Why don't pool's best and brightest try to break into the snooker scene in the UK?

[Black-Balled]

I remember watching that match. As for making the transition one way or the other, I would think Allison's transition from snooker to pool was at least moderately successful.

But the snooker/ pool comparison falls to pieces when you flip from women's to men's context.

 

[Black-Balled]

I wonder if the people in power in the UK would allow foreignersw to come and work in their country. Playing Snooker is working, and you would need a work permit.

So...you are saying (non-US) pros who come to USA to play events have work visas? You are living in a fantasy world.

Bet your next taco hell tip on it, please.

 

[Cameron Smith]

As similar as it may seem, it's an entirely different game. It's not like they can buy a snooker cue practice for a few weeks and then qualify. There is a lot more to it.

Just going by my own personal experience, I started playing snooker after spending most of my time on a pool table. I thought it would be a relatively smooth transition, and boy was I wrong. I'm still trying to get my playing level on par with my pool ability. Outside of the obvious challenges around adapting to the balls and size of the table (it takes a little while to become accustom to how the balls react off the rails), there is a lot of strategy you need to learn much like in one pocket. The ability to run centuries means very little as top snooker players won't even give you that chance. They simply would have to put an awful lot of time adapting their game and practicing with top snooker players. And playing against top players is a very different experience. One may play against some low level players who give up plenty of opportunities run a few hundreds and a couple 70's and think they're ready for england, but the truth is the game changes significantly when you have an excellent tactical player in front of you.

The other issue is that they can't just waltz in and hope to compete in a major tournament. The primary advantage players from other games have coming over to pool is they can just play in almost any tournament they want, no qualifiers needed. In snooker, it's easier these days with q school and all, but even if they qualify for the tour they still have to play even more qualifiers to get to the main tournament.

I'm sure some pool players could manage it, but it'd long long long road. And yes, I feel running 100 balls is much harder in 14.1 than it is to run a century (depending on the layout of course).

 

[Itsnotme]

Because.... Ronnie Osullivan and Jim white are still alive... Do you think ANY American player has a chance against guys of that caliber and discipline?? HA! HA! HA! I think not...

 

[Jaden]

don't forget....

The larger reason is that snooker is no where near as available in the USA. The majority of the tables that remain are 10' or less and most of them are sparsely spread about. It's very hard to develop snooker skills on a bar box. :embarrassed2:

The virtual disappearance of snooker in this country - on tables of any size is a trend that doesn't seem likely to reverse itself unless some major organization/donor can offer substantial assistance to those that would like to add snooker tables to either existing or new rooms.

For my own part, I would love to see snooker gain huge popularity here.

Snooker tables in the us that you CAN find are typically setup to play golf with simonis cloth and tighter pockets.

Jaden

 

[Bobby]

Because they have no chance.
Efren told me that when I asked him.

That says it all right there. They really have no chance at all. I often hear people say how they saw some pool player practicing snooker and running centuries blah blah blah.
Snooker is a lot more than running balls, getting control of the table is very important and not easy to do against the top players. The end game is also very critical. If the pool players thought they had a remote chance playing snooker they'd have done it a long time ago. I've never seen one pool player who's snooker game was even remotely near world class standard. In the World Championship's first round the races are to 10 which averages about 4 hours or more per match....I would be shocked if any pool player won 3 frames against a top 16 snooker player.

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

So...you are saying (non-US) pros who come to USA to play events have work visas? You are living in a fantasy world.

If they do not the INS, Border Patrol, and other AGENCIES would love to know about them.

Sadly it is tough for most Americans to work in a Foreign Country, as they try and protect job for their native born people. If a local has the skill, the local get the job.


My Cousin had a Jewelry Factory in TJ Mexico years ago, the Mexican Government told him how many American Citizen "managers" he could have, the rest of the work force was Mexicans Citizens.

BTW our Sheriff Joe's Deputies, and Possess are still doing with Obama People can not seem to accomplish, busting illegals of all nationalities working illegally in Arizona.

 

[RunoutJJ]

I think pro players would do well in Snooker if they learned how to play the game on the more defense side. The match I watch Miz play he was banking balls and taking really hard long shots!! After missing these shots the european had no trouble smoking the Miz!! If you can stay in close postion to the balls than they shouldnt be any reason that they couldnt get a break of say... 70+.

My personal best was a break of 74 and I am no where near a champion. The few times I played against europeans that wield a snooker cue they couldnt believe how well I played for an "American" :lol:

Snooker is just a different game than any other cue game but if people took the time to truly learn the finer aspects of the game they would do well.

I mean snooker is a cue game right?? This top pros fire balls in and spin the cue around the table on mouse holed diamond tables for 10K!!! Who's to say that they couldnt do it on a snooker table???

Great thread btw because Ive always wondered the same. Maybe ill give up on pool and play snooker for 8 hours a day for the next ten years and go torture Ronnie O' and Davis. How hard could it be?? :lol::lol::lol:

 

[Spider1]

Here's a break Mizerak made in a doubles match with Ewa Mataya, against Stephen Hendry and Allison Fisher:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgWLYxeua2A

As he's making his break the commentators talk about how Mizerak might have fared had he made the switch to snooker earlier in his career.

I assume you are the uploader there? If so...

THANK YOU!

Lots of good videos on that channel, just lost an hour watching them.

 

[Winston846]

I think pro players would do well in Snooker if they learned how to play the game on the more defense side. The match I watch Miz play he was banking balls and taking really hard long shots!! After missing these shots the european had no trouble smoking the Miz!! If you can stay in close postion to the balls than they shouldnt be any reason that they couldnt get a break of say... 70+.

Sounds odd that Mizerak was taking "wild" shots. You would think a straight pool player the caliber of Mizerak would have known that.

 

[pt109]

That says it all right there. They really have no chance at all. I often hear people say how they saw some pool player practicing snooker and running centuries blah blah blah.
Snooker is a lot more than running balls, getting control of the table is very important and not easy to do against the top players. The end game is also very critical. If the pool players thought they had a remote chance playing snooker they'd have done it a long time ago. I've never seen one pool player who's snooker game was even remotely near world class standard. In the World Championship's first round the races are to 10 which averages about 4 hours or more per match....I would be shocked if any pool player won 3 frames against a top 16 snooker player.

Gonna disagree with Efren here...his stroke won't work on British conditions.
But Buddy's would.Jim Rempe started too late in life but had some success.
He did beat some players including the Scottish pro champ at the time.

I feel a kid like Mike Deshaine could make the switch in 2 years.

 

[Bobby]

Gonna disagree with Efren here...his stroke won't work on British conditions.
But Buddy's would.Jim Rempe started too late in life but had some success.
He did beat some players including the Scottish pro champ at the time.

I feel a kid like Mike Deshaine could make the switch in 2 years.

It would take a lot more than 2 years. There are 2nd tier players in snooker who played close to where they are at now 5-8 years ago and they still have trouble even finishing in the top 8 or 16 in any event.

 

[jay helfert]

Have to disagree here with anyone who thinks a pool player could make it in Snooker. It ain't gonna happen anytime soon. These top snooker players start out as kids and play all the time for many years to make it. A year or two isn't going to cut it for a Dechaine, Alex, Shane, Jesse Engel or anyone else you can name.

Maybe if a young player like Jesse started now playing snooker full time, he might be competitive in five years! He would have to give up pool and move to England and compete on the lower levels first. Then it would be a long climb to the top.

Yes, Rempe and Mizerak tried to make it over there. Both put 6x12 tables in their homes to practice on. Jimmy played in many qualifying events for two to three years. He may have made it to the final 32 ONCE! Later he told me, he had no chance against the best players! And he was at the top of his game then. Mizerak was only the best pool player on the planet when he tried to play snooker professionally. He didn't fare any better than Rempe.

 

[RunoutJJ]

Sounds odd that Mizerak was taking "wild" shots. You would think a straight pool player the caliber of Mizerak would have known that.

Im not knocking hte Miz at all. The vid i watched (not the one in the posts above) he took some very hard long shots that required some fancy cue ball work. I think he plays great snooker actually and no way shape or form did i say he couldnt play. I mearly stated that he took some shots that cost him.


Like the mixed doubles break of 56 though. Even the annoucer said that the Miz had the better adaptation to snooker than the snooker players to regular pool So if you have an english man saying that they there is definitely hope for US players to do well in Snooker tourneys.

Would love to see SVB or JA toruture a top player. Would be a big viewing for both sides. Especially with the Mosconio Cup crowd :yeah:

 

[Cameron Smith]

I think pro players would do well in Snooker if they learned how to play the game on the more defense side. The match I watch Miz play he was banking balls and taking really hard long shots!! After missing these shots the european had no trouble smoking the Miz!! If you can stay in close postion to the balls than they shouldnt be any reason that they couldnt get a break of say... 70+.

My personal best was a break of 74 and I am no where near a champion. The few times I played against europeans that wield a snooker cue they couldnt believe how well I played for an "American" :lol:

Snooker is just a different game than any other cue game but if people took the time to truly learn the finer aspects of the game they would do well.

I mean snooker is a cue game right?? This top pros fire balls in and spin the cue around the table on mouse holed diamond tables for 10K!!! Who's to say that they couldnt do it on a snooker table???

Great thread btw because Ive always wondered the same. Maybe ill give up on pool and play snooker for 8 hours a day for the next ten years and go torture Ronnie O' and Davis. How hard could it be?? :lol::lol::lol:

Snooker is a lot different than it was in the 80's. Now players are very aggressive, they pot long difficult shots with regularity and win from those positions. 50-60% long pot success is crucial to be able to compete at the top level. If you try to play defensive against these guys, your just giving them more opportunities.

I think Jay is right, 5 years of hard work is needed to adapt your pool game to snooker.

 

[Bobby]

To put things into perspective, Steve Davis is ranked #44 in the world he's far past his prime and has no chance of winning a major event again and would still drill any pool player at snooker. Ken Doherty is #29!!! Marco Fu is #23!!! These are great players and they are not in the top 16 anymore. The great Stephen Hendry hasn't won an event in a few years and hasn't won the world championship since 1999 he just barely made the top 16 for the next season.....

 

[thejeffcho]

Gonna disagree with Efren here...his stroke won't work on British conditions.

Can someone elaborate on this point? We can debate about pool players playing snooker and vice versa, but as far as fundamentals (stroke, stance, etc.) go, is there a reason why Efren's stroke would not work for snooker or why a snooker stroke seems to work just fine for pool?

 

[Philthepockets]

the U.K. snooker pros have started in the sport by rising to the top through a vast field of players, in their teen years, obtaining a sponsor to help with training and practice expenses, then rising to the elite pro level by being in the top percentile in that group. i am sure many of our U.K. AZ'ers will confirm the arduous task it truly is, to become a snooker pro capable of world competition.[the top 168].as well as our players in the U.S. that have actually been in pro snooker in the U.K.

on another note, the lion, who held all snooker/pool titles in Canada at once, is one pool player i believe who was capable, with the right discipline to join that circle in his early years.

i would love to see the magician playing on U.K. snooker equipment, as would a great many others. it would be a rare glimpse of genius at work, and fascinating to observe such a revered player negotiate a foreign discipline with his great talent.

you may remember the invitational with steve davis and steve mizerak. steve showed the utmost respect for mizeraks cue ball talents although his snooker accomplishments were supelative. if i am not mistaken, davis said he thought that is was harder for a snooker player to run 100 in 14.1 than a pool player to compile a break of 100 in snooker.





i don't want to open a big P#####ing match about U.S. pool players, i just offered a little more depth to the subject.

I dont honestly know where some of this misinformation comes from.
Alex never won anything snooker, here is the official list of Canadian Champs and the runner up.
Also, niether he or any other "pool" player has any chance, nadda, zero.

2010

Floyd Ziegler

Fern Loyer

2009

Alain Robidoux

John White

2008

Kirk Stevens

Tom Finstad

2007

Floyd Ziegler

Tom Finstad

2006

Alain Robidoux

John White

2005

Tom Finstad

John White

2004

Alain Robidoux

Tom Finstad

2003

Alain Robidoux

Cliff Thorburn

2002

Kirk Stevens

Cliff Thorburn

2001

Cliff Thorburn

Tom Finstad

2000

Kirk Stevens

Robert Chaperon

1999

Jim Wych

Tom Finstad

1998

Kirk Stevens

Tom Finstad

1997

Kirk Stevens

Charlie Brown

1996

Ben Reicker

Ray Saunders

1995

Mike Sobala

Gerard Morrison

1994

Kirk Clouthier

John Kenyon

1993

Daryl Wouters

Tom Matsui

1992

Chris Wood

Fern Loyer

1991

Ed Galati

Frank Kissner

1990

John White

Jeff White

1989

Tom Finstad

Gary Natale

1988

Brady Gollan

John Bear

1987

Alain Robidoux

Jeff White

1986

Gary Natale

Larry Firth

1985

Alain Robidoux

Mike Sobala

1984

Tom Finstad

Claude Smith

1983

Alain Robidoux

Tom Finstad

1982

Brian McConnell

Robert Paquette

1981

Robert Chaperon

Carey Lorraine

1980

Jim Bear

Robert Paquette

1979

Jim Wych

Robert Paquette

1978

Kirk Stevens

Robert Paquette

1977

Cliff Thorburn

Robert Paquette

1976

Cliff Thorburn

Bill Werbenuik

1975

Cliff Thorburn

Bill Werbenuik

1974

Cliff Thorburn

Julien St. Denis

 

[Winston846]

Im not knocking hte Miz at all. The vid i watched (not the one in the posts above) he took some very hard long shots that required some fancy cue ball work. I think he plays great snooker actually and no way shape or form did i say he couldnt play. I mearly stated that he took some shots that cost him.


Like the mixed doubles break of 56 though. Even the annoucer said that the Miz had the better adaptation to snooker than the snooker players to regular pool So if you have an english man saying that they there is definitely hope for US players to do well in Snooker tourneys.

Would love to see SVB or JA toruture a top player. Would be a big viewing for both sides. Especially with the Mosconio Cup crowd :yeah:

I didn't imply that you were knocking him. It just seemed odd to me that he would take "crazy" shots. I can't access YouTube at work (I'm surprised I can access AZ!), but I'll watch it when I get a chance.

 

[DaveK]

Can someone elaborate on this point? We can debate about pool players playing snooker and vice versa, but as far as fundamentals (stroke, stance, etc.) go, is there a reason why Efren's stroke would not work for snooker or why a snooker stroke seems to work just fine for pool?

If I bump into him soon I'll ask a friend of mine about this. He is on Phils list of Canadian snooker champions above. One day before nationals a few years back he told me that he would play both snooker and 8/9 ball only if snooker was before pool. He said that when they hold the 8/9 ball ahead of snooker he won't play pool because it messes up his snooker stroke. Like I said, if I see him soon I'll ask why and post it up.

Dave <--- will have to go to a golf course to find Daryl, but that's OK too :thumbup: