Jump cues allowed in the APA

paksat

paksat

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I took a look at their manual and all it says is that you cannot do the illegal scoop shot. It says nothing regarding jump cues.

Now last night my opponent informed me that I was allowed to jump just as long as I didn't break my cue down to do it.

I'm confused, answers?
 
paksat said:
I took a look at their manual and all it says is that you cannot do the illegal scoop shot. It says nothing regarding jump cues.

Now last night my opponent informed me that I was allowed to jump just as long as I didn't break my cue down to do it.

I'm confused, answers?
Click to expand...

You cannot use a typical jump cue. If you have a jump break cue you can use that but not break it down as a pure jump cue. You can even jump with your playing cue if you know how. The basic rule is if the cue is a full length cue you may use it to jump.
However, in APA masters you can use a jump cue.
 
leehayes said:
You cannot use a typical jump cue. If you have a jump break cue you can use that but not break it down as a pure jump cue. You can even jump with your playing cue if you know how. The basic rule is if the cue is a full length cue you may use it to jump.
However, in APA masters you can use a jump cue.
Click to expand...

Thanks

I like their reasoning lol "because it gives an unfair advantage to people that cannot jump or don't have a jump cue"

What about the unfair advantage of playing a higher skill level opponent who has the knowledge of safety, kicks, banks, and pattern play?

Their skill ranking "equalizer" system does NOT make up that kind of ground.
 
paksat said:
Thanks

I like their reasoning lol "because it gives an unfair advantage to people that cannot jump or don't have a jump cue"

What about the unfair advantage of playing a higher skill level opponent who has the knowledge of safety, kicks, banks, and pattern play?

Their skill ranking "equalizer" system does NOT make up that kind of ground.
Click to expand...

I'm guessing that they don't want jump cues for fear that people with no knowledge of how to use them will damage the tables. The other thought is that mostly I see APA as an entry level league where people learn how to play. If they get to jump then proper pattern play, kicks, banks etc won't get learned? I don't know...just a guess.
If you want to use a jump cue simply play masters. The format is much better and we get to play real competitors.
 
Jump cues allowed in the APA ???

Earl Strickland was one of the 1st to jump a ball using his full length cue and still is quite successful doing that (mostly long table jumps). In APA, since you CAN use a Break cue (and with a phenolic tip), you are allowed to use that cue for jumping BUT only in one piece, full length!

leehayes said:
I'm guessing that they don't want jump cues for fear that people with no knowledge of how to use them will damage the tables. The other thought is that mostly I see APA as an entry level league where people learn how to play. If they get to jump then proper pattern play, kicks, banks etc won't get learned? I don't know...just a guess.
If you want to use a jump cue simply play masters. The format is much better and we get to play real competitors.
Click to expand...
 
leehayes said:
I'm guessing that they don't want jump cues for fear that people with no knowledge of how to use them will damage the tables. The other thought is that mostly I see APA as an entry level league where people learn how to play. If they get to jump then proper pattern play, kicks, banks etc won't get learned? I don't know...just a guess.
If you want to use a jump cue simply play masters. The format is much better and we get to play real competitors.
Click to expand...

I'd love to play masters, i'm sure others would to. Unfortunately, not everyone has the option since it's only in certain regions.

I think they should re-think this rule. As well they should adopt the push-out into the rules system.

I just wish I could use every tool that I have instead of being held back. I'm sure you use the APA the same way that I do in that it's merely a "training ground" for the more big time tourneys.

I think it's a good way to prepare for unseen circumstances.
 
paksat said:
I'd love to play masters, i'm sure others would to. Unfortunately, not everyone has the option since it's only in certain regions.

I think they should re-think this rule. As well they should adopt the push-out into the rules system.

I just wish I could use every tool that I have instead of being held back. I'm sure you use the APA the same way that I do in that it's merely a "training ground" for the more big time tourneys.

I think it's a good way to prepare for unseen circumstances.
Click to expand...

paksat:

APA is going to have to do a lot more than your suggestions of allowing immediately-after-break push-out options and jump cues. Since you mention these items, you're obviously talking about 9-ball (although 8-ballers occasionally jump as well). Adopting push-out and jump cues will do nothing for the APA "point-per-ball" system of 9-ball -- i.e. the person who continually sinks the 9-ball isn't necessarily the one who wins the match (rather, the person who reaches his/her designated point value first, does).

I agree with the others that posted here -- if you want more realistic 9-ball in the APA, play in the Masters Division. Allowing jump cues and push-outs to the regular APA "Romper Room" 9-ball format is merely applying lipstick to a pig.

-Sean
 
paksat said:
Thanks

I like their reasoning lol "because it gives an unfair advantage to people that cannot jump or don't have a jump cue"

What about the unfair advantage of playing a higher skill level opponent who has the knowledge of safety, kicks, banks, and pattern play?

Their skill ranking "equalizer" system does NOT make up that kind of ground.
Click to expand...

They make up the ground by sandbagging :wink:!

Maniac
 
From what I remember reading in the rules, Jump cues aren't specifically banned. The ruling is that you can only use one cue (other than a break cue), and also that you cannot break down a two-piece cue for a shot.

I suppose you could play your entire match with your jump cue...

I was only reading the regular APA rules, not Masters. I'm quite at home in romper room.
 
justadub said:
From what I remember reading in the rules, Jump cues aren't specifically banned. The ruling is that you can only use one cue (other than a break cue), and also that you cannot break down a two-piece cue for a shot.

I suppose you could play your entire match with your jump cue...

I was only reading the regular APA rules, not Masters. I'm quite at home in romper room.
Click to expand...
That's how our league operates as well.

According to APA the local league operator can change rules pretty much with impunity as long as they apply to everyone.

Our league does have a specific exemption for a short cue to be used in a couple of bars that have a pole which sometimes is in the way of a full length cue.

LWW
 
The jump cue rule in the APA team manual which applies to all National Events can be found on page 40 rule #33. http://www.poolplayers.com/documents/TeamManual2010.pdf

I understand that a lot of leagues "adopt" there own By-laws that may allow such equipment. In my opinion this only hurts the players. By varying the rule you can effect your handicap level for better or worse.
We have a weird 45 degree rule that allows a player to push through a non frozen ball. I think it is ridiculous but it does settle arguments without a referee.

My point is if your going to play in the APA I suggest playing by the rules they use at Nationals. Even if you don't like them, which I DON'T
 
dr2112 said:
The jump cue rule in the APA team manual which applies to all National Events can be found on page 40 rule #33. http://www.poolplayers.com/documents/TeamManual2010.pdf

I understand that a lot of leagues "adopt" there own By-laws that may allow such equipment. In my opinion this only hurts the players. By varying the rule you can effect your handicap level for better or worse.
We have a weird 45 degree rule that allows a player to push through a non frozen ball. I think it is ridiculous but it does settle arguments without a referee.

My point is if your going to play in the APA I suggest playing by the rules they use at Nationals. Even if you don't like them, which I DON'T
Click to expand...

Your "regular game cue" (the cue you make most of your shots with in a game) is the only allowed cue for jumping. See the above rule and page 97.
 
Whether or not someone can use a jump cue is, by and large, a factor of:

1. Your opponents and how sportsmanlike they wish to be.

and

2. The rules of the specific hall/bar you are playing in.

# 2...I have no issue with. The owners pay for the cloth, and they can choose not to allow shots that have the potential to damage the cloth.

# 1 on the other hand? Well, I have a certain way of looking at playing pool. I will not call a foul on my opponent for jumping/masseing unless they obviously don't know what they are doing, and come close to ripping the table cloth in half every time they try.

If a person has enough skill to pull off a good jump shot or masse on me, then by gawd, they deserve to win. As far as I am concerned, if they were able to do it, I should have gotten the CB closer to an OB, so it is my fault I lost.

My mantra when it comes to pool: "Win by making balls, not by beating your opponent over the head with a rule book."

Russ
 
paksat said:
I took a look at their manual and all it says is that you cannot do the illegal scoop shot. It says nothing regarding jump cues.

Now last night my opponent informed me that I was allowed to jump just as long as I didn't break my cue down to do it.

I'm confused, answers?
Click to expand...

yeah it sucks but go back and re-read the whole rule book. you can only execute a leagal jump shot (no soop) with your main playing cue. you can't break down or switch to a different cue. you also have no push or three foul in nine ball and slop counts in eight ball. yep, it sure ain't perfect.
 
dr2112 said:
The jump cue rule in the APA team manual which applies to all National Events can be found on page 40 rule #33. http://www.poolplayers.com/documents/TeamManual2010.pdf

I understand that a lot of leagues "adopt" there own By-laws that may allow such equipment. In my opinion this only hurts the players. By varying the rule you can effect your handicap level for better or worse.
We have a weird 45 degree rule that allows a player to push through a non frozen ball. I think it is ridiculous but it does settle arguments without a referee.

My point is if your going to play in the APA I suggest playing by the rules they use at Nationals. Even if you don't like them, which I DON'T
Click to expand...

I agree. I will also add that at the nationals they probably don't have poles closer than a cue length to the table.

Allowing a short cue for that reason is IMHO reasonable.

LWW
 
LWW said:
I agree. I will also add that at the nationals they probably don't have poles closer than a cue length to the table.

Allowing a short cue for that reason is IMHO reasonable.

LWW
Click to expand...

Without a doubt if there is an obsticle in the way the use of a short cue should be allowed.

DR
 
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