Bumperless Cues?

I agree with Slim. I'd bet if I took 10 identical production cues (to guarantee the same make/build) and removed the bumper out of one (or, conversely, left only 1 bumper in and took the rest out).... I HIGHLY doubt anyone could guess which twin has the Toni. ;)

I really wish I had $1 million in my pocket...I would have to take you up on this test.

Before you jump on me to "post up"...let me remind you that you did not specify which end of the cue I have to use to "hit" the CB...;)
 
Personally I think you might hear a different sound but, I doubt you can feel any differense. Maybe if the bumper add some weight to your cue. So if you gonna try this out, add same weight as you remove. Just about same as the discusion about fiber pads in another thread. Use it if you want some protection. Rubber isn't always wrong even if it get a cleaner look without )
I fooled myself a lot when I tried to find a new tip for my cues. I was listening to the hit. Not feeling it.
 
It's an easy test. Just take the bumper out of your own cue & hit a few balls with it. I'd be very surprised if you don't notice a difference between bumper & no bumper. I wouldn't say either way is better than the other, but there's an obvious, immediately apparent difference. Just try it. Anybody who says there's no difference is just arguing for argument sake, or they haven't tried it themselves. There's nothing to argue about. Take your bumper off & hit a few balls. It takes a short moment & then you can put the bumper back, but you'll have first hand knowledge & won't have to decide on who to believe on an online forum.

Bang on. I removed the bumper from all my cues and the difference is very noticeable.
 
I have a BBC and a Tru Balance PH sneaky, bumperless.
I love the look and both play great.
Just out of habit, when I use them, they get rested on the toe of my shoe.

One has a black phenolic cap and the other, Delrin. No worries with a Delrin cap as you could run over it with a tank.
 
It's an easy test. Just take the bumper out of your own cue & hit a few balls with it. I'd be very surprised if you don't notice a difference between bumper & no bumper. I wouldn't say either way is better than the other, but there's an obvious, immediately apparent difference. Just try it. Anybody who says there's no difference is just arguing for argument sake, or they haven't tried it themselves. There's nothing to argue about. Take your bumper off & hit a few balls. It takes a short moment & then you can put the bumper back, but you'll have first hand knowledge & won't have to decide on who to believe on an online forum.

This makes sense and confirms my experiment. A buddy and I both have basic Tascarella cues. His has a bumper and mine does not. We hit them back to back, and there is a big difference in the sound and feel, which translates to a difference in the perception of the hit.

-dj
 
....

If you're having one built ask about having both options.
I absolutely agree, I've had 2 built that way (a Barnhart & a Scruggs). They are very classical cues and I felt the bumperless option was a must, but I want the protection of a bumper when I play with it.
BTW, as clumsy as I am the bumper is no guarantee the butt sleeve won't get dinged, but it decrease the likelihood.
 
Didn't they make a blindtest with different joint material and nobody could tell the differense? Feel free to do whatever you want with your eyes and most important, ears. Clone your cue, take away the bumper and add same wight to the butt. If you can tell wich one have a bumper, I will send you a certificate that you're a miracle :thumbup:
Been through simular subjects with pool-, carom- and snookercues. Also done tests with golf balls.
 
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My point was:

i think most guys who have bumper less cues have them because they like the look of a bumper less cue.
I doubt that very many pool players have said " man, i would like to order that cue with no bumper but i can't because of the way it will hit".
There is no doubt that if you modify the cue that you usually play with (take the bumper off) you may feel the difference.
But, i am talking about a cue that is finished without a bumper, not modifying a finished cue with a bumper.
If you pick up a cue with out looking at the but & hit a few balls, i very much doubt that you will be able to tell if it has a bumper on it.

SLIM
 
i think most guys who have bumper less cues have them because they like the look of a bumper less cue.
I doubt that very many pool players have said " man, i would like to order that cue with no bumper but i can't because of the way it will hit".
There is no doubt that if you modify the cue that you usually play with (take the bumper off) you may feel the difference.
But, i am talking about a cue that is finished without a bumper, not modifying a finished cue with a bumper.
If you pick up a cue with out looking at the but & hit a few balls, i very much doubt that you will be able to tell if it has a bumper on it.

SLIM

You may not be able to but using a global statement is unfair to others who actually can tell a difference. I prefer bumperless cues. I have much better feedback than with a bumper. As you use them, you get used to putting the cue on your foot and bringing a small towel. Of course if you are a player who can not control their emotions and bang the butt on the floor, you will damage the cue eventually. Don't forget phenolic is much harder than wood or rubber.


Chris
 
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The joint is what makes the hit for me. I handle my cue with a ton of care, but the finish on the bottom still gets abused without a bumper somehow.
 
That's the way Doc (Frye) made them. Have no idea why...Guess that was his style. I always liked it....a different look.
 

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Just to be sure i understand;

you can tell by the hit of a cue, if it has a bumper on it or not?

SLIM


you may not be able to but using a global statement is unfair to others who actually can tell a difference. I prefer bumperless cues. I have much better feedback than with a bumper. As you use them, you get used to putting the cue on your foot and bringing a small towel. Of course if you are a player who can not control their emotions and bang the butt on the floor, you will damage the cue eventually. Don't forget phenolic is much harder than wood or rubber.


Chris
 
but then i can't tell what number ball i hit by the sound either.

SLIM

I do not understand your point.


Try this: take 10 shots (2 diamond stop shot) with your cue as is.

THEN - remove the little rubber bumper and try the same 10 shots as previous


IF you can't feel/hear a difference, then I don't know what to tell you.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Please read post #29

the entire post.

Please do not take half of one of the sentences in the post & try to pick it apart.
I can not be any clearer than that.

I understand the feel of a hoppe cue, i shoot with a real one.

That does not mean that i can pick up another cue, shoot with it & know if it has a bumper on it or not.

You mean to tell me that you can shoot with three different cues & tell me which ones have a bumper on them by the way they hit?

SLIM


i do not understand your point.


Try this: Take 10 shots (2 diamond stop shot) with your cue as is.

Then - remove the little rubber bumper and try the same 10 shots as previous


if you can't feel/hear a difference, then i don't know what to tell you.


Sent from my iphone using tapatalk
 
Fact is that the soft rubber bumper absorbs vibration. The bigger it is, the more effective it is at doing so. The softer it is, the more effective it is at doing so. With no bumper at all, there's nothing in the cue to absorb the vibration. So upon impact, vibrations flow back & forth across the length of the cue, virtually uninhibited. This increases the sensation in your grip hand because the cue can freely vibrate. That vibration increases the audibility of the impact. It is especially noticeable on side spin shots, where the cue is flexed & once the ball is gone the cue reflexes back to it's original shape, acting as a pendulum until it reaches equilibrium. This is very easily felt. A center ball shot is solid with a single jolt, no continuing vibrations. If you hit off center when you think you are hitting center, then your cue tells you that you hit wrong. This is what players refer to as feedback. It's too intense for some players, as they prefer a more mellow & smooth feel. So a bumper is good for them. Personally, I prefer something moderate, middle. I use bumpers not only to protect the cue, but also to tune it, tame it down. Old Brunswick catalogs didn't use the term bumper. They called them noise suppressors, or vibration dampeners. That's exactly what they are. The protection was an afterthought, a byproduct.

Point is that bumpers have been misunderstood for a long time. Many builders don't even consider the bumper as a viable component for tuning the hit of a cue. In recent years the concept has been rediscovered, hence all the bumperless cues. But the general cue buying public has long forgotten the original purpose of a bumper & now everybody seemingly assumes it's for protection, when it's not. Even a lot of builders think it's only for protection. And I guess, in past decades it has become just that. The purpose has changed. But you cannot dismiss the fact that with that protection comes the byproduct of noise suppression and vibration dampening. The purpose may have changed over the years, but the effects haven't. I think it's cool that many cues are being built without bumpers nowadays. It's a tuning option that alters the cue's dynamics, which opens the door to more people being able to find a cue that works best for them. That's a good thing because we are all different, and prefer different things. Obviously some folks like that full feel. I personally want it tamed down a bit. Some guys like it tamed down all the way. As I said before & i'll say again, EVERY component on a cue makes a difference, even something as seemingly insignificant as a bumper.
 
Very nice post

I agree 100%

SLIM


fact is that the soft rubber bumper absorbs vibration. The bigger it is, the more effective it is at doing so. The softer it is, the more effective it is at doing so. With no bumper at all, there's nothing in the cue to absorb the vibration. So upon impact, vibrations flow back & forth across the length of the cue, virtually uninhibited. This increases the sensation in your grip hand because the cue can freely vibrate. That vibration increases the audibility of the impact. It is especially noticeable on side spin shots, where the cue is flexed & once the ball is gone the cue reflexes back to it's original shape, acting as a pendulum until it reaches equilibrium. This is very easily felt. A center ball shot is solid with a single jolt, no continuing vibrations. If you hit off center when you think you are hitting center, then your cue tells you that you hit wrong. This is what players refer to as feedback. It's too intense for some players, as they prefer a more mellow & smooth feel. So a bumper is good for them. Personally, i prefer something moderate, middle. I use bumpers not only to protect the cue, but also to tune it, tame it down. Old brunswick catalogs didn't use the term bumper. They called them noise suppressors, or vibration dampeners. That's exactly what they are. The protection was an afterthought, a byproduct.

Point is that bumpers have been misunderstood for a long time. Many builders don't even consider the bumper as a viable component for tuning the hit of a cue. In recent years the concept has been rediscovered, hence all the bumperless cues. But the general cue buying public has long forgotten the original purpose of a bumper & now everybody seemingly assumes it's for protection, when it's not. Even a lot of builders think it's only for protection. And i guess, in past decades it has become just that. The purpose has changed. But you cannot dismiss the fact that with that protection comes the byproduct of noise suppression and vibration dampening. The purpose may have changed over the years, but the effects haven't. I think it's cool that many cues are being built without bumpers nowadays. It's a tuning option that alters the cue's dynamics, which opens the door to more people being able to find a cue that works best for them. That's a good thing because we are all different, and prefer different things. Obviously some folks like that full feel. I personally want it tamed down a bit. Some guys like it tamed down all the way. As i said before & i'll say again, every component on a cue makes a difference, even something as seemingly insignificant as a bumper.
 
the entire post.

Please do not take half of one of the sentences in the post & try to pick it apart.
I can not be any clearer than that.

I understand the feel of a hoppe cue, i shoot with a real one.

That does not mean that i can pick up another cue, shoot with it & know if it has a bumper on it or not.

You mean to tell me that you can shoot with three different cues & tell me which ones have a bumper on them by the way they hit?

SLIM

You did not make sense on the iPhone version because you type part of your reply in the subject line. Strange...

To answer your question - yes.


Eric explained how I can tell the difference much better than I can.
 
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