I knew it was tongue-in-cheek, but I thought it was an interesting question nevertheless. I'm sure many others felt the same way.
The HAMB system of aiming
- Thread starter Neil
- Start date
I knew it was tongue-in-cheek, but I thought it was an interesting question nevertheless. I'm sure many others felt the same way.
Your point isn't lost Neil... I hope this one isn't either:
Nobody goes on forums hyping up hamb, nobody claims it's the only thing every pro uses, nobody claims it even works on paper and can be diagrammed. If proponents of Certain sysTEms came to the table with plain speaking and a humble attitude, rather than unbelievable claims and thousand dollar bets ands personal challenges, you wouldn't see the massive skeptical backlash that demands "proof" (including, yes, paper diagrams).
The "shortcomings" won't even come up if it's presented with full disclosure and no spin:
"This is kinda complicated, it might take a while to learn, and there are parts of it you're gonna have to practice a lot to get the feel for it. But it really works, or at least it did for me... and many other people swear by it, including some very good players."
Who's gonna complain about "geometrically correct" or "video evidence" in the face of sensible and respectful attitude like that?
Nobody goes on forums hyping up hamb, nobody claims it's the only thing every pro uses, nobody claims it even works on paper and can be diagrammed. If proponents of Certain sysTEms came to the table with plain speaking and a humble attitude, rather than unbelievable claims and thousand dollar bets ands personal challenges, you wouldn't see the massive skeptical backlash that demands "proof" (including, yes, paper diagrams).
The "shortcomings" won't even come up if it's presented with full disclosure and no spin:
"This is kinda complicated, it might take a while to learn, and there are parts of it you're gonna have to practice a lot to get the feel for it. But it really works, or at least it did for me... and many other people swear by it, including some very good players."
Who's gonna complain about "geometrically correct" or "video evidence" in the face of sensible and respectful attitude like that?
I think the align-and-pivot-based system proponents should also focus more on the obvious, understandable, and unquestionable benefits of the systems.
I agree with you that all of the "marketing" and sometimes-ridiculous claims, along with all of the complicated and sometimes-unintelligible words and phrases, keep these systems more in the "mysterious religion" category.
Regards,
Dave
I agree with you that all of the "marketing" and sometimes-ridiculous claims, along with all of the complicated and sometimes-unintelligible words and phrases, keep these systems more in the "mysterious religion" category.
Regards,
Dave
We are focused on those things. Those things are nothing more than we have said for the past 15 years.
What we are interested in however is seeing YOUR PROOF that the system does not work for all shots.
Prove it. Show us what estimations you are having to make. Or do you want to say that you are not capable of using CTE and showing it's limitations because if you did use CTE then you would be magically rendered incapable of seeing the "adustments" you claim are there?
We who use CTE understand all the tangible benefits.
You, who doesn't even know how to explain what CTE is in your own words nor in Hal's, makes claims that it doesn't work for some shots and yet you won't show those shots. People have posted videos of them using CTE to make your diagrammed shots which I guess are the ones you are claiming show that CTE doesn't work. Your standard answer is that they must be deluded and making subconscious adjustments.
So it's officially a catch-22. You can't explain what CTE is and you can't disprove it either. We won't spoon-feed you through the internet and to date we can't PROVE that we aren't adjusting. It's interesting though that so many people are able to get these amazing results in so many different situations.
I guess it works "as advertised" for some people. Maybe that's the people who actually learned it and understand it?
I don't really understand why a scholar wouldn't have learned it first hand and then put up HIS OWN proof? Why didn't you do that Dave?
DAM is the best aiming system on the planet, and most of the pros use it quite successfully. With DAM and VEPS, you can make any shot on the pool table. If you watch any pro matches, or if you watch the entire VEPS series, you will see how effective DAM and VEPS are.
Can you prove to me that DAM doesn't work? And why haven't you visited me to take private lessons to learn that DAM and VEPS are the real deal? I have lots of testimonials proving how great they are. Until you visit the mountain top, you will never understand.
I think somebody should do some videos on DAM and VEPS. I think a lot of people would like to learn all of the stuff all of the pros know. Oh wait ... the videos are already available. It would still be better if you visit me for lessons, but the videos would be a good start for you.
Regards,
Dave
Oh yeah... If I had to choose between a custom cue or pool school (especially with with Randy G.) I'd play off the wall.
SAM works for me when I use it without thinking about it, just like you are saying. I just sort of point and shoot.
Mother Drills
SAM
A = E
Gotta love it...
Mike
Good point, it seems it might take that many to get the system down pat. I'm sure the system works as long as you can figure out how to work the system.
Roger
All about the eyes...........
Hi there,
One thing that happens from repetition is we naturally adjust to coordinate the eyes with the body. With something like pool we get better at seeing things even though there are numerous optical illusions to over come.
I have proven over and over that by getting the eyes in the right position any player can greatly increase their aiming ability to a higher level almost immediately. it's almost like someone just turned on the light. Or as Rodney Morris said when I showed him. I saw the light. He was totally amazed.
Many times when a player is trying to get in stroke he thinks he needs to hit a million balls to get in stroke. And there is some merit to this method. Muscle memory is one. But most of the time getting back in stroke is trying to see the shots correctly not knowing exactly where they need to be but slugging it out for months until we can naturally get them to the most correct position. getting the eyes in the most correct position is the most important part of this process.
Anyone can be taught this and cut this process down immensely. Now if you hit a million balls with getting the eyes in the perfect position you are practicing shooting when your eyes are seeing the shot correctly. Now you are practicing coordinating what the eyes see correctly so your brain can send the correct message to your body and complete the task with greater success. Now your really gaining something. And the results are almost unbelievable. Now a player that seemed to be stuck in a rut for years can increase their ability to another level rather quickly.
Many players that get there from repetition and aim well don't have a clue where the eyes need to be. Little do they know that by knowing where the eyes need to be they would not have to fear certain shots that they do have trouble with.
Any shot that you feel is a 50/50 success rate is a total failure in pool. That's why we play safe. The poorer your aim is the more you have to play safe. But the more shots you can make confidently keeps the other player from getting to the table at all and that gives you 100% success rate.
This is why some players can hit a million balls and not get to much better. The sights are off on their gun. Correct the sight and now you can hit the target.
Sometimes I feel like Columbus, And the world is still round regardless if there is still someone that thinks it's still flat.:idea::clapping:
k:
Hi there,
One thing that happens from repetition is we naturally adjust to coordinate the eyes with the body. With something like pool we get better at seeing things even though there are numerous optical illusions to over come.
I have proven over and over that by getting the eyes in the right position any player can greatly increase their aiming ability to a higher level almost immediately. it's almost like someone just turned on the light. Or as Rodney Morris said when I showed him. I saw the light. He was totally amazed.
Many times when a player is trying to get in stroke he thinks he needs to hit a million balls to get in stroke. And there is some merit to this method. Muscle memory is one. But most of the time getting back in stroke is trying to see the shots correctly not knowing exactly where they need to be but slugging it out for months until we can naturally get them to the most correct position. getting the eyes in the most correct position is the most important part of this process.
Anyone can be taught this and cut this process down immensely. Now if you hit a million balls with getting the eyes in the perfect position you are practicing shooting when your eyes are seeing the shot correctly. Now you are practicing coordinating what the eyes see correctly so your brain can send the correct message to your body and complete the task with greater success. Now your really gaining something. And the results are almost unbelievable. Now a player that seemed to be stuck in a rut for years can increase their ability to another level rather quickly.
Many players that get there from repetition and aim well don't have a clue where the eyes need to be. Little do they know that by knowing where the eyes need to be they would not have to fear certain shots that they do have trouble with.
Any shot that you feel is a 50/50 success rate is a total failure in pool. That's why we play safe. The poorer your aim is the more you have to play safe. But the more shots you can make confidently keeps the other player from getting to the table at all and that gives you 100% success rate.
This is why some players can hit a million balls and not get to much better. The sights are off on their gun. Correct the sight and now you can hit the target.
Sometimes I feel like Columbus, And the world is still round regardless if there is still someone that thinks it's still flat.:idea::clapping:
k:
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Columbus
The folks in Portugal were well aware the world was round. They were also well aware that it was a heck of a lot bigger than Columbus thought. They wouldn't back him out of better information, not less. Columbus misjudged the size of the world, it being three times bigger than he thought the best I recall.
Columbus didn't know where he was going, didn't know where he was at when he got there, and did it all on somebody else's dime. Are you sure you really want to compare yourself to Columbus?
Hu
Hi there,
One thing that happens from repetition is we naturally adjust to coordinate the eyes with the body. With something like pool we get better at seeing things even though there are numerous optical illusions to over come.
I have proven over and over that by getting the eyes in the right position any player can greatly increase their aiming ability to a higher level almost immediately. it's almost like someone just turned on the light. Or as Rodney Morris said when I showed him. I saw the light. He was totally amazed.
Many times when a player is trying to get in stroke he thinks he needs to hit a million balls to get in stroke. And there is some merit to this method. Muscle memory is one. But most of the time getting back in stroke is trying to see the shots correctly not knowing exactly where they need to be but slugging it out for months until we can naturally get them to the most correct position. getting the eyes in the most correct position is the most important part of this process.
Anyone can be taught this and cut this process down immensely. Now if you hit a million balls with getting the eyes in the perfect position you are practicing shooting when your eyes are seeing the shot correctly. Now you are practicing coordinating what the eyes see correctly so your brain can send the correct message to your body and complete the task with greater success. Now your really gaining something. And the results are almost unbelievable. Now a player that seemed to be stuck in a rut for years can increase their ability to another level rather quickly.
Many players that get there from repetition and aim well don't have a clue where the eyes need to be. Little do they know that by knowing where the eyes need to be they would not have to fear certain shots that they do have trouble with.
Any shot that you feel is a 50/50 success rate is a total failure in pool. That's why we play safe. The poorer your aim is the more you have to play safe. But the more shots you can make confidently keeps the other player from getting to the table at all and that gives you 100% success rate.
This is why some players can hit a million balls and not get to much better. The sights are off on their gun. Correct the sight and now you can hit the target.
Sometimes I feel like Columbus, And the world is still round regardless if there is still someone that thinks it's still flat.:idea::clapping:
The folks in Portugal were well aware the world was round. They were also well aware that it was a heck of a lot bigger than Columbus thought. They wouldn't back him out of better information, not less. Columbus misjudged the size of the world, it being three times bigger than he thought the best I recall.
Columbus didn't know where he was going, didn't know where he was at when he got there, and did it all on somebody else's dime. Are you sure you really want to compare yourself to Columbus?
Hu
You are missing the point of contact that you need to aim to make the OB go where you want.
The whole purpose of shooting a Million balls is repeatability. Be able to have a repeatable stroke and sensing where you need to make contact between the OB and CB to have the OB and CB go where you want. The way to start is you use the ghost ball technique. Using this while working on your stroke you shoot a million balls and hopefully you will develop into a shooter. Form there you work on the other parts of the game.
Columbus didn't know where he was going, didn't know where he was at when he got there, and did it all on somebody else's dime. Are you sure you really want to compare yourself to Columbus?
Is that Columbus Cowboy you're talking about? :grin-square:
The folks in Portugal were well aware the world was round. They were also well aware that it was a heck of a lot bigger than Columbus thought. They wouldn't back him out of better information, not less. Columbus misjudged the size of the world, it being three times bigger than he thought the best I recall.
Columbus didn't know where he was going, didn't know where he was at when he got there, and did it all on somebody else's dime. Are you sure you really want to compare yourself to Columbus?
Hu
In the U.S.A. we celebrate a Columbus Day Holiday, history has show Columbus never set foot in America!
See what I mean?
I pretty much guarantee that if you hit a million balls using CTE then you will become a world class player.
If you are not made to struggle with ghost ball and shifted (guessing) english then you can really work on the finer points of the game.
It's really amazing to me what having a way to aim which takes the guesswork out it does for my game.
And like Dave said it's another tool in the toolbox. I have tools in my shop that I barely know how to use, some which aren't even very good for task. However some of them are indispensable.
The ones I need to master are the ones I focus on. With my laser for example I can do much more than a lot of people who also have a laser because the use the tool for a limited set of tasks while I have used mine for a wide range of tasks.
As a result my skill set with the laser is at a decently high level. But there are people who have taken it much much farther than me an they produce art work that is amazing.
Neil,
when i read your initial post i smiled, when i read the responses i laughed. after all the years you've posted i was surprised how few got your sense of humour.
anyway, i was reminded of a quote from lee trevino back in the 70's when he was on his game. how does one get to your level he was asked, go to the range and hit a million balls like i did was his response. HAMB has a lot of validation IMO.
when i read your initial post i smiled, when i read the responses i laughed. after all the years you've posted i was surprised how few got your sense of humour.
anyway, i was reminded of a quote from lee trevino back in the 70's when he was on his game. how does one get to your level he was asked, go to the range and hit a million balls like i did was his response. HAMB has a lot of validation IMO.
Or like the America's Got Talent winner Terry Fator said, 'any ten year old kid can do what I do if he has put ten thousand hours into it'.
Lee Trevino is like the Keith McReady of golf - right guy - right opportunity - right mindset - not only did he train himself buty he learned the hard way by getting in the grease for the cash. That will toughen you up quick or bust you for good.
There is NO DOUBT that really hitting thousands of balls a week is not going to make you better IF you have the aptitude to correct yourself when things aren't happening as they should.
I got to be a decent player using the HAMB method. But still there were a lot of shots I dreaded in match play. After learning the system and practicing with it those shots became normal to me.
I read on Lee Trevino's bio that he developed his own compensation or system to make up for a chronic hook that he had. So if people can do that then the HAMB method is great. If they can't then maybe some type of help will take them to another level.