strange back pause that i'm trying to get rid off

A

asbani

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I'm talking about the pause when you stroke and wanna shoot, when you back swing before you will shoot the shot, you have a pause, I saw some pros do it, Buddy Hall comes to mind, but I am not doing it exactly in the same manner as they do, Mine is really short, fast, and the pause is like half second then I shoot, maybe less than that, and I don't like it, I didn't try to develop it, it came to me automatically, I don't know why.

first let me tell you that I didn't have it all the time, it came to me a year ago or so at first I didn't even feel it, then close friends told me about it, and I realised it too, then when I focus to not do it, I will miss every shot, literally, I don't know how to fix it.

here's a video of me shooting some shots, I took it on my iphone so the angel is not perfect, and maybe its not that clear, but please watch and try to pay attention to my final stroke as I go backwards then wanting to shoot, I will hold for a slight 0.5sec or maybe 0.3sec I want to remove that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pb7wqwy4UBs&context=C3b61a8aADOEgsToPDskLzlXHBQUT-WUq3q8gH8EHi
 
You'll find a number of people who advocate pausing in the backstroke.

I don't think you should be trying to fight it especially since it comes natural.
 
one stroke for awhile

asbani said:
I'm talking about the pause when you stroke and wanna shoot, when you back swing before you will shoot the shot, you have a pause, I saw some pros do it, Buddy Hall comes to mind, but I am not doing it exactly in the same manner as they do, Mine is really short, fast, and the pause is like half second then I shoot, maybe less than that, and I don't like it, I didn't try to develop it, it came to me automatically, I don't know why.

first let me tell you that I didn't have it all the time, it came to me a year ago or so at first I didn't even feel it, then close friends told me about it, and I realised it too, then when I focus to not do it, I will miss every shot, literally, I don't know how to fix it.

here's a video of me shooting some shots, I took it on my iphone so the angel is not perfect, and maybe its not that clear, but please watch and try to pay attention to my final stroke as I go backwards then wanting to shoot, I will hold for a slight 0.5sec or maybe 0.3sec I want to remove that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pb7wqwy4UBs&context=C3b61a8aADOEgsToPDskLzlXHBQUT-WUq3q8gH8EHi
Click to expand...


Some folks like a pause some don't. Doesn't really matter. Probably can get rid of it by working on this. Scatter eight or ten balls on the table just easy shots no clusters no real work to be done. Then walk around the table stepping into each shot. Draw the stick back as you are planting the bridge hand and fire as soon as the bridge hand is on the table. Stick and move. No practice strokes no pause as you are trying to stay in motion from the time you shoot the first ball until pocketing the last. This also is very good practice for getting down on shots in proper alignment.

Hu
 
Nice video. It's definitely good enough for the guys in the ask the instructor section to give you a lot of good information. Hopefully they'll chime in here too.

I'm not an instructor but what I see is that you aren't really shooting with your forearm and wrist in a pendulum stroke with your forearm perpendicular to the floor before you begin the stroke. You are gripping the cue too close to the top of the wrap to have a smooth pendulum stroke with your mechanics. You're not allowing the full range of motion by holding the cue in this manner and you could have a way more powerful as well as smoother stroke if you moved your hand back until your forearm is perpendicular to the floor.

I think the pause is coming in since you don't have a full pendulum swing with where you are gripping the cue and you are loading your shoulder up before you strike the ball. That's the pause, it's the loading up of muscle contraction in your shoulder before you swing the cue through a stroke which you do mostly with your shoulder. If your forearm swings more free you'll get that pause more under control. I did this for a while too to control unwanted chicken wing strokes but it inhibits a free stroke. I now have incorporated a slower back swing on my stroke to feel that same level of control but now I have a way more effective and comfortable stroke.

Hope this helps.

Kevin
 
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I have an abbreviated pause midstroke. For me it is invaluable, and gives all six remaining brain cells a split second to figure out what the hell I am about to do! Nuff said, LOL.
 
Nothing in the world wrong with that pause.
If you want to work on something work on a smoother delivery and slow up the back stroke a bit.
Keep the pause. Its good and its you.
 
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IMHO, your stroke isn't really all that bad...if you don't like the pause in the back swing (a lot of people swear by it, but I don't like it either--for me, anyway), then you should work on it.

Try not to choke up so far on the cue...move your right hand back about 6 inches. Try pausing on the forward part of the stroke...that might help you forget about the pause at the draw back portion...it'll give you something to concentrate on instead of the rear pause you're trying to get rid of. Another trick is to put just a slight snap in the wrist (just loosen it up a tad)...a lot of folks advise against it, but I found it keeps my stroke very fluid and consistent. Don't do a whole floppy Bustamante thing, just a very slight break in the wrist will do. Keeping your wrist/forearm too tight can take the "fluidity" out of your stroke...not a bad thing, but maybe something you don't prefer...?

Another thing...focus a little more on your shotmaking and cue ball control and let your stroke out...except for the forward grip, I really don't see anything wrong with your stroke IMHO...but take it from me, self diagnosis and fixation on mechanics of your stroke can really screw with your head. If you don't have a serious problem, your stroke will adjust itself to your game and feel more comfortable before you know it. Otherwise, see an instructor and he/she will straighten you out--if you even need it.
 
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asbani said:
I'm talking about the pause when you stroke and wanna shoot, when you back swing before you will shoot the shot, you have a pause, I saw some pros do it, Buddy Hall comes to mind, but I am not doing it exactly in the same manner as they do, Mine is really short, fast, and the pause is like half second then I shoot, maybe less than that, and I don't like it, I didn't try to develop it, it came to me automatically, I don't know why.

first let me tell you that I didn't have it all the time, it came to me a year ago or so at first I didn't even feel it, then close friends told me about it, and I realised it too, then when I focus to not do it, I will miss every shot, literally, I don't know how to fix it.

here's a video of me shooting some shots, I took it on my iphone so the angel is not perfect, and maybe its not that clear, but please watch and try to pay attention to my final stroke as I go backwards then wanting to shoot, I will hold for a slight 0.5sec or maybe 0.3sec I want to remove that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pb7wqwy4UBs&context=C3b61a8aADOEgsToPDskLzlXHBQUT-WUq3q8gH8EHi
Click to expand...

If it feels comfortable keep doing it. The reason for the pause is to allow a transition from using the muscle on the back (pulling the cue back) of the upper arm to using the bicep muscle to contract (front of the upper arm) moving the cue forward. The contraction of the bicep muscle is controlled from messages sent from your fingers(grip - cradle) on the cue.

John
 
asbani said:
I'm talking about the pause when you stroke and wanna shoot, when you back swing before you will shoot the shot, you have a pause, I saw some pros do it, Buddy Hall comes to mind, but I am not doing it exactly in the same manner as they do, Mine is really short, fast, and the pause is like half second then I shoot, maybe less than that, and I don't like it, I didn't try to develop it, it came to me automatically, I don't know why.

first let me tell you that I didn't have it all the time, it came to me a year ago or so at first I didn't even feel it, then close friends told me about it, and I realised it too, then when I focus to not do it, I will miss every shot, literally, I don't know how to fix it.

here's a video of me shooting some shots, I took it on my iphone so the angel is not perfect, and maybe its not that clear, but please watch and try to pay attention to my final stroke as I go backwards then wanting to shoot, I will hold for a slight 0.5sec or maybe 0.3sec I want to remove that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pb7wqwy4UBs&context=C3b61a8aADOEgsToPDskLzlXHBQUT-WUq3q8gH8EHi
Click to expand...
Looks good to me. I would keep it
 
And,

I agree with comments about moving your right hand back on the cue, you are almost through your stroke at impact
 
Agree, you definitely need to move your right hand back 4 - 6" so it's perpendicular to the cue at address and impact. Pause looks fine, as long as it doesn't become a hitch and result in a Charles Barkley-ish attack on the ball... :) I would smooth everything out a bit, but other than that looks pretty good!
Scott
 
Well, if you don't mind some criticism that I think may be constructive, your backstroke pause isn't so bad, nor is it a bad thing.

What jumped out at me (from what little you can actually see of your stroke) is that you seem to be dropping your shoulder and holding the butt end of your cue too tightly.

If you could loosen up on your grip ( I think substantially) slow down your forward stroke some after your pause, and try to keep body movement more from the elbow down and wrist, you will benefit from that.

Someone mentioned you seemed focused or conscious of that stroke. Seems that way. If it is .... forget the theatrics, concentrate on a smooth flow with a subtle acceleration through the CB. That doesn't mean hard through the CB, just not pulling up on your stroke and tightening your grip hand.
 
I agree traditionaly you want your forearm at a right angle from the cue at impact. But there are some great players that are far in front of that.

I developed the same type of pause about four years ago. It happened when I was first introduced to one pocket. I thought for me it was because I was trying to control speed and hit balls so precisely. It really dosn't look bad to me though!!
 
Thank you everybody for the comments, I'm loving this.

I understand that I'm choking up on the cue a little bit so today I will start trying to move my right grip backwards towards the end of the butt and see how that goes... by the way my cue wrap is designed at the end of the cue, unlike other cues, if I take a cue that has a wrap in the middle, my grip would be in the middle of that wrap, but I am feeling also that Im so used to gripping it that way, little forward, sometimes moves back, depending on the shot, but I'll practice to do some changes that you guys suggested, loosen up a little, and move my hand back, see how that goes.

thank you all
 
P.S. guys by the way, I'm so influenced by C.J Wiley, I been watching this guy in the 90s and I love his game so much, maybe thats why I'm holding the cue like that, I don't know... just thought I'd say it, i remember he also choke up on the cue a little, and he shoots great. check him if you don't know who I'm talking about

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PJSGHDC1wXA
 
A little forward can be okay, many good players have played that way, but as much as you are is probably not a good thing. And just be aware that once you get that position down, you will still need to move your back hand up or down as your bridge length varies because of various types of shots on the table.

And yes, agree that CJ is a great player, used to watch him a bunch when I was younger as well.

Scott
 
Might be your eyes

I've mentioned this before but I'll mention it again for your benefit.

I have a pause in my stroke that I like. I put it there on purpuse a few years back. The only way I could put the pause into my stroke was by changing my eye pattern. On my backstroke I'm looking at the cue ball, then I pause while shifting my eyes to the object ball, then I fire away. It's my eyes that cause the pause. I don't understand how anybody could have a pause any other way. If I was focusing on the object ball the whole time I could never have that pause at the end of my backstroke -- it would seem to unnatural.

So, there's a chance you are doing something similar. Take a look (no pun intended) at what your eyes are doing. Maybe that's where the pause is coming from. If not, then I wouldn't worry too much about it.
 
I'm at the pool hall right now posting from my phone , I'm trying to place my grip more to the back at end of wrap , with doing this I find myself still choked up I have no idea why , I see players holding at middle of wrap and not choke up, well I'll keep trying.

To the previous poster, you are 100% right, that's how I see it also, naturally I do this, while I'm pulling back at last stroke I look at cueball contact, then while the pause, I look at the object ball then fire, as you describe it, so my question to you, how did you used to look at this without the pause? Thanks
 
asbani said:
I'm at the pool hall right now posting from my phone , I'm trying to place my grip more to the back at end of wrap , with doing this I find myself still choked up I have no idea why , I see players holding at middle of wrap and not choke up, well I'll keep trying.

To the previous poster, you are 100% right, that's how I see it also, naturally I do this, while I'm pulling back at last stroke I look at cueball contact, then while the pause, I look at the object ball then fire, as you describe it, so my question to you, how did you used to look at this without the pause? Thanks
Click to expand...

So unless you change your eye pattern it will be difficult to get rid of the pause. I think what most guys do is they pause AT THE CUE BALL after all their warmup strokes. At that point, they focus on the object ball, do their back stroke, and fire away. That's how I used to do it.

The question is: Why get rid of the pause at all? If your eyes naturally follow the pattern that you described, why not just keep it that way and keep the pause? Seems like a lot of trouble to go through to eliminate something a lot of great players use.
 
One more reason I like the pause:

It forces you to slow down. When I feel like I'm moving too fast all I have to focus on is slowing down my eyes....then my arm will follow suit. I've found it's much easier to lead with the eyes than the other way around.

So instead of trying to tell yourself to slow your arm down a bit you just slow your eyes down...much easier.
 
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