You play pool, but do you smoke?

[MrLucky]

I quit for some reason you refuse to acknowledge your lack of understanding.

If that football player is your brother, or your father, or best friend and he has injuries from high school or college (which is pretty common), later in life it can deeply effect his quality of life and those that have to cater to him.....you have to take him to mulitple appointments, cook, and clean because of his own choice to play...

400LB guy eating 1/4 of the left side of the menu, wearing 1/2 of it on his shirt....you happen to be seated at a nearby table and you literally can't enjoy your food....or that guy happens to be family, and you have to help with his special needs......

Bad driver in front of you....or speeder hit you from behind...either these two, or the two examples above, cost you time, money, and influence your health and quality of life....which smoking does as well....those that look to ban smoking may later look to ban unhealthy foods and so on.....that might not be your agenda, but I dont' think it's that far away...

Regardless, I appreciate where your coming from, but I don't like the condescending approach like I'm a little kid that just doesn't understand....

Or perhaps that is the answer ! you just do not comprehend the difference in having a choice in what you do that can harm you and not having any say whatsoever! I give ! OH ! I see you just don't like the fact that you were wrong and can't bring yourself to face up to it since I pointed it out to you LMAO!

between us ... Do you really have a big perm?

 

[Big Perm]

Or perhaps that is the answer ! you just do not comprehend the difference in having a choice in what you do that can harm you and not having any say whatsoever! I give ! OH ! I see you just don't like the fact that you were wrong and can't bring yourself to face up to it since I pointed it out to you LMAO!

between us ... Do you really have a big perm?

I am bald

I see your point, I was wrong all along...please ignore all previous posts.

I feel special.....I see you brought the hardcore pink into all this

 

[RobertR]

@rookie6018

I'm very surprised you are that open minded to be able to completely change your mind on such an opinionated topic. I have a lot of respect for people who don't let their bias and ego get in the way of admitting when they are wrong. The world needs more people like you.

TAP TAP TAP. I couldn't agree more SixSence.

The media has made changing one's mind, or admitting when one is wrong into some sort of cardinal sin. There are so many polarizing issues in our country today because people like Karl Rove and the other spin doctors have made the manipulation of American opinion into an evil art form.

This issue (smoking) is really just about money. The insurance companies don't want to be sued by non-smokers. The lobbyists and spin doctors have managed to make the issue about something else, personal freedom. So, while we argue about personal freedoms, the ultra-greedy insurance companies get a free pass.

 

[doitforthegame]

This is where we part....

not one of your examples are related to being forced to share someones bad habit and potential for a horrible illness just because in order to partake of ones hobby / recreation you must endure second hand cigarette smoke ! Please try to be more imaginative or at least present a serious idea to perpetuate your non existent case!

See this is where you are wrong. You are not FORCED to partake of ones hobby. You CHOOSE to partake. Now, if there is no pool room that shares your view on smoking you have CHOICES. You can boycott the establishment. If enough people share your ideas you will economically persuade the owner to CHOOSE to change his business to non-smoking. Or, you could, or you could persuade someone to, open a non-smoking establishment. If there is a sufficient economic return to the owner, he will CHOOSE to keep it a non-smoking environment. Or three, you can build an addition onto your house and get your own table and enjoy all of the benefits.

Bob

 

[doitforthegame]

When I go into a poolhall or for that matter any place where smokers congregate I do not have a choice in whether or not I breath their toxic by products !!! there just isn't any valid comparison in your attempt to justify this situation!

Again, I disagree. Unless there are armed personnel hired by the tobacco companies holding their weapons aimed at your head and FORCING YOU AT GUNPOINT to enter that pool hall, then you do have a choice. You can CHOOSE not to enter that poolroom.

Bob

 

[doitforthegame]

TAP TAP TAP. I couldn't agree more SixSence.

This issue (smoking) is really just about money. The insurance companies don't want to be sued by non-smokers. The lobbyists and spin doctors have managed to make the issue about something else, personal freedom. So, while we argue about personal freedoms, the ultra-greedy insurance companies get a free pass.

SixSence, that is persuasive. And I think I totally agree with your point. As the wise man said.... "follow the money".

Bob

 

[SixSence]

I'm having alot of trouble trying to comprehend the mindset of some of you. You are arguing about why laws against banning smoking in public places like pool halls shouldn't be made right? Now please explain to me your reasoning in using the comparison of banning alcohol because drunk drivers kill people. If you didn't notice, alcohol is already banned when you're driving. There are laws against it. This is about banning smoking while in public places, just like alcohol is banned in your car while driving. Same with speeding. Beyond that comparison, the rest just seem to get even more ridiculous as you go.

Even worse is the people saying we have a choice to enter a poolhall or not, like you're trying to say we should have to stay out of pool halls if we don't want to involuntarily be subject to your lethal addiction. Are you being utterly serious here!? I could use yalls approach to arguing and say "if I go into a pool hall and hit someone in the face I'll get thrown out, but going in and giving everyone a terminal illness is ok," but see, I like to be a little rational. If you have a need to fill a pointless and fatal addiction every five minutes, you can choose to not enter a pool hall. Why should the people who make a place safer and cleaner be the ones left out? Your own point seems more rational if reversed. If you're going to make a point, please make sure it's well thought-out and makes sense in the future. Thanks.

 

[doitforthegame]

Even worse is the people saying we have a choice to enter a poolhall or not, Is there someone in your town that holds a gun to your head to force you to enter? If not you would seem to have a choice.

like you're trying to say we should have to stay out of pool halls if we don't want to involuntarily be subject to your lethal addiction. Well, yes! You can choose not to enter a poolhall that allows a totally legal product to be used by it's customers. By the way...I don't have the addiction. I'm a non smoker.

Are you being utterly serious here!? I could use yalls approach to arguing and say "if I go into a pool hall and hit someone in the face I'll get thrown out, but going in and giving everyone a terminal illness is ok," but see, I like to be a little rational. If you have a need to fill a pointless and fatal addiction every five minutes, you can choose to not enter a pool hall. Why should the people who make a place safer and cleaner be the ones left out? Your own point seems more rational if reversed. If you're going to make a point, please make sure it's well thought-out and makes sense in the future. Thanks.

Dude, I don't know what to say here. It is a legal product. If it is so bad, ban it. Period. So long as it is legal, and people still have the right to choose what they want to do with their lives, then a pool room owner is well within his rights to allow smoking. That being said, it should be with some caveats. You must clearly post that it is a smoking establishment. You could not allow minors to come in. As far as the people that make a place safer and cleaner being left out, they would not be. They could choose to go into the establishment, or they could stay away.
If you're going to make a point, please make sure it's well thought-out and makes sense in the future. Thanks.Now seriously, can't anyone on the pro smoking ban side ever make their point without being condescending? It really is about the elitism isn't it. You know, you know better than us rabble.


Bob

 

[SixSence]

Dude, I don't know what to say here. It is a legal product. If it is so bad, ban it. Period. So long as it is legal, and people still have the right to choose what they want to do with their lives, then a pool room owner is well within his rights to allow smoking. That being said, it should be with some caveats. You must clearly post that it is a smoking establishment. You could not allow minors to come in. As far as the people that make a place safer and cleaner being left out, they would not be. They could choose to go into the establishment, or they could stay away.
If you're going to make a point, please make sure it's well thought-out and makes sense in the future. Thanks.Now seriously, can't anyone on the pro smoking ban side ever make their point without being condescending? It really is about the elitism isn't it. You know, you know better than us rabble.

We all know it's a legal product.... the whole point of this debate is to determine whether or not to make it illegal in public places. If consuming alcohol were legal while driving, would you still think it's okay? I mean you would have a choice whether to get on the road and drive or not right? The whole point is that something needs to be changed, a law should be passed.

How about you look at which points from both sides make the most sense rather than trying to figure out if I'm arguing to prove I'm better than somebody. I'm an opinionated person, is that okay with you? I'm not trying to belittle anyone, it's just the things some people are saying are making absolutely no sense, and it's irritating. Smoking in pool halls doesn't even bother me personally, and I accepted the fact there is nothing I can do about it a long time ago. But when people try to argue that smoking should be allowed by making no sense, I'm going to voice my opinion about it. If I'm sounding "condenscing" it's because I wish people would make sense when trying to make a point, and not just take 2 seconds to post some exaggerated nonsense that doesn't compare at all to what we're talking about. You're trying to criticize me when you obviously haven't even grasped the point of the debate, and aren't even taking into consideration the points I'm making, which is most important to what everyone is talking about.

P.S. Please don't take my overly direct comments personally. It's aimed to show the importance of my points and it's against your arguments, not you as a person. My words don't convery my true emotion over the internet. Just trying to have a serious conversation on here, god forbid :O

 

[doitforthegame]

We all know it's a legal product.... the whole point of this debate is to determine whether or not to make it illegal in public places. If consuming alcohol were legal while driving, would you still think it's okay? I mean you would have a choice whether to get on the road and drive or not right? The whole point is that something needs to be changed, a law should be passed.

How about you look at which points from both sides make the most sense rather than trying to figure out if I'm arguing to prove I'm better than somebody. I'm an opinionated person, is that okay with you? I'm not trying to belittle anyone, it's just the things some people are saying are making absolutely no sense, and it's irritating. Smoking in pool halls doesn't even bother me personally, and I accepted the fact there is nothing I can do about it a long time ago. But when people try to argue that smoking should be allowed by making no sense, I'm going to voice my opinion about it. If I'm sounding "condenscing" it's because I wish people would make sense when trying to make a point, and not just take 2 seconds to post some exaggerated nonsense that doesn't compare at all to what we're talking about. You're trying to criticize me when you obviously haven't even grasped the point of the debate, and aren't even taking into consideration the points I'm making, which is most important to what everyone is talking about.

OK, Mr. Opinionated person (apparently you possess THE only correct opinion on this subject). You win. I don't understand what you find confusing about someones "right to choose" when they are engaging in a legal activity. You sound condescending because you are. I totally understand the points you are making. I just don't agree with them. In my opinion, your thoughts lack any real depth and are nothing more than the parroting of arguments that have been used over and over. You know, keep repeating them and eventually they become facts. (exception: you made a very valid point about the insurance companies...) I totally understand your emotional response. Hey, I hate it when my clothes get all stinky too. But then again, I did CHOOSE to enter that pool room where there was smoking going on, didn't I.

 

[SixSence]

For someone who hates being condescending, you sure have a funny way of showing it. You're saying my arguments lack depth when your only reason why I'm wrong is because it's a legal product and we have the ability to choose to go in a pool hall or not. Because someone wants to play pool enough to endure the smoke is your only basis for it being right? Because I take the risk of driving when I know there are drunk drivers out there, it makes it okay for those people to impose that risk on me? No, which is why we have laws against that. And apparently because a product is legal, you think it can't have limitations? Alcohol is legal so I should be able to drink it anywhere and anytime no matter what I'm risking on others? Pornography is legal, does that mean it should be viewable by anyone at any age? The reason I think a law should be passed is because it's for the greater good of society, not because my clothes stink. I don't mind people smoking around me. I've been around it my whole life. I gave several points that you have yet to have a response to (and I doubt you will), and I'm the one who lacks depth. Hell I even addressed your only argument in the last post, yet you just posted it again. You wonder why I have to repeat myself.... The best argument in this thread defending smoking tries to compare eating fatty foods to exposing others to second hand smoke..... God forbid I disagree with the opinions of others and state my opinions confidently. I must think my opinions are fact and the only right ones.... I really wish someone would give some "depth" arguments to my opinions.

 

[derekdisco]

All I smoke is fools on the BBall court!

 

[FLICKit]

Smoke outside

It's really not that difficult. Nobody's forcing you not to smoke. Just go outside when you want to smoke. Take a short walk. You can come back in after you're done. Your lungs can likely use the exercise anyway. The fresh air would probably do you good. If the air's not fresh where you're at, what the hell do you care, you're smoking! It's a win / win scenario. The non-smokers have a smoke free pool environment which will be conducive to everyone's game. And you can still have all the cigarettes you want, outside.

 

[MrLucky]

Thank You for some Sanity !

I'm having alot of trouble trying to comprehend the mindset of some of you. You are arguing about why laws against banning smoking in public places like pool halls shouldn't be made right? Now please explain to me your reasoning in using the comparison of banning alcohol because drunk drivers kill people. If you didn't notice, alcohol is already banned when you're driving. There are laws against it. This is about banning smoking while in public places, just like alcohol is banned in your car while driving. Same with speeding. Beyond that comparison, the rest just seem to get even more ridiculous as you go.

Even worse is the people saying we have a choice to enter a poolhall or not, like you're trying to say we should have to stay out of pool halls if we don't want to involuntarily be subject to your lethal addiction. Are you being utterly serious here!? I could use yalls approach to arguing and say "if I go into a pool hall and hit someone in the face I'll get thrown out, but going in and giving everyone a terminal illness is ok," but see, I like to be a little rational. If you have a need to fill a pointless and fatal addiction every five minutes, you can choose to not enter a pool hall. Why should the people who make a place safer and cleaner be the ones left out? Your own point seems more rational if reversed. If you're going to make a point, please make sure it's well thought-out and makes sense in the future. Thanks.

I Decided to follow my sigs advice and let them talk to themselves until someone with a reasonable post came along!

 

[DelaWho???]

We all know it's a legal product.... the whole point of this debate is to determine whether or not to make it illegal in public places. If consuming alcohol were legal while driving, would you still think it's okay? I mean you would have a choice whether to get on the road and drive or not right? The whole point is that something needs to be changed, a law should be passed.

In Delaware it is illegal to "drive under the influence" there is no law against having an open container of alcohol in the car, yet... They are bringing it up to the legislature in this session.
My beef with this (being a non smoker) is about government intrusion. Take the state of NY for example. Several years ago they passed law that mandated smoking and non smoking areas. Small establishments were exempted based on square footage, but were required (by the state) to install air purification systems. The large estab.s had to do the same to prevent smoke bleed over into the non smoking areas. A smll tavern in, owned by a friend in my home town, invested over $20k in air purification systems to comply with the new law. 2 yrs later they ban smoking indoors completely, and my friend is out $20K he was forced to spend to obey the law. That's just not right.

California is now trying to ban smoking completely, inside, outside, in your private car, or when you're on the can taking a dump.....Nothing worse than the smell of sh!t and cigarette, but if that's what it takes to clean your colon, you should be able to smoke in your home bathroom...

It's about big brother and gov't nannyship vs personal responsibility.

A non smoker

McCue Banger McCue

 

[cdavis9771]

that even when the smell is not that obvious and we think we are OK the danger is still there in fact may be more dangerous because for instance I play out of a place called Mr Cues here in Atlanta when its really crowded the smoke is intolerable and I try and leave there as soon as possible on league night ! The days when its not as crowded you are lulled into a false sense of security because the smoke is not as obvious but the reality is it is still there and it is still a hazard!

You say you play out of Atlanta? Do you ever see Sarah Rousey there?
I was wondering how she is doing? Thanks=)

 

[SixSence]

In Delaware it is illegal to "drive under the influence" there is no law against having an open container of alcohol in the car, yet... They are bringing it up to the legislature in this session.
My beef with this (being a non smoker) is about government intrusion. Take the state of NY for example. Several years ago they passed law that mandated smoking and non smoking areas. Small establishments were exempted based on square footage, but were required (by the state) to install air purification systems. The large estab.s had to do the same to prevent smoke bleed over into the non smoking areas. A smll tavern in, owned by a friend in my home town, invested over $20k in air purification systems to comply with the new law. 2 yrs later they ban smoking indoors completely, and my friend is out $20K he was forced to spend to obey the law. That's just not right.

California is now trying to ban smoking completely, inside, outside, in your private car, or when you're on the can taking a dump.....Nothing worse than the smell of sh!t and cigarette, but if that's what it takes to clean your colon, you should be able to smoke in your home bathroom...

It's about big brother and gov't nannyship vs personal responsibility.

A non smoker

McCue Banger McCue

I understand your point. I also don't think your friend being out 20k means anything when you're talking about the greater good of society. I also believe that no matter what the government does, it's not going to please everybody. You have to accept the good with the bad, and really weigh which gives the most benefits and is more important as a whole. There are laws about putting your seatbelt on, when I'm sure some people would like the right to go through their windshield. There are laws about alcohol for a reason. The government has to intervien on some issues... When it involves public health and a poison that is not only lethal but is in general a nuisance to society, it needs to be regulated. The health benefit of the public highly outweighs the freedom for individuals to satisfy an addiction in public while harming others IMO.

 

[Shadow]

I commend all those that are trying to quit. There is no question that if you do, you are buying back days of your life, so the money aspect is just a bonus.

This article may enlighten you a little about some of the myths about smoking.

I have included a nice picture so that you can see the creosote building up in your lungs. A normal lung is nice and pinkish. I made up a gruesome poster of these pictures and some other throat and mouth cancers to hang outside while my husband smokes so that he associated the behavior with the pictures. He took it down.

We have been non-smoking here in the Evergreen state for some time now. Imagine my chagrin when I stepped into Capone's in FL a couple weeks ago and smelled that nasty smell, choking my lungs, clouding my vision and drying out my contacts.

There are some bars up here that still have that smell clinging to everything, even though no one has actually been smoking inside. The ceilings are brown where they used to be white.

Then some person wants to be able to see, so they prop the door open, and smoke comes in again, or we freeze our butts off, because they want to smoke theirs!

How about the crowd of smokers lining the front door of every airport, restaurant, bar, casino, etc. ? You have to take a big breath of fresh air and run the gauntlet, and get inside before you can breathe again.

But it is SO much better than having to submit to all the smoke inside. Again, kudos to all those that want to be non-smokers!

Linda, thank you for the attachments, if i am only rich i would make billboards of that pictures in every major freeways all over the country. For sure manufacturers would kill me. But is there any possibility we could do that? maybe we contribute money to post some billboards against smoking?

Any rich pool players who could support this? I dont know if this would work but who knows...