Price it like Blue Diamond, and I will use it!
Please explain why kamui chalk is a "scam"
- Thread starter cleary
- Start date
Kamui
I bought two cubes of the original Kamui, one I gave to a friend of mine. I really like the chalk. My only problem was worrying where it was, and leaving it on the table. Think of it like cars, does a Lexus get you to the local grocery store better than a Chevy Impala? No, but it is more comfortable, quiet, and appealing. Both accomplish the same thing, the difference in price can only be justified by your specific needs.
I bought two cubes of the original Kamui, one I gave to a friend of mine. I really like the chalk. My only problem was worrying where it was, and leaving it on the table. Think of it like cars, does a Lexus get you to the local grocery store better than a Chevy Impala? No, but it is more comfortable, quiet, and appealing. Both accomplish the same thing, the difference in price can only be justified by your specific needs.
Rhetorical question? Don't know the reason? It cost 120 times more than the industry standard.
Placebo effect
Comparing chalk is easy
Comparing the spin produced with different chalks isn't hard to do - and you don't need to do a "blind" test. Just shoot straight into a rail with the same amount of sidespin each time and compare the angles you get.
Here's how to control the variables.
For a shot to be counted, it must satisfy all of the following conditions:
1. Hit the cue ball on the same spot each time:
- Use a Centennial ball as the cue ball, with the number facing you and the two little triangles on either side of the number on the ball's "equator". Wipe any chalk marks off before each shot.
- Check the chalk mark after shooting.
- For the shot to be counted, the chalk mark must be right on the little triangle.
2. Hit the same spot on the rail each time, from straight on:
- Place the "cue ball" on the head spot or foot spot.
- Place blocking balls on either side of the diamond on the long rail directly across from the spot (the diamond midway between the corner and side pockets), leaving enough room between them for the "cue ball" plus a half inch or so on either side.
- For the shot to be counted, the "cue ball" must hit the rail between the blocking balls and rebound without touching either one.
3. Hit each shot at the same speed:
- Pick a distance for the cue ball to travel after hitting the far rail. For slower shots it could be the rail nearest you. For faster shots it could be center table after rebounding from the rail nearest you, or even all the way back to the opposite rail again.
- For the shot to be counted, the "cue ball" must come to rest within a few inches of the target distance.
4. Hit many shots:
- For the shot to be counted, its result must be very close to other identical shots with the same chalk.
I've used this test many times to see if any stick/tip/chalk produces noticably more or less spin than another. I've never found a significant difference. I very much doubt that we'll see one with Kamui.
pj
chgo
Comparing the spin produced with different chalks isn't hard to do - and you don't need to do a "blind" test. Just shoot straight into a rail with the same amount of sidespin each time and compare the angles you get.
Here's how to control the variables.
For a shot to be counted, it must satisfy all of the following conditions:
1. Hit the cue ball on the same spot each time:
- Use a Centennial ball as the cue ball, with the number facing you and the two little triangles on either side of the number on the ball's "equator". Wipe any chalk marks off before each shot.
- Check the chalk mark after shooting.
- For the shot to be counted, the chalk mark must be right on the little triangle.
2. Hit the same spot on the rail each time, from straight on:
- Place the "cue ball" on the head spot or foot spot.
- Place blocking balls on either side of the diamond on the long rail directly across from the spot (the diamond midway between the corner and side pockets), leaving enough room between them for the "cue ball" plus a half inch or so on either side.
- For the shot to be counted, the "cue ball" must hit the rail between the blocking balls and rebound without touching either one.
3. Hit each shot at the same speed:
- Pick a distance for the cue ball to travel after hitting the far rail. For slower shots it could be the rail nearest you. For faster shots it could be center table after rebounding from the rail nearest you, or even all the way back to the opposite rail again.
- For the shot to be counted, the "cue ball" must come to rest within a few inches of the target distance.
4. Hit many shots:
- For the shot to be counted, its result must be very close to other identical shots with the same chalk.
I've used this test many times to see if any stick/tip/chalk produces noticably more or less spin than another. I've never found a significant difference. I very much doubt that we'll see one with Kamui.
pj
chgo
I don't mean to be devils advocate but your opinion is biased if you spent the $30. I mean if I dropped $30 on a cube of chalk I could swear up and down that pigs are flying
It may "work" in a fashion similar to the placebo effect. :smile:
Never used it and have no intention of buying it. Simply too pricey. Am curious as to the profit margin on the product (not that I like counting other people's money, mind you).
J
I have a cube of Kamuii that I haven't tried yet but will break out the next time I play. That being said, here is my two cents. The purpose of any chalk is to increase the friction between the tip and the cue ball. Cost aside, to say that one product cannot do this better than another because of research and technological advances is foolish. Even though I haven't used mine yet, I did swipe it onto one of my fingertips and noticed a difference immediately in the consistency and feel compared to other chalks (I have tried Blue Diamond, Masters, Silver Cup, and others). I am glad to see that a company is trying to make advances in an area of the sport that has long been stagnant. I don't understand why pool players are so critical of new products and resistant to change. They should be happy that someone is trying to innovate. It happens all the time in other sports. For example, tennis strings are constantly changing designs due to technological advances.
Yes, but not at 20x the price of the others.
There is always a problem when the pricing of any product in any industry gives the appearance that the company is taking unreasonable advantage of their customers. Most times it has a longer term, negative effect on the entire company and it's product(s).
J
I never said it did or didn't do anything. I just said that I am glad that a company is trying to develop a higher quality product.
In a free market customers cannot be taken advantage of. No one forces people to buy Kamuii chalk. It is a choice. If their product is good and people find it desirable, then it will sell and the company will succeed. If someone is dumb enough to continually buy it because of what they are told through advertising without evaluating it and deciding its worth then shame on them.
In theory, absolutely correct, in practice, not always so.
Mass marketers, television evangelists, medical quacks, home shopping networks, and, of course, Madison Avenue, were rarely penalized financially for underestimating the foolishness and gullibility of their customers. :smile:
J
You people are crazy with the placebo effect.. If that were the case, I would have fallen in love with the new kamui 1.21 chalk. I didn't. It doesn't grip as well. I wish it did, I bought 4 cubes of it... just didn't. Glad I could trade off the 1.21 for .98 pretty easy.
Anyone who tries this chalk for an hour and doesn't see a difference, either is using the wrong end of the cue or just simply is thick headed. I've yet to see one person try it in person that didn't automatically see the difference.
I don't care if you people like it or not or if you're too cheap to try it or not... Doesn't matter to me. The point of this thread is the people who think its a scam are the people who haven't tried it.. its pretty obvious.
I agree that it is not a scam either. It does everything it is advertised to do... and then some.
I also do not like the chalk and feel it is not good for my game and how I have learned to play over the last 12 years... it's just not for me.
I also do not like the chalk and feel it is not good for my game and how I have learned to play over the last 12 years... it's just not for me.
huuu BOOOOOORING!!!!
You could take this thread, translate it in German und would have an nearly exact copy (ok- probaly the other direction would be easier).
Two sides- guys who mention the price (What cue do you play? What tip do you play?) and others who are curios enough to give it a try.
I give a f*** if it´s a placebo!
Each item, which makes me feel more comfortable may be ok, if it´s worth to me.
Does it make me play a better pool? Probably not! Does it feel better? Yessssss!
Is that enough to get it? For me yessssssss!
Does everyone has to get it? Noooooooo!
Am I out of this thread? Yessssssssss!
You could take this thread, translate it in German und would have an nearly exact copy (ok- probaly the other direction would be easier).
Two sides- guys who mention the price (What cue do you play? What tip do you play?) and others who are curios enough to give it a try.
I give a f*** if it´s a placebo!
Each item, which makes me feel more comfortable may be ok, if it´s worth to me.
Does it make me play a better pool? Probably not! Does it feel better? Yessssss!
Is that enough to get it? For me yessssssss!
Does everyone has to get it? Noooooooo!
Am I out of this thread? Yessssssssss!
1. I say not a scam.
2. i say overpriced .
3. i say I love it. (this makes me mad about #2)
I was gifted a cube a few months back,have used it exclusivly since, and would like to share my experience with it and impressions.
At first it does feel a bit weird applying it, because you cant help but think 'man this is going on so thick' and yes that first shot does leave a chalk residue mark on the ball and some also fell to the table. i quickly realized this wasnt that big of an issue compared to regular chalk because its just not an issue on subsequent shots, not any more than other chalk.
i like the rythym i can get into going from one shot to the next with out having to chalk up again.
My absolute most favorite thing about the chalk is consistancy.
I dont love it because it allows me to impart any more english or spin to the cueball. I love it because it allows me to impart the amount of spin i do get to the cue ball more consistantly from shot to shot. and without re-chalking.
even when using any other chalk i guilty of not chalking every shot. and may go 2-3 shots without chalking. and there is a difference in each of those 2-3 shots.. not with the kamuii. and not for quite a few shots i might add.
the tenth feels just as grippy as the 1st otr second.
2. i say overpriced .
3. i say I love it. (this makes me mad about #2)
I was gifted a cube a few months back,have used it exclusivly since, and would like to share my experience with it and impressions.
At first it does feel a bit weird applying it, because you cant help but think 'man this is going on so thick' and yes that first shot does leave a chalk residue mark on the ball and some also fell to the table. i quickly realized this wasnt that big of an issue compared to regular chalk because its just not an issue on subsequent shots, not any more than other chalk.
i like the rythym i can get into going from one shot to the next with out having to chalk up again.
My absolute most favorite thing about the chalk is consistancy.
I dont love it because it allows me to impart any more english or spin to the cueball. I love it because it allows me to impart the amount of spin i do get to the cue ball more consistantly from shot to shot. and without re-chalking.
even when using any other chalk i guilty of not chalking every shot. and may go 2-3 shots without chalking. and there is a difference in each of those 2-3 shots.. not with the kamuii. and not for quite a few shots i might add.
the tenth feels just as grippy as the 1st otr second.
I have tried Kamui .98.
I don't think it is a scam.
I do think it is overpriced.
For me it does not produce better results than Masters or Blue Diamond or NIH.
I think it is a great example of how effective marketing can be used to justify a price point that to many seems outrageous.
To me it doesn't have the performance vs. price ratio to justify its cost and therefore I choose not to buy it. I am happy with other chalk choices.
I also think its funny that those who do buy Kamui chalk seem to have a need to criticize others about being cheapskates and can't accept that people just don't agree with them about this chalk.
If Kamui chalk has value for you use it, but don't try to force it on others. If you ask someone's opinion take it and don't argue with them. It is after all their opinion.
Enjoy your chalk of choice.
I don't think it is a scam.
I do think it is overpriced.
For me it does not produce better results than Masters or Blue Diamond or NIH.
I think it is a great example of how effective marketing can be used to justify a price point that to many seems outrageous.
To me it doesn't have the performance vs. price ratio to justify its cost and therefore I choose not to buy it. I am happy with other chalk choices.
I also think its funny that those who do buy Kamui chalk seem to have a need to criticize others about being cheapskates and can't accept that people just don't agree with them about this chalk.
If Kamui chalk has value for you use it, but don't try to force it on others. If you ask someone's opinion take it and don't argue with them. It is after all their opinion.
Enjoy your chalk of choice.
Dude you really need to chill on the Kamui chalk. How can anyone have a decent conversation on this subject with your ****ing stupid posts. Seriously some people are going to have a different opinion than you. That doesn't make them thick headed. It almost seems like you are trolling everybody who isn't a big fan of Kamui.
I need to chill? Am I not chill? Really? So you're telling me it's all in my head, yet not listening to what I'm saying...
Of course you can have an opinion. Anyone can have an opinion. But how much is my opinion on "visiting Brazil" worth if I've never been to Brazil? It's not worth a damn! That's my point dog. Most of these people with opinions have never tried it so what is their opinion really worth? Not a lot...
So instead of doing the logical thing and actually trying it, they just say... 'yea its just the placebo effect.. you're crazy'.
K dude... k
