WOW!!! Really!!!!

richiebalto said:
Ok so you would call a foul on your self but u wouldnt tell your opponent that he was shooting the wrong ball,now you say at the top of ur post that it a lack of focus on your opponent part for not paying attention,well isnt that the same as ur opponent not paying attention to the game when a foul occurs.
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I see exactly what you're saying, and I guess the best explanation I can give is this: If I'm at the table, I'm going to be honest to myself and to him. When he's at the table, it isn't my obligation to tell him he's doing something wrong during a situation that he himself has control over.

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spanky79 said:
Did the ref make a mistake yes.

Should Shane be mad, not in my opinion.

I have told my opponent he was shooting the wrong ball more then once.
He shouldn't of scratched.

Should Darrel be punished for not paying attention, well there is another conversation.

Just don't scratch Shane
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Yes Shane should be mad. This is his JOB. This isnt some local tournament for a 15 dollar buy in. Add this to another reason why pool will never improve or get big. Its a damn shame.
 
Jeff G. Martin said:
I see exactly what you're saying, and I guess the best explanation I can give is this: If I'm at the table, I'm going to be honest to myself and to him. When he's at the table, it isn't my obligation to tell him he's doing something wrong during a situation that he himself has control over.

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Nice post JEFF,i do understand that!
 
ottersbro said:
at no time should the outcome of the game be determined by the ref.

it's one thing to tell your opponent that their about to shoot the wrong ball, if the game is meaningless, but when you do it for a living, thats another issue.
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Well said. I agree. Business is business. Johnnyt
 
Who was the REf betting ON.

He should be reprimanded ,reminded and then if it happens again shot. Thats a big chunk of change -thanks for nothing ref- Mark- Yes I'm in Shanes corner always- get used to it.
 
Wondering if any of you think that Darryl had a obligation to step in and admit to what would've occurred if the ref had not stepped in? In other words give the table back to Shane.
 
nplum24 said:
Wondering if any of you think that Darryl had a obligation to step in and admit to what would've occurred if the ref had not stepped in? In other words give the table back to Shane.
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He probably convinced himself quickly that he probably would have realized his mistake. But really, he should have intentionally fouled.
 
I only got 2 things to say about that.....

1. That is crap.....

2. How do I wish that would of happen during a Earl S. match, and I was there in person to watch the show..........lol
 
FranCrimi said:
This is clearly a case of a ref not knowing what a ref does. A referee is not allowed to voluntarily assist a player to futher his progress in a match. A player may ask the ref what ball he is shooting because he may be color blind and can't tell the 2 from the 4 and both numbers may be hidden. Then the ref may answer the question. But that's completely different from telling a player he's about to shoot the wrong ball.

I don't blame Shane for being upset about it. He was wronged.

---Just like a player can't talk to his opponent while his opponent is at the table shooting, even to tell him he's about to shoot the wrong ball. It's considered unsportsmanlike to talk to your opponent while they are at the table. The only time a player can interrupt his opponent would be for a reason like asking for a call on a hit, but not to tell him that he's about to foul.
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Thanks for this post. Until I read it I would definetly have agreed that the right thing to do is to tell your opponent he's shooting the wrong ball. Who would want to win that way? But, the rules indicate that you're not to talk to your opponent while shooting. So, although I don't like it, Shane has a right to be peeved at the ref for violating the rules.
 
:confused:...Telling your opponent he's shooting the wrong ball can lead to a very thin wallet
 
It's a shame when one considers how much time/effort and dollars go in to create a classy venue for our sport, that they then hire someone without the needed skills to back up all the prior efforts needed to represent their venue properly. Tho just yesterday while watching the PGA Players tournament, overheard Johnny Miller comment on how great a job the PGA employed people whom clear the audience from the ball area in an out of bounds situation, ironically are most likely the only person who's still in the way.
 
Jeff G. Martin said:
I see exactly what you're saying, and I guess the best explanation I can give is this: If I'm at the table, I'm going to be honest to myself and to him. When he's at the table, it isn't my obligation to tell him he's doing something wrong during a situation that he himself has control over.
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I couldn't agree more. Nice post.
 
Island Drive said:
It's a shame when one considers how much time/effort and dollars go in to create a classy venue for our sport, that they then hire someone without the needed skills to back up all the prior efforts needed to represent their venue properly. Tho just yesterday while watching the PGA Players tournament, overheard Johnny Miller comment on how great a job the PGA employed people whom clear the audience from the ball area in an out of bounds situation, ironically are most likely the only person who's still in the way.
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I don't know this for a fact, but maybe 98% of the time, the ref did a good job. It's hard to cover every single set of 'what if's' when training. I bet there were a lot of mishaps in the PGA, and as they went along, they learned from those mistakes and corrected them. This was an unfortunate incident that needs correcting so it doesn't happen again.
 
ArizonaPete said:
Thanks for this post. Until I read it I would definetly have agreed that the right thing to do is to tell your opponent he's shooting the wrong ball. Who would want to win that way? But, the rules indicate that you're not to talk to your opponent while shooting. So, although I don't like it, Shane has a right to be peeved at the ref for violating the rules.
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Your welcome. One of the important aspects of rules is to take away the burden of having to make choices a player shouldn't have to make. For instance: Regarding the 15 minute late rule: If a match is called, then the players have 15 minutes to show up. So if a player shows up 20 minutes late, asking to play the match, the burdon of allowing the match to be played or to take the win should not be on the back of the opponent who showed up on time.

Deciding whether or not to inform your opponent that he's shooting the wrong ball should not be a choice that an opponent should have to make, as well as the possibility that it could be conceived as a distraction to the player at the table. Therefore, the rules of sportsmanlike conduct are designed to make those choices for the player. Unfortunately, they have to be enforced more regularly in order for players in the chair to stop thinking they have those choices to make.
 
From the official Regulations:

8. Instructions for Referees
The referee will determine all matters of fact relating to the rules, maintain fair playing conditions, call fouls, and take other action as required by these rules. The referee will suspend play when conditions do not permit fair play. Play will also be suspended when a call or ruling is being disputed. The referee will announce fouls and other specific situations as required by the rules. He will answer questions as required by the rules on matters such as foul count. He must not give advice on the application of the rules, or other points of play on which he is not required by the rules to speak. He may assist the player by getting and replacing the mechanical bridge. If necessary for the shot, the referee or a deputy may hold the light fixture out of the way.
When a game has a three-foul rule, the referee should note to the players any second foul at the time that it occurs and also when the player who is on two fouls returns to the table. The first warning is not required by the rules but is meant to prevent later misunderstandings. If there is a scoreboard on which the foul count is visible to the players, it satisfies the warning requirement.

9. Referee’s Responsiveness
The referee shall answer players’ inquiries regarding objective data, such as whether a ball will be in the rack, whether a ball is behind the head string, what the count is, how many points are needed for a victory, if a player or his opponent is on a foul, what rule would apply if a certain shot is made, etc. When asked for a clarification of a rule, the referee will explain the applicable rule to the best of his ability, but any misstatement by the referee will not protect a player from enforcement of the actual rules. The referee must not offer or provide any subjective opinion that would affect play, such as whether a good hit can be made on a prospective shot, whether a combination can be made, or how the table seems to be playing, etc.​
 
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