2 more stolen cues recovered! Tank you God for stipid criminals

[$TAKE HOR$E]

StakeHorse asked:

"Another thing, and this is problem a dumb question but im no district attorney so can someone explain all this talk about crossing state lines? How is taking an item you didnt steal back to where it came from an offense? I would assume its because of the supposed extortion?"

They knowingly recieved stolen goods and transported them over state lines...which wouldn't be hard since this very close to the Ohio/Kentucky border. So for the record: They received stolen goods.....transported stolen merchandise over state lines...and then tried to extort the original owner for payment(ransom) for the cues that he was the rightful owner in the first place.

My guess: They will wisely plead out and probably do 2-3 years in a state prison. This would hinge on their full cooperation with the authorities. If they still think this is nothing or a big joke.....the joke is on them.

Thats what I figured. I am well aware of the laws with trafficing stolen property and kidnapping but it all seems kind of backwards in this case. Also something to think about is what if they took the cues and found out after the fact they were stolen. It seems somewhere along the line they knew the rightfull owner but when you think about it, its kind of far fetched in a way. Not just for the people in custody but for whoever lost them in the supposed gambling match. It would take a real genious to lose $2000 and give someone two cues and say "hey these are stolen why dont you drive to another state and see if the owner will iron off my gambling debt", lol.

 

[lorider]

A similar situation happened recently with Pat Diveney. Gus Briseno in Arizona was seen on a stream playing with a cue that had been stolen from Pat. Upon the knowledge of possessing the stolen cue, he returned it to Pat.

He didn't say, "I payed $1200 for this cue so I need that much to return it." He simply returned the cue because it was the only right thing to do.

I don't understand how anyone can construe this any other way. Upon knowledge that you have stolen property, you give it back. Sometimes you get a reward, sometimes you don't. Do you think when pawn shops are found with stolen property they require money to give it back? Sometimes, taking a loss is the price of doing business. If you are going to associate with people who will harbor stolen property, sometimes you are going to get burned.

The fact that they were offered a $500 reward makes them look even worse.

Like Barton said, no gray area. Either you return it and take the loss or you strong arm somebody and learn a lesson about the chain of custody in regards to stolen property.

i remember reading the thread about the stolen diveney cue. if i recall correctly the guy was reimbursed for the money he paid for that cue. iirc more than one person was involved in seeing that gus was reimbursed .

before i go any further i want to say that what frost did was wrong !

why didnt cornerstone reimburse frost for the 2,000.00 frost was out ? the cues were worth a lot more than that. frost just wanted his money back.

i dont know any parties involved nor am i defending their actions. but here is why i made those statements.

several people who apparently know frost personally seem quite supprised he would be involved in something like this. that got me to wondering about things. did frost know they were stolen before or after he recieved them? let me say this , whether he knew beforehand or not does not justify his holding them. i am just trying to figure out if he is a crook or just plain dumb.

a crook could have sold either cue for the price he was wanting from the rightful owner for both cues.

that leads me to think he was just plain dumb believing he was a good guy offering to give the cues back to the rightful owner for the money he was out, not knowing his actions would lead to extortion charges.

i also want to add that i dont think frosts morals are as high as the person who returned devineys cue in that other thread.

 

[1on1pooltournys]

Thats what I figured. I am well aware of the laws with trafficing stolen property and kidnapping but it all seems kind of backwards in this case. Also something to think about is what if they took the cues and found out after the fact they were stolen. It seems somewhere along the line they knew the rightfull owner but when you think about it, its kind of far fetched in a way. Not just for the people in custody but for whoever lost them in the supposed gambling match. It would take a real genious to lose $2000 and give someone two cues and say "hey these are stolen why dont you drive to another state and see if the owner will iron off my gambling debt", lol.

Indeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed

 

[risky biz]

If I got stolen merchandise for a gambling debt and I sold it and found out later that it had been stolen then I would contact the original owner and work with him to recover the cues. I would return the $5000 to the person who paid me for the cues and consider the gambling debt still open.

Having fun with the hypotheticals? How about dealing with the real situation?

Congratulations. I crown you AZ Billiards $5,000 hypothetical, ethical saint of the day.

And congratulations, too, on the super-fast $300 cue sale.

 

[JB Cases]

Congratulations. I crown you AZ Billiards $5,000 hypothetical, ethical saint of the day.

And congratulations, too, on the super-fast $300 cue sale.

And I think I speak for a lot of us when I give you the crown for shittiest posts this week.

Guy gets stone cold ripped off. Is recovering slowly from that terrible UNINSURED theft and comes on here to report that two guys who tried to extort him to get a little bit of his property back gets denigrated by some idiot with a bunch of nonsense and grade school who-gets-eaten-first ethics stories.

Congratulations! You have created the biggest waste of bandwidth this week.

 

[risky biz]

Scenario #4:

I don't have the money take my cues they are worth a lot more. --- looks on the Interwebz to try and sell them and finds that the cues he has are (were) worth more and that they are probably from the ones stolen from Cornerstone. Calls Bill and attempts to shake him down for 2k by intelligently informing Bill that he is in possession of property and knows it is stolen merchandise.

Or Scenario #4 could be: "Hey, Cornerstone, I won these cues in an action game but later found out they were stolen from you. I want to return them to the rightful owner but I don't want to be out $2,000 either. Can we discuss that?"

Cornerstone: "Sure. Meet me at Cabella's."

But then this Frost guy wouldn't come off as so completely the lowlife criminal that everyone here seems to know he is after hearing one side of the story from someone who's been deathly silent since someone asked him a couple of simple questions about what he described as his friends in the state police.

 

[Blue Hog ridr]

John, I agree. Risky Biz would make a great legal Aide lawyer.
Pretty much good for nothing. Except taking up valuable oxygen that the rest of us could be using.

What other side of the story could there be that really matters?
Someone is holding onto property that belongs to me. I really don't care what their side of the story is OK.
All I know is that I want it back. What happens beyond that is their problem, not mine.

1. I have something that belongs to you. Lets meet somewhere so I can give it back to you, or.
2. I have something that belongs to you. I want $2000 or you can't have it back.

 

[risky biz]

Originally Posted by risky biz
Congratulations. I crown you AZ Billiards $5,000 hypothetical, ethical saint of the day.

And congratulations, too, on the super-fast $300 cue sale.

And I think I speak for a lot of us when I give you the crown for shittiest posts this week.

Guy gets stone cold ripped off. Is recovering slowly from that terrible UNINSURED theft and comes on here to report that two guys who tried to extort him to get a little bit of his property back gets denigrated by some idiot with a bunch of nonsense and grade school who-gets-eaten-first ethics stories.

Congratulations! You have created the biggest waste of bandwidth this week.

OK, sorry. Guess I hit a sore spot.

 

[JB Cases]

i remember reading the thread about the stolen diveney cue. if i recall correctly the guy was reimbursed for the money he paid for that cue. iirc more than one person was involved in seeing that gus was reimbursed .

before i go any further i want to say that what frost did was wrong !

why didnt cornerstone reimburse frost for the 2,000.00 frost was out ? the cues were worth a lot more than that. frost just wanted his money back.

He didn't pay for the cues. He won them. I can't owe the bank 10k on my car and lose it in a poker game and then the guy who gets the car says to the bank, hey you can come pick up this car when you pay me the 5k I was supposed to get from the guy who lost to me.

If someone pays off with counterfeit money the government isn't going to turn it into good money for you.

i dont know any parties involved nor am i defending their actions. but here is why i made those statements.

several people who apparently know frost personally seem quite supprised he would be involved in something like this. that got me to wondering about things. did frost know they were stolen before or after he recieved them? let me say this , whether he knew beforehand or not does not justify his holding them. i am just trying to figure out if he is a crook or just plain dumb.

My opinion is that Frost and his backer found out that the cues were stolen after getting them and researching the value of them. I don't think he is a "crook" in the sense that he knowingly and deliberately broke the law although I have to think he would be aware on a common-sense level that it's wrong to bargain with stolen property.

a crook could have sold either cue for the price he was wanting from the rightful owner for both cues.

that leads me to think he was just plain dumb believing he was a good guy offering to give the cues back to the rightful owner for the money he was out, not knowing his actions would lead to extortion charges.

I can see this.

i also want to add that i dont think frosts morals are as high as the person who returned devineys cue in that other thread.

No, but I'd bet that this situation involved a backer who also wanted his "share". Maybe if Frost is as nice and good as some people say then alone he might have written it off and given the cues back.

In any case I doubt that they will do time. They will plea out and get probation and it will be done unless there is something we don't know about.

 

[JB Cases]

Originally Posted by risky biz
Congratulations. I crown you AZ Billiards $5,000 hypothetical, ethical saint of the day.

And congratulations, too, on the super-fast $300 cue sale.



OK, sorry. Guess I hit a sore spot.

Yeah, you did, you pegged 100 on the Troll-O-Meter - people who go OUT OF THEIR WAY to act like trolls on the net are truly irritating in my eyes.

 

[risky biz]

Yeah, you did, you pegged 100 on the Troll-O-Meter - people who go OUT OF THEIR WAY to act like trolls on the net are truly irritating in my eyes.

I've noticed that you seem to get accused of that quite a bit yourself.

 

[risky biz]

"MONROE -- Two men from Kentucky were arrested and charged with extortion and receiving stolen property when they allegedly tried to sell two high-end pool cues to the man from whom they were stolen three years ago.

The men, ages 27 and 33, will be arraigned Friday in Monroe County 1st District Court.

Trooper Sharon McDonald of the Michigan State Police Monroe post said the men contacted the owner Monday and offered to sell the cues for $2,000. The owner estimates the value at $11,000.

The owner contacted the state police and arranged to meet the men Thursday in the parking lot of Cabela's in Dundee. Troopers were there, too, and the men were arrested about 1 p.m. as they tried to complete the transaction.

The men told troopers that they got the pool cues in lieu of $2,000 they were owed for beating someone at pool in Cincinnati.

"They wanted to get their money back," Trooper McDonald said.

"They thought they were doing the right thing by selling [the owner] his property back."

Troopers released no names."

````````````````````````````````

I decided to help Cornerstone out by posting this.

"They wanted to get their money back,"

"They thought they were doing the right thing"

Cornerstone's lesson in point: Don't try to get back the $2,000 you lost for $11,000 cues, just sell them to someone else for $11,000 and don't do what you think is the right thing.

I think that these two are now realizing that they made a huge mistake and in more than one way.

Personally, I would never take a cue in payment for anything nor would I ever buy a used cue.

 

[Realizm]

That is were have to to thank god for dum people .Go to know you got your cues back...

 

[cueaddicts]

pointless........

 

[gsm1sw]

I think that these two are now realizing that they made a huge mistake and in more than one way.

This is the only thing you posted on this topic that makes any sense

 

[risky biz]

He didn't pay for the cues. He won them.

It doesn't matter if he won them. He was out money for them either way. And it hasn't been established that he was out only $2,000. He may have been out $8,000 and was asking $2,000 reimbursement.

I can't owe the bank 10k on my car and lose it in a poker game and then the guy who gets the car says to the bank, hey you can come pick up this car when you pay me the 5k I was supposed to get from the guy who lost to me..

No one would put up money against a car that didn't have a clear title. Are you again implying that this Robert Frost knew the cues were stolen before accepting them? Where has that been established?

If someone pays off with counterfeit money the government isn't going to turn it into good money for you.

Irrelevant comparison. The government doesn't reimburse people because if it did everyone would be printing counterfeit and turning it in to the government. In any case, why would I want to put myself on the same ethical level as the government? You've got to be kidding.

 

[risky biz]

This is the only thing you posted on this topic that makes any sense

In that case it's a shame you don't understand what it means.

 

[kvinbrwr]

Both risky biz and bankpoolchicka indicated that in their minds (such as they may be) Bill left these cues lying around where they could be stolen so somehow in their twisted sense of justice Bill deserved to be ripped off? The cues were stolen in a break and enter from his home/place of business. In the criminal justification spin, how does he deserve this, by just owning the cues? or is anyone that doesn't store their stuff with Brinks just asking for it?
That just seems to be like the rapist claiming a gal was asking for it because she wore something pretty.

Thanks

Kevin

 

[brandoncook26]

````````````````````````````````

I decided to help Cornerstone out by posting this.

"They wanted to get their money back,"

"They thought they were doing the right thing"

I think that these two are now realizing that they made a huge mistake and in more than one way.

Personally, I would never take a cue in payment for anything nor would I ever buy a used cue.

Ignorantia juris non excusat

Ask a lawyer

 

[kvinbrwr]

Ignorantia juris non excusat

There was no ignorance (well of the law). Bill clearly told these boobs the cues were his and they were stolen and the boobs acknowledged that they knew that (although that doesn't matter). Bill offered them a "reward" which is more than generous considering as the police soon proved, he had an absolute legal right to the cues with zero compensation due to the boobs that were holding them.

Kevin