip was at too, what the other player did was legal under the rules or lack of them they were gambling with, but what happened to him wasn't just. I suspect that all of us that gamble are making a note about the other player being able to game the rules and getting all breaks to an advantage that wasn't intended.

Hu

 

[jviss]

At least twice a lady broke plenty hard enough to have a legal break and the player pocketed a ball. Because of the way the balls hit each other she failed to meet the rule preventing soft breaks and the table passed to the other player.

Again, what set of pool rules makes a break with a pocketed ball an illegal break? Any that I know are a pocketed ball or four balls must hit a rail or, and so on.

 

[ShootingArts]

Again, what set of pool rules makes a break with a pocketed ball an illegal break? Any that I know are a pocketed ball or four balls must hit a rail or, and so on.

Check out the china open, pretty sure the ladies division of that was where the lady made a ball on the break at least twice and lost her turn at the table. No idea what rules they were playing under.

Hu

 

[Get_A_Grip]

My main point is that if you play someone for money every week, and you bend over backwards to give them a really good chance to win with a huge spot, and THEN they pull some chicken sh!t safety breaks on top of the huge spot -- are you really going to want to play with that person ever again?

This is a friend and teammate on top of it. Some of you said that you wouldn't waste your time ever playing that person again, and others are getting hung up on the rules. I don't care what the rules are. I don't want to play with someone that will bend whatever rules exist, shark, or do everything and anything that they can think of to try to win. I play to have fun mostly. The money and the big spots help to put more pressure on me. The money is just a way to "keep score". But I play because I enjoy playing.

 

[Icon of Sin]

The first game I grabbed the cue ball thinking it was my break. So he took ball in hand and did a safe. The second game I did push out. But he took the shot and clipped the 1 ball and put the cue behind the stack.

If he makes an illegal break, without the spot, you would normally either be able take ball in hand there or you break. Since you breaking isnt the option, why didnt you get ball in hand there?

 

[Get_A_Grip]

If he makes an illegal break, without the spot, you would normally either be able take ball in hand there or you break. Since you breaking isnt the option, why didnt you get ball in hand there?

It was explained in the thread. The first 10 ball break rules that came up in our search didn't include ball in hand for an illegal break. I had the option to break or have him re-break. I couldn't break because I gave him all the breaks in the spot.


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[Icon of Sin]

It was explained in the thread. The first 10 ball break rules that came up in our search didn't include ball in hand for an illegal break. I had the option to break or have him re-break. I couldn't break because I gave him all the breaks in the spot.


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Ah, sorry. Thanks. 6 Pages. Didnt read it all.

Yeah, I wouldnt give up on this guy. You sound like the better and smarter player. Rob him.

 

[iusedtoberich]

I’m from Philly and we almost always play money ball spots on that break. I moved to Atlanta, and here they mostly play it stays down.
Each and every time I have ever gambled in the past 25 years I always go over spot on break with opponent, and we are set before the problems arise

 

[iusedtoberich]

I was playing probably one of the biggest sucker’s in Philly about 15 years ago. The guy probably lost a few 100 k over the past 30 years. We had run out of regular games so we negotiated an 8 ball gaff game. I forget the specifics now, but he had the break. He broke them super soft. So I immediately smashed the rack on my first shot. He wasn’t happy. Ha ha.

 

[SBC]

My main point is that if you play someone for money every week, and you bend over backwards to give them a really good chance to win with a huge spot, and THEN they pull some chicken sh!t safety breaks on top of the huge spot -- are you really going to want to play with that person ever again?

This is a friend and teammate on top of it. Some of you said that you wouldn't waste your time ever playing that person again, and others are getting hung up on the rules. I don't care what the rules are. I don't want to play with someone that will bend whatever rules exist, shark, or do everything and anything that they can think of to try to win. I play to have fun mostly. The money and the big spots help to put more pressure on me. The money is just a way to "keep score". But I play because I enjoy playing.

Sounds like guy isn't a good customer anyway. If he will only lose $100 there is no reason to spot the world and deal with his nonsense.

Try to get him to jack the bet and if he won't then that is that.

 

[claymont]

Now that you've had time to cool down and understand how he out maneuvered you, chalk it up to a learning experience. Now you know a bit more about his character and in the future, you might be able to use it against him(his character,that is). He shouldn't be able to use that gaff against you again...I hope

 

[Get_A_Grip]

Now that you've had time to cool down and understand how he out maneuvered you, chalk it up to a learning experience. Now you know a bit more about his character and in the future, you might be able to use it against him(his character,that is). He shouldn't be able to use that gaff against you again...I hope

That's fine, but I think that the break rules that we looked up and that showed up first in our search from the UPA weren't part of the gaff. It just turned out that the rules to re-break instead of me getting ball in hand unexpectedly worked against me with his safety breaks. But even if I included no safety breaks in the rules if I decided to play again, I honestly think he would just pull some other crap anyway. I think he probably can't afford to even lose $50, so if it looks like I'm going to win, he's going to pull something else. My conclusion is, it's not worth the hassle with him.

 

[wagdad]

I'm just curious what everyone thinks of this gambling story that happened last night after leagues. I've been gambling with this teammate many times before after our leagues. Normally between $50 and $100 a set. Based on our preliminary Fargo Ratings, I'm supposed to play him with me going to 7 and him going to 6. However, I've beat him in the past playing 8-ball at 5-3 and he gets all the breaks, at 6-3 winner breaks, and at 9-5 and he gets all of the breaks. He beat me at 9-5 winner breaks once by 1 game, and a couple other times playing 10 ball at 9-5 with him getting the 9 ball.

So last night I was playing really good. I won all 3 of my games with 2 table runs. This guy won all 3 games, but made a few mistakes. Because I felt good I decided I would play him and give him a spot again. We played 10-ball with me going to 7 and him going to 5, he gets the 10 ball, and he gets all of the breaks for $50.

He gets up 3-1 (including the spot) and he decides that he's not going to break the balls anymore. He just slowly rolled the cue ball into the rack where only 1 or 2 balls hit the rail. He did it on purpose. (An illegal break). The first time he did it, I grabbed the cue ball so I could break. Then he reminded me that he gets ALL THE BREAKS. So he took ball in hand and kept playing safeties behind the rack so I had to keep kicking at the 1 ball until the balls were open enough for him to run out.

He did this the last 2 games until he got to 5 games and won. I was obviously protesting that it was a chicken sh!t move and he admitted that why should he break them open and if he doesn't make a ball, then I could run out and catch up. He then said that he will do whatever he needs to do to win.

Well, my conclusion was that I mainly am playing for the fun of it and it's not enjoyable to play with someone who would do that. It's just not "pool" to me at all with that type of illegal soft break. I basically told him that "he blew it". I was giving him huge spots giving him a really good chance to win, because he would never play 7-6 like Fargo Rate says. And then with a big spot, he had to pull that move on top of it. So I said I wouldn't be playing him anymore.

What do you say? I'm also curious on what everyone thinks could have been done with an illegal break (3 balls or more didn't hit the rail) and he was getting all of the breaks? I didn't make him re-break, because he could have just re-broke until only 3 balls hit a rail and I would be in nearly the same spot.

You should %100 continue to gamble with him. Just change the rules, such as at least 3 balls must cross the kitchen line, and no more spotting him breaks or balls. Straight up mano y mano no favoritism. Then if he says no, you have every right to call him a chicken sh!t mutha fugga!

 

[Get_A_Grip]

You should %100 continue to gamble with him. Just change the rules, such as at least 3 balls must cross the kitchen line, and no more spotting him breaks or balls. Straight up mano y mano no favoritism. Then if he says no, you have every right to call him a chicken sh!t mutha fugga!

Well yeah. I would definitely gamble with him with no spot and if we stipulate no safety breaks, sharking, and crap like that. But he will never in a million years play that way, since he's seen me beat him many times already with huge spots. We are finally about even with money won and lost after probably playing 10 times, so I'm guessing that this is when we will stop playing. I'm no longer going to give him huge spots, so he just won't play. He knows I've been giving him the best of it. But I'm not stupid. I'm not going to give huge spots AND let him pull chicken sh!t moves on top of it. LOL

 

[Fore Rail]

What rules do you play league by?