wow SVB forfeits match vs Alcano

[jay helfert]

They are playing by WPA rules which states the Ten ball must be called! It was announced this way at the players meeting, which Shane failed to attend. I think the official and the TD made the right call here. If they had given Shane a break, then any player who didn't call the Ten would say Shane got a break, so why not me too? You CANNOT favor the top players when running a tournament. It's that simple. Shane KNOWS he is responsible for this and that's why he came back and played his match later.

 

[terryhanna]

They are playing by WPA rules which states the Ten ball must be called! It was announced this way at the players meeting, which Shane failed to attend. I think the official and the TD made the right call here. If they had given Shane a break, then any player who didn't call the Ten would say Shane got a break, so why not me too? You CANNOT favor the top players when running a tournament. It's that simple. Shane KNOWS he is responsible for this and that's why he came back and played his match later.

thanks Jay we saw you talking to Shane on the Stream after it happened and it sure looked like you told Shane that it was BS lol https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=p9ZrFBWjrKk#t=5385 but rules are rules and i am sure Shane would be the 1st to admit it was nobodys fault but his

 

[AtLarge]

They are playing by WPA rules which states the Ten ball must be called! It was announced this way at the players meeting, which Shane failed to attend. I think the official and the TD made the right call here. If they had given Shane a break, then any player who didn't call the Ten would say Shane got a break, so why not me too? You CANNOT favor the top players when running a tournament. It's that simple. Shane KNOWS he is responsible for this and that's why he came back and played his match later.

Jay -- the WPA 10-Ball rules say: "... the intended ball and pocket must be indicated for each shot if they are not obvious." Under those rules, the 10-ball is not treated differently from the 3-ball -- the player must overtly call it only if the ball and pocket are not "obvious."

Are you sure they weren't using slightly modified WPA rules, requiring an overt call on the 10-ball (but not on the other balls) even if it was obvious?

 

[jay helfert]

Jay -- the WPA 10-Ball rules say: "... the intended ball and pocket must be indicated for each shot if they are not obvious." Under those rules, the 10-ball is not treated differently from the 3-ball -- the player must overtly call it only if the ball and pocket are not "obvious."

Are you sure they weren't using slightly modified WPA rules, requiring a call on the 10-ball even if it was obvious (but not on the other balls)?

I was shown a printed set of WPA rules that clearly stated "The Ten ball must be called!" Again it was announced this way at the players meeting. To me it's no different then playing in the BCA nationals and you MUST call the Eight ball every time, no matter how obvious it is. I've watched many matches and I always see the players pointing their cue at the intended pocket on the Ten Ball. That's all it takes, just making a gesture to designate the pocket and you're safe.

 

[Bob Jewett]

I must be using the term "foul" differently than others. ....

Yes, you are. By the rules of 10 ball, a foul results in ball in hand for the opponent. The rules and a list of official definitions are available here: http://www.wpa-pool.com/web/the_rules_of_play

 

[BRussell]

They are playing by WPA rules which states the Ten ball must be called!

No they don't. Those rules say all balls are call pocket. Nothing special about the 10, and obvious shots don't have to be called.

 

[Bob Jewett]

I was shown a printed set of WPA rules that clearly stated "The Ten ball must be called!" Again it was announced this way at the players meeting. To me it's no different then playing in the BCA nationals and you MUST call the Eight ball every time, no matter how obvious it is.

The rules are available at the above link. Unless something has changed that I haven't heard about and that is not on the official WPA web site, the 10 doesn't have to be called in any way different from other balls, which is to say obvious shots do not need to be called.

 

[BRussell]

To me it's no different then playing in the BCA nationals and you MUST call the Eight ball every time, no matter how obvious it is.

Now wait a second. That's not BCA rules either.

 

[AtLarge]

I was shown a printed set of WPA rules that clearly stated "The Ten ball must be called!" Again it was announced this way at the players meeting. To me it's no different then playing in the BCA nationals and you MUST call the Eight ball every time, no matter how obvious it is. I've watched many matches and I always see the players pointing their cue at the intended pocket on the Ten Ball. That's all it takes, just making a gesture to designate the pocket and you're safe.

That confirms that they modified the standard WPA rules to require explicit calling of the 10-ball regardless of the shot on it.

 

[CJ Wiley]

Calling this foul on an obvious shot is unsportsmanlike conduct by the referee

That's what I would think, since they are calling all balls the ten is no different....therefore must only be called if not obvious.

Calling this foul on an obvious shot is unsportsmanlike conduct by the referee. imho

No they don't. Those rules say all balls are call pocket. Nothing special about the 10, and obvious shots don't have to be called.

 

[Bob Jewett]

... To me it's no different then playing in the BCA nationals and you MUST call the Eight ball every time, no matter how obvious it is. ...

Well, no. Here is the text of the BCAPL rule.

1. You must designate the called ball and the called pocket before each shot. You may make the designation verbally or by a clear, unambiguous gesture. You are not required to call obvious shots. You are not required to indicate incidental kisses and caroms, or incidental cushion contacts that do not constitute bank shots or kick shots. Not all kisses, caroms and cushion contacts are incidental. If a dispute arises as to whether a shot was obvious based on such contact, the referee is the sole judge. (AR p. 74, 82)
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[AtLarge]

That's what I would think, since they are calling all balls the ten is no different....therefore must only be called if not obvious.

Calling this foul on an obvious shot is unsportsmanlike conduct by the referee. imho

No, not when they amended the rules to require an explicit call on the 10-ball.

The referee's error was in not taking some sort of action the first time the 10-ball was not called, rather than waiting until game 9 of the match.

 

[f210]

That's what I would think, since they are calling all balls the ten is no different....therefore must only be called if not obvious.

Calling this foul on an obvious shot is unsportsmanlike conduct by the referee. imho

Jay said that the ten ball should be called regardless of shot and that this was discussed/announced in the players' meeting.

 

[gordml]

OK I hate to be nitty about this but....Im watching an exhibition match between Pacquiao/alcano vs efren/busty and efren just made the 10 and did NOT call the 10 ball.
ref allowed it.

 

[gordml]

OK I hate to be nitty about this but....Im watching an exhibition match between Pacquiao/alcano vs efren/busty and efren just made the 10 and did NOT call the 10 ball.
ref allowed it.

Now Alcano just made the 10. no call.

 

[parvus1202]

Now Alcano just made the 10. no call.

Probably because it's just an exhibition not part of the tournament?

I don't know why people are complaining about the 10 ball not being called by SVB. The Ref was right. The rules were given to every one before the start of the tournament. No exceptions, equal rules for everybody. Jay was a witness to that.

 

[punter]

Probably because it's just an exhibition not part of the tournament?

I don't know why people are complaining about the 10 ball not being called by SVB. The Ref was right. The rules were given to every one before the start of the tournament. No exceptions, equal rules for everybody. Jay was a witness to that.

So, why didn't he call it the other times Shane made the ten and didn't call it. Instead, he waited to call it when the nitty Ronnie Alcano told him to call it. The whole thing looks like a move, and it was a move.

 

[parvus1202]

So, why didn't he call it the other times Shane made the ten and didn't call it. Instead, he waited to call it when the nitty Ronnie Alcano told him to call it. The whole thing looks like a move, and it was a move.

I never saw the Ref looked at Alcano. he quickly raise his arms after the shot. There was no audio how did you know Alcano spoke? How did you know that SVB did not say anything when he sunk the previous ten ball? How did you know he did not say " Corner pocket". And on his second win he pointed at the corner pocket. So he knew the rule.

 

[SakuJack]

I never saw the Ref looked at Alcano. he quickly raise his arms after the shot. There was no audio how did you know Alcano spoke? How did you know that SVB did not say anything when he sunk the previous ten ball? How did you know he did not say " Corner pocket". And on his second win he pointed at the corner pocket. So he knew the rule.

Yep, I agree.

I think the rule itself is unnecessary, and the ref could easily have let it pass if the shot was obvious (which it was), but SVB has nobody to blame but himself. He knew the rules, and if he didn't then he should have.

 

[CJ Wiley]

How is the integrity of the game violated if Shane doesn't call that shot?

Excuse me, but that's just a nitty rule and serves no purpose whatsoever!

How is the integrity of the game violated if Shane doesn't call that shot?

The answer is a simple "it doesn't at all."

Rules are meant to maintain the integrity of the game and provide a fair playing field.

Jay said that the ten ball should be called regardless of shot and that this was discussed/announced in the players' meeting.