New Product: i4pool's SLUG DOCTOR TIGHT RACK SYSTEM

[DogsPlayingPool]

I like rack spots for every game except one pocket.

No idea if there is any trademark/patent/similar issue regarding Japan and/or Grace's import of the product.

As a consumer, I would say that the Slug Doctor appears to be the best implementation in the sense that it is so reusable and economical.

I showed this to the pool hall owner who imports rack spots from Japan and he told me that he had already tried the Avery labels (because they were less expensive) and that they didn't work as well as the rack spots. His comment was that the Avery labels were not holding the balls well enough with a single label. If he put two labels layered on top of each other it worked well, but then the label was a bit too thick (could interfere with play).

It sounded like someone earlier in this thread had indicated that these spots were used in a tournament or tournaments with great success. But now I'm not clear whether it was the Avery labels or the "real" rack spots product. Can anyone clarify?

They are very thin so I can understand what your room owner is saying. The SD resolves this problem by the close tolerances built into it that puts the dots in EXACTLY the correct spot to get the balls to lean in a bit. The thinness of the spots are a big plus in that they basically eliminate any interference with roll.

---------

To call the Slug Doctor an imitation of anything is inaccurate at best and an ill-advised and lame attempt at sabotage at worst. Whoever invented the triangle would have a better case against the Delta rack. The SD is an appliance of original design for setting perforations available at any office supply store to a table that results in a perfect rack every time that is identical and equitable for both opponents every game.

The inventor of the Slug Doctor is an engineer by background and has designed other racking systems that have been successfully used in professional tournaments. I know him to be a lover of pool and by nature enjoys taking a project and engineering it to improve upon what he has seen out there. I highly doubt he is in it only for the money or he would have made it flimsier, developed a proprietary spot that alone could be used with his applicator and template, and only would have provided enough dots for one application, all to garner increased repeat business. I think the guy is a pool player who has found a way to contribute something of benefit to players, table owners, room operators and promoters – all at low cost. Frankly, we need more like him in this game.

------

JohnPT,the product is new but I’ve heard of no problems with several months of service and it is certainly possible they would only need to be replaced when new cloth is installed. If a dot or two should come loose it would take one or two minutes to replace it with the SD, no need to redo the entire rack or buy another rack.

 

[rattleryan9]

I have played many racks on this product. From 1 pockett,8ball ,9ball and 10 ball. I have even played a game with different set up shots called golf. This product is amazing and if you have not ordered one do so. It is well worth it!
RattleRyan9

 

[poolhustler]

Am I the only one that does not like to feel slick spots under my fingers instead of cloth when I shoot? It just bothers me, and then I think of the little tape thingy instead of the shot. Pet peeve I guess.

You're not alone!! I had the same issue for a while when shooting a shot over the foot spot. I missed shots because I was too focused on whether or not the spot would affect the shot. Especially if I was slow rolling a shot. I got over that and have had no issue with the reinforcement labels on my table.

 

[DogsPlayingPool]

Am I the only one that does not like to feel slick spots under my fingers instead of cloth when I shoot? It just bothers me, and then I think of the little tape thingy instead of the shot. Pet peeve I guess.

Naw, there's you and then Johnny Archer probably. :grin-square:

 

[i4pool]

Preliminary Results: SD-910 Might Work for 8-Ball!

The template you provide can be made to work well to mark a 15 ball rack. Just do the positions provided then move the template twice to position the last row of 5 (4 more . One would need be very careful to center the already positioned labels before setting the two on either side.

It isn't like you would be doing this often (hopefully).

Are these the standard clear Avery reinforcement labels?

The Slug-Doctor SD-910 looks like it'll work for 8-Ball too!

My first preliminary test was done on a banged up table with nappy cloth and balls that weren't all the same size. I still need to verify this on a good table and a good set of balls but the preliminary results look good!

Thanks to Underclocked I had to try this out. It did not appear so cut and dry at first but I believe I found what is going to work. Please see below pic. Hopefully it makes sense. If not, I'd be glad to further explain.

 

[TATE]

Abe,

We used your system at Russ's place and it was flawless. There was considerably less interference than other comparable systems. I think it's brilliant.

Chris

 

[JohnnyShakes]

Works great with a normal triangle, too

Abe,

Thanks for the pictures on how to set it up for 8-ball. Hope this doesn't kill a future 8-ball version of the Slug Doctor. I just thought I'd mention to everyone that I've found that once you have the Slug Doctor on your table, it makes racking with a normal triangle much easier. Just throw the balls in, slide them up and bam!, they're locked in place. No more worries about the balls rolling off or rolling out. For an impatient guy with shaky hands, this is a godsend. I don't mind rolling the balls in one at a time, a la Magic Rack, but having the ability to get a frozen rack with a triangle in perfect alignment is a huge plus for me. One of the biggest reasons I like this more than the Magic Rack. I've been doing it this way for about a month now in my late night, can't sleep practice sessions, and I haven't had any problems with the dots peeling up, either, which I was initially concerned with. Great product, and thanks again for the pictures on 8-ball setup.

Johnny

 

[i4pool]

Abe,

We used your system at Russ's place and it was flawless. There was considerably less interference than other comparable systems. I think it's brilliant.

Chris

Hi Chris-- I'm so glad you like it. Thank you. I'm sorry we didn't get to meet up previously. I'm in Glendale occasionally to visit my folks. Maybe we could shoot some next time I'm down in the area?

Abe,

Thanks for the pictures on how to set it up for 8-ball. Hope this doesn't kill a future 8-ball version of the Slug Doctor. I just thought I'd mention to everyone that I've found that once you have the Slug Doctor on your table, it makes racking with a normal triangle much easier. Just throw the balls in, slide them up and bam!, they're locked in place. No more worries about the balls rolling off or rolling out. For an impatient guy with shaky hands, this is a godsend. I don't mind rolling the balls in one at a time, a la Magic Rack, but having the ability to get a frozen rack with a triangle in perfect alignment is a huge plus for me. One of the biggest reasons I like this more than the Magic Rack. I've been doing it this way for about a month now in my late night, can't sleep practice sessions, and I haven't had any problems with the dots peeling up, either, which I was initially concerned with. Great product, and thanks again for the pictures on 8-ball setup.

Johnny

Johnny,
This is a really good point about still being able to use the triangle. Question... when you roll the balls up how do you know where to stop? Do you have an alignment mark(s) on the back of your rack that you align to a mark(s) on your table? Just curious... cuz I've been thinking about this sort of thing (alignment marks) to maybe incorporate but didn't know if it would be useful.

Thanks for your feedback!

Regards,
Abe - i4pool

 

[sfleinen]

Hi Chris-- I'm so glad you like it. Thank you. I'm sorry we didn't get to meet up previously. I'm in Glendale occasionally to visit my folks. Maybe we could shoot some next time I'm down in the area?



Johnny,
This is a really good point about still being able to use the triangle. Question... when you roll the balls up how do you know where to stop? Do you have an alignment mark(s) on the back of your rack that you align to a mark(s) on your table? Just curious... cuz I've been thinking about this sort of thing (alignment marks) to maybe incorporate but didn't know if it would be useful.

Thanks for your feedback!

Regards,
Abe - i4pool

Abe:

It's actually easier than that (i.e. no alignment mark needed on the rack). When you roll the triangle (with 15 balls in it) up to the racking area, you can actually "see" the balls settle into the holes in the Arco labels. You just use a normal racking movement, slide the rack (carefully -- not "sloshing" the balls like bangers do) upwards into position, and you get the "feel" for when to stop. The balls just settle into place.

Now I don't have your product, but the idea to use Arco labels to hold balls in place (e.g. for racking, for trickshots, for practicing certain shots over and over and making sure you place the balls in the same spot everytime, etc.) is very old. The introduction of the competing Magic Rack product introduced the idea of making sure the "holes" are precision-placed, albeit on a single sheet of plastic/acetate.

I'd used Arco labels for the racking idea for quite some time. It took me almost an hour of carefully measuring (and peeling/replacing labels) to get it right. But your tool is a godsend in accurately placing those labels.

There is one problem, though, with the whole "sheet of plastic -or- Arco labels on the cloth idea" -- and that's 14.1 straight pool. Straight pool requires precision maneuvering of the cue ball and object balls in/around the rack area, and I've seen where the Arco labels (including those really thin clear plastic ones) interrupted the roll of a ball. In 14.1, you're commonly bumping and nudging balls into place -- e.g. break balls, and key balls to the break ball. The Arco labels -- including the really thin ones -- interrupt a slow-rolling ball (e.g. one that's been bumped or nudged) enough, that the final placement of the ball is different than if the Arco label it rolled over weren't even there. (This is especially true if the ball rolls over the edge of the Arco label -- I've seen balls "hook" and/or settle against the very edge of the Arco label, stopping it from continuing to roll, thereby ruining a possible intended break ball that was carefully nudged with the intent to make it a break ball.) This is the same issue, by the way, why tapped tables are NEVER used in 14.1 -- balls roll through that tapped area as if they were a drunkard walking down the street and bouncing off of lamp posts.

Thus, unfortunately, I've had to abandon the use of Arco labels when playing 14.1, and use as precise a racking instrument as possible. With 8-ball, it's really a non-issue, and thus the Arco label idea is FANTASTIC for use in 8-ball matches. Just not 14.1, unfortunately.

Hope this is helpful,
-Sean

 

[hangemhigh]

Naw, there's you and then Johnny Archer probably. :grin-square:

I'm afflicted with OCD, I know it, LOL.

 

[i4pool]

Abe:

It's actually easier than that (i.e. no alignment mark needed on the rack). When you roll the triangle (with 15 balls in it) up to the racking area, you can actually "see" the balls settle into the holes in the Arco labels. You just use a normal racking movement, slide the rack (carefully -- not "sloshing" the balls like bangers do) upwards into position, and you get the "feel" for when to stop. The balls just settle into place.

That's cool. This is really good to know. And does it work just as easy with 9-ball/10-ball? I assume it does.

There is one problem, though, with the whole "sheet of plastic -or- Arco labels on the cloth idea" -- and that's 14.1 straight pool. Straight pool requires precision maneuvering of the cue ball and object balls in/around the rack area, and I've seen where the Arco labels (including those really thin clear plastic ones) interrupted the roll of a ball. In 14.1, you're commonly bumping and nudging balls into place -- e.g. break balls, and key balls to the break ball. The Arco labels -- including the really thin ones -- interrupt a slow-rolling ball (e.g. one that's been bumped or nudged) enough, that the final placement of the ball is different than if the Arco label it rolled over weren't even there. (This is especially true if the ball rolls over the edge of the Arco label -- I've seen balls "hook" and/or settle against the very edge of the Arco label, stopping it from continuing to roll, thereby ruining a possible intended break ball that was carefully nudged with the intent to make it a break ball.) This is the same issue, by the way, why tapped tables are NEVER used in 14.1 -- balls roll through that tapped area as if they were a drunkard walking down the street and bouncing off of lamp posts.

Thus, unfortunately, I've had to abandon the use of Arco labels when playing 14.1, and use as precise a racking instrument as possible. With 8-ball, it's really a non-issue, and thus the Arco label idea is FANTASTIC for use in 8-ball matches. Just not 14.1, unfortunately.

Sean- This helps a lot! Thanks for taking the time to respond. Very good input with regards to 14.1. I would assume similar issues could arise with 1 Pocket too hugh? It's nice to hear that you feel a product like this would be good for 8-ball as well.

 

[sfleinen]

That's cool. This is really good to know. And does it work just as easy with 9-ball/10-ball? I assume it does.




Sean- This helps a lot! Thanks for taking the time to respond. Very good input with regards to 14.1. I would assume similar issues could arise with 1 Pocket too hugh? It's nice to hear that you feel a product like this would be good for 8-ball as well.

Hi Abe!

To answer the first question, yes, it indeed works just as easy with 9-/10-ball. No different. One "gotcha" though -- you have to make sure your rack itself doesn't "snag" on the Arco labels as it passes over them. The Delta-13 (both regular edition as well as Elite edition) are the best in not snagging on them. Other wood racks, especially if they are worn/splintered, will "catch" or "snag" on the Arco labels. Plastic racks as well -- you know how plastic has the habit of "blistering" when it receives an impact from something sharp? Most well-used plastic racks I've seen are riddled with those blisters and other gouges. Those blisters/gouges will catch or snag onto the Arco labels as well, forcing them to peel up. Unless the aluminum is SERIOUSLY damaged, a metal rack like the Delta-13 easily glides over the Arco labels, never snagging. Anyway, I don't mean to plug another racking product in your thread, but I wanted to give you this little heads-up, in case you want to put it in your marketing literature and User Guides. Explain the virtues of using a rack in conjunction with the placed/adhered Arco labels (i.e. speed -- you don't have to manually place the balls a row at a time), but also warn the user should check the condition of his/her rack, checking for wear, splinters, blisters, gouges, etc. Some sandpaper and elbow grease should fix this right up. Maybe even a light coat of Pledge or ArmorAll or something. A metal rack like the Delta-13 needs no maintenance, as long as it hasn't been hurled across the room against a brick wall, or out the window into the pavement.

As for One Pocket, honestly, I haven't run into the same issues as with 14.1, only because when I'm shooting through the rack area, more often than not, I'm trying to get through the rack area with a little speed, to get to the other side. Very rarely do I find myself gently bumping and nudging balls, because if I'm doing that, I'm also trying to get the cue ball to the other side of the table (read: using a little bit of force -- enough to override any resistance/effect from the Arco labels). Or if I want to keep the cue ball on the side of the table I'm shooting from, I'm applying draw to pull it back (read: again, a little bit of force). I guess only if one is going for a safety against the pack, rolling the cue ball up against it and trying to dislodge a ball out on the other side of the rack to contact a cushion, would the issue arise with a gently rolling ball being affected by the Arco labels. (I.e. you would have to hit the cue ball ever-so-slightly more than normal, to get an object ball "unseated" from its little divot and get it rolling to contact a cushion so as to avoid losing a point -- but the risk is that if you hit the cue ball too hard, something else may leak out of the rack in another direction, and you could sell out.) But I would take that minor risk -- because One Pocket is a short-point game (i.e. unlike 14.1, the total amount of points to win the game is less than the number of balls in the rack itself). So I would say that the Arco labels are great for One Pocket -- your product would be welcomed here!

The difference with 14.1 is that it's a long-point game -- just because a rack has been cleared, doesn't mean you've won the game yet. You have to get from one rack to another, to another, stringing them along in a run. That means every single object ball and cue ball placement is crucial in continuing your run and keeping your side of the game alive. If the placement of a break ball was fouled up (e.g. an Arco label interferes as I'd mentioned), you'll find yourself either shooting a much more difficult break shot, or else deciding that your run has pretty much ended, and now you have to play a safety -- cursing like a trucker the entire time when you saw your gently bumped/nudged ball "hook" or "settle" when it contacted an Arco label.

I hope that's additionally helpful!
-Sean

 

[DogsPlayingPool]

Sean, good points about having them on the table when playing straight pool, a game I play a lot. Nice thing about the SD is that it doesn't take an hour of careful manual placement to get the spots in the correct places. With the template it takes maybe a few minutes tops so I'm thinking it is not as big a deal to take them off for straight pool and put them back on for 8-9-10 Ball.

 

[sfleinen]

Sean, good points about having them on the table when playing straight pool, a game I play a lot. Nice thing about the SD is that it doesn't take an hour of careful manual placement to get the spots in the correct places. With the template it takes maybe a few minutes tops so I'm thinking it is not as big a deal to take them off for straight pool and put them back on for 8-9-10 Ball.

Bingo! Excellent point, Dogs! You're right, the beauty about the Slug Doctor is the ease and quickness of accurately placing a set of those Arco labels back. As you noted, I had a heck of a time measuring/peeling/replacing the Arco labels until I got them just right. (And going through a lot of them in the process -- for when you peel them up from the cloth, they're full of little fibers and particulate, and won't adhere any longer. Once you peel them up, you have to throw them away.)

Abe, Dogs make a great point, and I think worthy of amendment into the User Guide.

Thanks!
-Sean

 

[i4pool]

...

I hope that's additionally helpful!
-Sean

Yes, this has been very helpful. Unlike you and Dogs, I don't have much experience with 14.1 or 1P. As a matter of fact, I can say that I've never played either format enough times to even know what the basic rules and strategy are. Lol. So your input has helped me to better understand how the SD fits (or doesn't) in the world of 14.1 and 1P. Thank you.

With regards to racks snagging the labels, this is a very good point. I think this is very important to know and I like your suggestions. Something I will have to add to the user guide and any future marketing lit.

I don't mind the Delta-13 plug at all. It was clearly part of the current conversation.

Sean, good points about having them on the table when playing straight pool, a game I play a lot. Nice thing about the SD is that it doesn't take an hour of careful manual placement to get the spots in the correct places. With the template it takes maybe a few minutes tops so I'm thinking it is not as big a deal to take them off for straight pool and put them back on for 8-9-10 Ball.

Bingo! Excellent point, Dogs! You're right, the beauty about the Slug Doctor is the ease and quickness of accurately placing a set of those Arco labels back. As you noted, I had a heck of a time measuring/peeling/replacing the Arco labels until I got them just right. (And going through a lot of them in the process -- for when you peel them up from the cloth, they're full of little fibers and particulate, and won't adhere any longer. Once you peel them up, you have to throw them away.)

Abe, Dogs make a great point, and I think worthy of amendment into the User Guide.

Thanks!
-Sean

Sean & Dogs- I really do appreciate your input, really good stuff. I will most likely be ammending the guide this weekend to reflect your points made.

Btw, Arco Labels? Is that just the name brand that you were using? Ones I use are Avery brand.

Best,
Abe - i4pool

 

[8ballEinstein]

Endorsed by none other than ...

Abe, I'm glad your product is catching on. It is the next level in the development of racking systems and has my full endorsement (of course that may not mean much since I'm a nobody in the pool world, but hey, at the very least I'm a legend in my own mind). :smile:

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Works Great

My Slug Doctor arrived yesterday and I took it to the pool hall last night to try it out. The "donuts" installed quickly and easily, as advertised, and the pool hall owner had no problem with me setting it up on his table because it's obvious that they come off without hassle (in fact, we took it off after our match - took maybe fifteen seconds).

The rack worked perfectly for all games: 9-ball, 10-ball and full racks were no problem - even though the last 4 balls of a full rack have no donuts to rest in, it's easy to snug them up against the other balls that do.

It takes a little practice (maybe two or three racks) to get really quick at racking the balls; they're easily nudged off their little donuts when bumped with another ball, so you have to learn to set them in place gently (and the best order to set them - i.e., front to back, middle to outside). But once you get the hang of it things go quickly and smoothly every time, giving a perfect rack every time.

I played many games of one pocket, with balls constantly occupying and being played in the rack area, and never had a single ball or shot affected in the slightest by the donuts. I even tried many times to roll a ball across the rack area very slowly by hand to see if I could make something happen, but was never able to, even watching very closely. I couldn't even feel the donuts when I rubbed my open hand across the rack area.

I removed the donuts from the table when I was done playing last night (want to ease the room owner into the idea of letting me leave them on the table), but they seemed to be sticky enough and low-profile enough that they might last a few days of bangers sliding triangle racks over them before needing to be replaced. So, given the ease of removing and reinstalling them (and the low cost of the Avery donuts), I think they can work on pool hall tables even where everybody else uses triangles to rack.

Having perfect racks every time was interesting and educational, but to be perfectly honest I'm not sure it's what I want. The randomness of imperfect racks and the casual ritual of reaching for and racking with a triangle are part of pool's attractiveness for me, so I don't know if I want to lose that. But if it turns out that I do, Slug Doctor is definitely the way I'll do it.

pj
chgo

 

[sfleinen]

[...]
With regards to racks snagging the labels, this is a very good point. I think this is very important to know and I like your suggestions. Something I will have to add to the user guide and any future marketing lit.

I don't mind the Delta-13 plug at all. It was clearly part of the current conversation.

Hi Abe! Yes, I just used the Delta-13 as an example of a rack that, even with heavy use, won't be a "problem child" with snagging the labels. Some of those pool hall racks have "seen better days," and unless they are in very good condition, will usually have splintering, blistering, and other imperfections that occur from the user tossing it onto the floor underneath the table after he/she just racked, or else putting it up onto the table light (there's lots of dust, dirt and particulate up there), aggressively slamming it into the steel wire rack bracket just under the ball return, or onto the rack "hook" on the side of the table next to the ball return. All these maneuvers apply damage to a wooden or plastic rack.

Sean & Dogs- I really do appreciate your input, really good stuff. I will most likely be ammending the guide this weekend to reflect your points made.

Btw, Arco Labels? Is that just the name brand that you were using? Ones I use are Avery brand.

Best,
Abe - i4pool

Yup, I used the brand "Arco" -- it's a very old name brand, on the same level as Avery. They're more known for pre-printed labels (e.g. "Fragile", "Corrosive", "Electro-static Sensitive"), and standard peel-and-stick label paper, like that which you feed into dot-matrix or laser printers for printing peel-and-stick labels in bulk. But they do make hold reinforcers ("donuts") for loose-leaf paper, just like Avery does.

http://arcopackaging.com/packaging.html

[...]
I played many games of one pocket, with balls constantly occupying and being played in the rack area, and never had a single ball or shot affected in the slightest by the donuts. I even tried many times to roll a ball across the rack area very slowly by hand to see if I could make something happen, but was never able to, even watching very closely. I couldn't even feel the donuts when I rubbed my open hand across the rack area.
[...]

The only thing that I can think of to explain the situation that Pat encountered, is that there's a difference between Arco and Avery labels. Like I mentioned all along, I'd used Arco labels for this task. Arco makes the really thin acetate donuts just like Avery, and I *did* see that the labels were slightly intrusive to a slow-rolling ball.

However, methinks Pat might've discovered a difference between the two brands, inadvertently (obviously Pat used the Avery labels that came with the Slug Doctor). I'm thinking one or both of the following could be coming into play:

1. There's a difference between the Arco and Avery brands -- i.e. the Avery brand is thinner.

2. There's a difference between the cloth I used, and that which Pat used. I sometimes play on worsted cloth (like Simonis, Milliken), but I most often play on nap cloth. The "difference" might be the nap/smooth/nap transition as the ball is rolling over the label -- regardless of the label's brand. Meaning, the ball is rolling over nap, then encounters the glassy-smoothness of the label, then nap cloth again as it rolls over the "hole" in the label, then glassy-smoothness of the label, then nap cloth again. The characteristics of the nap cloth are different from worsted cloth -- we all know that. Perhaps this is the difference?

Anyway, thanks for the report, Pat! I'm ordering my Slug Doctor from Abe today, and will try this on worsted cloth.

-Sean

 

[Patrick Johnson]

The only thing that I can think of to explain the situation that Pat encountered, is that there's a difference between Arco and Avery labels.

It could also be that I just never recreated the kind of thing that might be a minor problem (a ball slowing to a stop as it encounters a donut). But then that must mean that it happens so seldom that it's probably not worth worrying about.

BTW, I was playing on worn Simonis 860.

pj
chgo

 

[Robert Raiford]

I just thought I'd mention to everyone that I've found that once you have the Slug Doctor on your table, it makes racking with a normal triangle much easier. Just throw the balls in, slide them up and bam!, they're locked in place.

I do the same thing. Why go to the hassle of manually placing balls individually when the rack gets you there in 2 seconds?

Robert