What is "HIT" to you?

nksmfamjp

nksmfamjp

Refugee...
Silver Member
Hit to me is basically:
1) sound cue makes striking the cue ball
2) vibration felt at the grip hand
3) Action or spin placed on the cue ball with a given speed of stroke

To me, 3 is the hardest to quantify because no two shots are exactly the same, but I do know that some cues seem to just naturally draw for me and others are just hard to get draw to happen with. It could be so many fators like tip hardness, shape, me, alignment of Jupiter's moons!

Anyways, I would really like to hear what a more experienced cue user can tell me about this.

Last, how are laminate and other LD shafts affecting your hit on a production cue?

Crazy question. . .Is 99% of the hit in the shaft? Seems to me like balance could also play a major factor.

Thanks. Just trying to wrap my head around all this. . .
 
nksmfamjp said:
Hit to me is basically:
1) sound cue makes striking the cue ball
2) vibration felt at the grip hand
3) Action or spin placed on the cue ball with a given speed of stroke

To me, 3 is the hardest to quantify because no two shots are exactly the same, but I do know that some cues seem to just naturally draw for me and others are just hard to get draw to happen with. It could be so many fators like tip hardness, shape, me, alignment of Jupiter's moons!

Anyways, I would really like to hear what a more experienced cue user can tell me about this.

Last, how are laminate and other LD shafts affecting your hit on a production cue?

Crazy question. . .Is 99% of the hit in the shaft? Seems to me like balance could also play a major factor.

Thanks. Just trying to wrap my head around all this. . .
Click to expand...

I would add to your list the perceived stiffnes/flexibility of the cue. When I bought my playing cue, one of the shafts was 31" long. It felt "whippy" when shooting, and ultimately I had it cut down by the original cue maker. New Ferrule and tip, and it felt nice and stiff like the other shaft at 29"

my .02
 
The "hit"

I did a little comparison last night with my Runde and my R6. I was curious how the same shaft would feel on two different, yet similar butts. I was using a Runde shaft and on the Runde, it felt firm and buttery with a soft(ish) hit. When I put the same shaft on the R6, it was hard and stiff and moved the ball alot easier. The R6 has a non cored, straight grain forearm where the Runde is Curly maple with a straight grain core. I guess this blows my idea of the shaft being 90% of the hit. The same shaft "felt" completely different on each cue. It felt stiffer on the R6 and seemed to transfer english way more than on the Runde. Strange but true. I need to do some more comparisons, without women and whiskey.
 
To me it's a combination of #2 and #3. IE...My Mottey is not as stiff as my Blackcreek, the cue ball responds better to english with the Mottey, but deflects more. The Blackcreek responds well to english but requires more of a stroke to get the same effect as the Mottey, but deflects less and skids a tad more. The vibration in the hand feels great with both.

Both are phenominal cues, but to me, suited for different purposes. The Mottey plays an awesome rotation pool game where as the Blackcreek excels at straights and 1 hole.

This is just the way I judge them... YMMV

Jim
 
Hit

Mike lambros has his own description of the hit of a cue which I have copied and pasted below. IMO this sums it up pretty well:

Here is a very simple test that any player can do with any cue, to help get a feel for how well or how poorly the given cue is designed and constructed. This test is structured for a pool table, but something similar can easily be done on a carom table, too.

Place an object ball on the center spot of a table. Now place the cue ball on the head string (or foot string), such that the two balls form a straight-in shot to the corner pocket.

Next, take your stance and stroke the cue ball in to the object ball, with just enough force so that the object ball barely reaches the pocket. For this test, it is not important whether or not the object ball goes in the pocket. What is important, is for the player to remember what the cue felt like in the hands and what it sounded like to the ears.

Next, set up the exact same shot and shoot towards the pocket. But this time, use a full force, break-shot speed stroke. Once again, remember what the cue felt like in the hands and what it sounded like to the ears.

The cue should feel and sound exactly the same for both shots. If the cue vibrates more during the more forceful stroke, or makes any audible noises like a "tink" or a "groan", then there is a flaw in that cue's design and/or construction. For these vibrations and noises that you feel, are energy from your stroke, being wasted by the cue, which is very undesirable trait.

Each and every Lambros Cue passes this test with flying colors, because each cue is designed to transmit maximum stroke energy to the cue ball, with minimum energy lost in the cue. Hence, with a Lambros Cue, the soft hit and the forceful hit sound the same and feel the same. This is a most desirable trait in a pool or billiard cue.

Dan
 
PDX said:
I did a little comparison last night with my Runde and my R6. I was curious how the same shaft would feel on two different, yet similar butts. I was using a Runde shaft and on the Runde, it felt firm and buttery with a soft(ish) hit. When I put the same shaft on the R6, it was hard and stiff and moved the ball alot easier. The R6 has a non cored, straight grain forearm where the Runde is Curly maple with a straight grain core. I guess this blows my idea of the shaft being 90% of the hit. The same shaft "felt" completely different on each cue. It felt stiffer on the R6 and seemed to transfer english way more than on the Runde. Strange but true. I need to do some more comparisons, without women and whiskey.
Click to expand...

This is exactly what I was talking about in the "let's talk about butts" thread. Thanks for your response.:thumbup:
 
Part of the hit to me is how the cues feels in my hand when holding it. Plus #2 on how it feels when hitting the CB.

The sound has some affect but it is mostly drowned out by all of the background noise.

How it affects english is more of the stroke but the overall construction of the cue does affect that also.

I would say that they all contribute to it.
 
PDX said:
I did a little comparison last night with my Runde and my R6. I was curious how the same shaft would feel on two different, yet similar butts. I was using a Runde shaft and on the Runde, it felt firm and buttery with a soft(ish) hit. When I put the same shaft on the R6, it was hard and stiff and moved the ball alot easier. The R6 has a non cored, straight grain forearm where the Runde is Curly maple with a straight grain core. I guess this blows my idea of the shaft being 90% of the hit. The same shaft "felt" completely different on each cue. It felt stiffer on the R6 and seemed to transfer english way more than on the Runde. Strange but true. I need to do some more comparisons, without women and whiskey.
Click to expand...

interesting, i have never thought to do this. :)
 
Quesports said:
Mike lambros has his own description of the hit of a cue which I have copied and pasted below. IMO this sums it up pretty well:

Here is a very simple test that any player can do with any cue, to help get a feel for how well or how poorly the given cue is designed and constructed. This test is structured for a pool table, but something similar can easily be done on a carom table, too.

Place an object ball on the center spot of a table. Now place the cue ball on the head string (or foot string), such that the two balls form a straight-in shot to the corner pocket.

Next, take your stance and stroke the cue ball in to the object ball, with just enough force so that the object ball barely reaches the pocket. For this test, it is not important whether or not the object ball goes in the pocket. What is important, is for the player to remember what the cue felt like in the hands and what it sounded like to the ears.

Next, set up the exact same shot and shoot towards the pocket. But this time, use a full force, break-shot speed stroke. Once again, remember what the cue felt like in the hands and what it sounded like to the ears.

The cue should feel and sound exactly the same for both shots. If the cue vibrates more during the more forceful stroke, or makes any audible noises like a "tink" or a "groan", then there is a flaw in that cue's design and/or construction. For these vibrations and noises that you feel, are energy from your stroke, being wasted by the cue, which is very undesirable trait.

Each and every Lambros Cue passes this test with flying colors, because each cue is designed to transmit maximum stroke energy to the cue ball, with minimum energy lost in the cue. Hence, with a Lambros Cue, the soft hit and the forceful hit sound the same and feel the same. This is a most desirable trait in a pool or billiard cue.

Dan
Click to expand...
I agree with this but:

Imagine a tuning fork, upright in a vise. If you take a little hammer and tap one of the tines on top, downward, it should not vibrate any differently than if you hit it hard. But, the same soft/hard hit on the side will produce very different vibrations. So, if you strike the cueball EXACTLY in the center for each of Lambros' shots you will get the results he states, but if there is any variation on the strike angle you will get different feedback. That said, I own a Lambros and you can throw all the science out the window...the cue simple hits like a dream.
 
#2 vibration in the handle...

it is the resonation a cue gives after striking the white. everyone has their own definition and preference though. JS
 
Less whiskey and women

I did some more comparisons, with whiskey and women. I tried a total of 6 shafts on a Runde Schon and 5 shafts on 2 Rundes. There was only one shaft that the hit stayed nearly consistent with all three butts. Every other shaft changed with variance of butt. Some huge, some not so much. One of the cues has a straight grain maple forearm and the other two are cored with straight grain. The cored ones felt very, very similar, where the straight grain was alot stiffer in hit. Just my non scientific experiment.
 
Quesports said:
...with a Lambros Cue, the soft hit and the forceful hit sound the same and feel the same...

Dan
Click to expand...

Even if the sound and feel are the same with soft and forceful hits, you may or may not like that particular sound and feel.
 
Close my Eyes-

and hit center ball. I like Lambros' approach. Sound and feel is how I compare the hit. I agree the speed of stroke should not make a difference. I use this method to compare cues a lot. Since the eyes are wired into the brain pan, taking them out of the equation really helps.

I use this technique to mix music as well-
 
Whenever I try a new cue, I usually close my eyes or look away and take a couple of hits.
 
jhendri2 said:
To me it's a combination of #2 and #3. IE...My Mottey is not as stiff as my Blackcreek, the cue ball responds better to english with the Mottey, but deflects more. The Blackcreek responds well to english but requires more of a stroke to get the same effect as the Mottey, but deflects less and skids a tad more. The vibration in the hand feels great with both.

Both are phenominal cues, but to me, suited for different purposes. The Mottey plays an awesome rotation pool game where as the Blackcreek excels at straights and 1 hole.

This is just the way I judge them... YMMV

Jim
Click to expand...
I did this test today with all three of my shafts l lined up the shots i hit it soft med hard and what the shit out of it hard and the sound and feel where all the same i guess my cue passed this test. :)
 
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