CJ Wiley Runs 29 balls in 1P using TOI

I find it funny that we have so many haters on here. We are lucky to have CJ sharing his knowledge with us. I just think some people are jealous because you could implant all the knowledge out there on the game and they will never be any better then they are now or they are legends in their own mind already. It is like what Sarah said to Eddie in The Hustler, "He'll break your heart, your guts, and for the same reason. He hates you because of what you are, cause of what you have and he hasn't.".

P.S. Thanks CJ for sharing your information.

And a lot of us find it sad that there are so many on here that think pros are going to give them the magic bullet they keep searching for. They can't make it on their own because they don't practice correctly, so they think doing whatever a pro says, no matter how much B.S. in involved in what he says, will make them play better.

Lenny, maybe some day you will "wake up" and realize that it has nothing to do with "hate" like you and a few others like to spew out. It has a lot to do with factual information. Maybe some day some of you will get the star-struck glare out of your eyes to be able to see things for what they really are.

Earlier, no one but CJ knew about TOI, which is why he was able to beat everyone, now, he says a lot of the top guys use it too, trying to add credence to what he says about using it. Which is it? When he gets called on some statements that obviously are false, he resorts to changing spelling of names for an insult, and stating things to be insulting like he did to nahog99 in post #158.

The fact that you and others want to so eagerly defend someone on here posting blatant false info and insults just because he won a few tournaments is pretty sad. That no one is allowed to disagree with him with out being labeled haters shows just who the real haters on here really are.
 
29 ball run edited

It's pretty obvious to me that this video was edited. If you look closely
you will notice that his finger nails are much longer in the second rack.
And I know for a fact that they would take longer than a few minutes
to grow. And don't try to say that your girl friend did something to them
in between racks C.J. We're not going for it, nosirreee. And what about
that wax build up in your left ear that wasn't there at first. PLEASE.
I'd like to see you try and get away with this stuff on the real pool
forum onepocket.org. All of the 12 members would be on you like flies
on a rib roast mister.
nobodys fool jack
 
And a lot of us find it sad that there are so many on here that think pros are going to give them the magic bullet they keep searching for. They can't make it on their own because they don't practice correctly, so they think doing whatever a pro says, no matter how much B.S. in involved in what he says, will make them play better.

Lenny, maybe some day you will "wake up" and realize that it has nothing to do with "hate" like you and a few others like to spew out. It has a lot to do with factual information. Maybe some day some of you will get the star-struck glare out of your eyes to be able to see things for what they really are.

Earlier, no one but CJ knew about TOI, which is why he was able to beat everyone, now, he says a lot of the top guys use it too, trying to add credence to what he says about using it. Which is it? When he gets called on some statements that obviously are false, he resorts to changing spelling of names for an insult, and stating things to be insulting like he did to nahog99 in post #158.

The fact that you and others want to so eagerly defend someone on here posting blatant false info and insults just because he won a few tournaments is pretty sad. That no one is allowed to disagree with him with out being labeled haters shows just who the real haters on here really are.

Maybe not the "magic" bullet but certainly as CJ said on his Ultimate Secrets DVD, it's like magic and knowledge IS magic.

Whether or not any pro can give us a magic solution or not doens't matter. One thing that they can give us, which CJ has done many many many times, is their perspective earned through the heat of battle at the top levels.

You don't know what that's like Neil. I don't know. And MOST members on AZB don't know it.

If we flip it and say that this was a car forum then their might be a lot of amateur mechanics trying to learn and it would be a 100% lock that there would be some pro mechanics who know things that aren't taught in books and can't be learned just through self-directed practice.

Who cares if SOME people are looking for magic bullets and shortcuts. The reality is that nothing CJ gives up and nothing that you give up and nothing that anyone gives up is going to to turn a B layer into a champion WITHOUT a ton of work and even more help. So what if some people like to listen to the pro and try out his methods thinking that they will get a shortcut to shortstop level. Big deal, people buy workout videos and abandon them all day long. But SOME people stick to the workouts and DO change their lives.

And SOME people will work at it and change their games for the better. They MIGHT do that because of some tip you provided and they might do because of something a pro said. When you give out tips on how to play aren't you also giving out methods that you believe to be the best practice? Aren't you trying to help another person become a better player?

How do you know that the person you are helping with your advice isn't looking for a magic tip from you?

Don't sweat what you think that the readers are looking for, just don't knock the people who are genuinely trying to help them get better.
 
Maybe not the "magic" bullet but certainly as CJ said on his Ultimate Secrets DVD, it's like magic and knowledge IS magic.

Whether or not any pro can give us a magic solution or not doens't matter. One thing that they can give us, which CJ has done many many many times, is their perspective earned through the heat of battle at the top levels.

You don't know what that's like Neil. I don't know. And MOST members on AZB don't know it.

If we flip it and say that this was a car forum then their might be a lot of amateur mechanics trying to learn and it would be a 100% lock that there would be some pro mechanics who know things that aren't taught in books and can't be learned just through self-directed practice.

Who cares if SOME people are looking for magic bullets and shortcuts. The reality is that nothing CJ gives up and nothing that you give up and nothing that anyone gives up is going to to turn a B layer into a champion WITHOUT a ton of work and even more help. So what if some people like to listen to the pro and try out his methods thinking that they will get a shortcut to shortstop level. Big deal, people buy workout videos and abandon them all day long. But SOME people stick to the workouts and DO change their lives.

And SOME people will work at it and change their games for the better. They MIGHT do that because of some tip you provided and they might do because of something a pro said. When you give out tips on how to play aren't you also giving out methods that you believe to be the best practice? Aren't you trying to help another person become a better player?

How do you know that the person you are helping with your advice isn't looking for a magic tip from you?

Don't sweat what you think that the readers are looking for, just don't knock the people who are genuinely trying to help them get better.

John, you aren't getting what I stated. Again, you are reading into it what you want to. You are making it sound like I and others don't want the pros posting here. Nothing could be farther from truth. But, what we do expect from them is the truth, not BS and putdowns and insults. I'm all for knowledge about the game, how you think I'm not is beyond me.?? How much "flack" do Eberle, Ekkes, or other pros on here get? NONE Stan does because of a controversial system that some don't seem to grasp. And, none of the others constantly resort to insults when someone disagrees with them. Get your blinders off, and quit thinking that some don't want him here. We do, we just want the truth, not exaggerations and bs. That doesn't help anyone.
 
It's funny how every pro or semi-pro who is trying to help me get better is also trying to sell me something.

Perfectly said. If Wiley wasn't trying to hawk something then JBCASES would be 100% correct.

The acting in this video is atrocious. Anybody who is quick to defend on here is obviously starstruck or is in the pool biz and has $$$$ in mind.
 
Seems like there are people in this thread who enjoy the fact that TOI has helped them, and people who enjoy arguing how everyone is delusional for buying into some hype. So everyone is happy! Great. Hugs all around.
 
And a lot of us find it sad that there are so many on here that think pros are going to give them the magic bullet they keep searching for. They can't make it on their own because they don't practice correctly, so they think doing whatever a pro says, no matter how much B.S. in involved in what he says, will make them play better.

Lenny, maybe some day you will "wake up" and realize that it has nothing to do with "hate" like you and a few others like to spew out. It has a lot to do with factual information. Maybe some day some of you will get the star-struck glare out of your eyes to be able to see things for what they really are.

Earlier, no one but CJ knew about TOI, which is why he was able to beat everyone, now, he says a lot of the top guys use it too, trying to add credence to what he says about using it. Which is it? When he gets called on some statements that obviously are false, he resorts to changing spelling of names for an insult, and stating things to be insulting like he did to nahog99 in post #158.

The fact that you and others want to so eagerly defend someone on here posting blatant false info and insults just because he won a few tournaments is pretty sad. That no one is allowed to disagree with him with out being labeled haters shows just who the real haters on here really are.

I see a good deal of the same people involved in the same behavior whether its with CTE, CJ, Stan, or whomever else is offering knowledge. I find it funny that people chose sides on aiming systems stating they do not work or they are snake oil but the best US player SVB explained his system a little bit, is he lying and providing false information?

I believe its different strokes for different folks, what might work for you might not work for me and vice versa. I just try and be open minded and give certain things a shot because all the tools and information add up. To succeed and become a good player you need to practice what you learn. I have seen plenty of pool videos teaching all the same old stuff with just a different face on the screen. A good deal of stuff not shared for many years with the masses is coming out in bits and pieces which is great, there is no magic bullet I know but pool is like a puzzle you need to figure out and put together to complete the picture.

I desire to learn new things and ideas, when you close your mind off then you cease to learn, become better, or not reach the true potential you might have in there which is why I see many players who have been playing the same game at the same level for 30-40 years. I wonder why that is but we can say its not enough practice or talent which is true but some people believe they know it all and stunt their mental growth.

If I think something is BS to me then I usually pass it by instead of coming in spewing the insults on someone selling a product. There are some very good DVDs out there which you can learn from, but you have to at least watch it to see if you pick up something to add to your game before knocking it without even giving it a shot. I have no problem with someone who watches a video and paid money who wants to come on here and tell it how it is from what they experienced whether good or bad. I think CJ has controlled himself quite well and is giving back what he is getting.
 
I see a good deal of the same people involved in the same behavior whether its with CTE, CJ, Stan, or whomever else is offering knowledge. I find it funny that people chose sides on aiming systems stating they do not work or they are snake oil but the best US player SVB explained his system a little bit, is he lying and providing false information?

I believe its different strokes for different folks, what might work for you might not work for me and vice versa. I just try and be open minded and give certain things a shot because all the tools and information add up. To succeed and become a good player you need to practice what you learn. I have seen plenty of pool videos teaching all the same old stuff with just a different face on the screen. A good deal of stuff not shared for many years with the masses is coming out in bits and pieces which is great, there is no magic bullet I know but pool is like a puzzle you need to figure out and put together to complete the picture.

I desire to learn new things and ideas, when you close your mind off then you cease to learn, become better, or not reach the true potential you might have in there which is why I see many players who have been playing the same game at the same level for 30-40 years. I wonder why that is but we can say its not enough practice or talent which is true but some people believe they know it all and stunt their mental growth.

If I think something is BS to me then I usually pass it by instead of coming in spewing the insults on someone selling a product. There are some very good DVDs out there which you can learn from, but you have to at least watch it to see if you pick up something to add to your game before knocking it without even giving it a shot. I have no problem with someone who watches a video and paid money who wants to come on here and tell it how it is from what they experienced whether good or bad. I think CJ has controlled himself quite well and is giving back what he is getting.

I don't know what forum you have been reading, but it sure isn't this one! I'm against aiming systems??? :rotflmao1::rotflmao1::rotflmao1::rotflmao1::rotflmao1: I've been one of the biggest proponents of them on here!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CJ Wiley View Post
Be patient Thaiger, there is one champion player using them, maybe Doug Gordon will share that at some point.
Bruce, cj. Bruce.

Why wait for Doug? Why not start a thread in the coaching forum yourself?

I can only think of one reason why you wouldn't...

Sent from my LG-P500 using Tapatalk
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Bruce, cj. Bruce.

Why wait for Doug? Why not start a thread in the coaching forum yourself?

I can only think of one reason why you wouldn't...

Sent from my LG-P500 using Tapatalk



This made me chuckle, all around. Well done, both of you.

Can't believe I'm saying this, I miss seeing Tim here.
 
It's funny how every pro or semi-pro who is trying to help me get better is also trying to sell me something.

Even if money is their primary goal, what would be the incentive to sell bad or incorrect info?
If you're going to try to sell DVDs, there's no reason to put bad/fake info in them, that would hurt your reputation and bottom line.

I'm not a TOI believer, but I don't fault CJ for hawking DVDs, it's not like there's buckets of cash raining down on pool players, especially when tournaments are a coin flip to break even.

I can certainly understand why incessant pushing of the products will wear thin quickly. And I don't agree with the tendency to attribute TOI to other players. But I think CJ honestly believes he's found something that helped his game and wants to share it.

Do you think Dr. Dave is wrong for charging for VEPS?
 
I don't know what forum you have been reading, but it sure isn't this one! I'm against aiming systems??? :rotflmao1::rotflmao1::rotflmao1::rotflmao1::rotflmao1: I've been one of the biggest proponents of them on here!

Neil, I am not directing my comments directly at you but at the people who continuously pop up in threads like these bashing things they have not even given a chance or know little to nothing about. If it works for the person who bought it and they are happy then that is all that matters, there are plenty of things I have thought were stupid or a waste of time and money but when I finally gave it a shot or tried it I was humbled.

It is kind of like when a piece of new technology in the electronics come out, some people will scoff and say its a gimmick without even trying it. I had someone tell me that a blu-ray player did not look any better on his TV then a regular DVD, I laughed at him, he was not using blu-ray disc but standard DVDs in it! You have people who hate smart phones, I was one of them who said I did not need one because I just call and text. I am glad I gave in and its cool to take those moments when I am bored waiting for a table at a restaurant and can read threads like this, watch a video or whatever else. You cannot live in the past or you will get left behind.

Some people are just ignorant or have nothing better to do which is probably another reason they are not as good as they could be, they spend too much time on here. I wish I could take all the time I have spent on this forum and have those hours back and applied to playing/practicing on the pool table instead.
 
All of you people who are being negative make CJs stuff stay right on page 1 with thousands of views and hundreds of replies are doing him a favor. CJ should give you guys a thank you for helping him sell more videos, that is the irony here, you are only peaking interest and giving him more air time. Maybe some of the posters in this thread are actually CJ making a mess for the purpose of creating a buzz, haha, just thought you conspiracy theory guys would get a kick out of it. The more publicity the better!
 
Even if money is their primary goal, what would be the incentive to sell bad or incorrect info?
If you're going to try to sell DVDs, there's no reason to put bad/fake info in them, that would hurt your reputation and bottom line.

I'm not a TOI believer, but I don't fault CJ for hawking DVDs, it's not like there's buckets of cash raining down on pool players, especially when tournaments are a coin flip to break even.

I can certainly understand why incessant pushing of the products will wear thin quickly. And I don't agree with the tendency to attribute TOI to other players. But I think CJ honestly believes he's found something that helped his game and wants to share it.

Do you think Dr. Dave is wrong for charging for VEPS?

Tap, tap, tap, frickin TAP!

Once again, pool players worrying about the money somebody else makes.
 
I didn't say he uses a lot of outside english, i said he uses outside english a lot. Or in other words, often.


So it's official, Efren plays exactly like you do Mr. "Nahag" :clapping:

Yes... clearly.. But seriously you asked me to "watch closely" and "make observations." "It's about being accurate in the observation." I always watch closely. I always think about what the player is doing, why they are doing it, if it worked, if not why didn't it work, I think about other possible ways of shooting that shot, etc etc, always. Was I wrong with the times i listed in my post? I know there were PLENTY more times he used some outside english after when i stopped watching(and yes I've watched the whole thing multiple times). When he is shooting nine ball and has a cut into the corner for his last shot he almost always hits it with low outside and comes two rails back down the table. Why is this? He could easily hit it with a TOI but he doesn't. It is a wide open shot with no shape required other than not scratching so why does he so often prefer the low outside finisher?

I'm not trying to "hate" on you and in fact, when I was talking about efren using outside "a lot" I wasn't even talking to you or about you so why butt in? Obviously you are helping plenty of pool players with their games and that's great. I just wish you would talk about why it really helps without all the deflection, throw, contact induced spin or lack there of and 3 part pocket system BS. A lot of players that can't even comprehend what you are talking about in those regards would still benefit from your system for one very simple reason, concentration and consistency. When you tell someone to hit a ball with so little inside that they might as well not be using any, it forces them to focus very intently on their cue placement before the shot. It also adds consistency to the game by making players use the same type of shot more often rather than doing something different on every shot. Somone like Efren however can use english how he sees fit because he has mastered it in every way. He also doesn't NEED much english on the majority of shots because he rarely gets out of line. By far the most common shot he uses is draw, stun, and follow with very little inside or outside english.

Then you make a video of running 29 balls in the same pocket, which is very impressive, and say things like "I'm just gonna put a little TOI on this shot for that added control.." I mean come on... The control isn't coming from the fact that you are using TOI its coming from the fact that you've played millions of hours of pool. Your stroke, consistency, speed and knowledge of where the cue ball is going is why you can run 29 balls into the same pocket NOT the fact that you are using a TOI on *most* of them.
 
It's funny how every pro or semi-pro who is trying to help me get better is also trying to sell me something.

I don't really mind if they're selling it softly. Max has made mention of his products on a few occasions, but he also has a website with hundreds of useful tips that I have learned tons from - all of it free. Stan has come on here defending his system against attacks, but lately, Mr. Wiley has made more posts promoting his own aiming systems on Pro One threads than Stan himself has.

CJ OTOH is starting to remind me more of Professor Harold Hill in "The Music Man". Remember that one, where a Mid-Western huckster comes into an Iowa town trying to sell them musical instruments that he really can't provide?

I can even see CJ in the lead role. What do you think?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?client=mv-google&gl=US&hl=en&v=s60hOgqLFGg&nomobile=1
 
Enjoy Your Day Everyone, WE Got Class ;-)

Tap, tap, tap, frickin TAP!

Once again, pool players worrying about the money somebody else makes.

If it was about "money" I wouldn't give away thousands of dollars in information every day.

I'm repaying a debt, a debt to a Game that has given me more than all the gold in Fort Knox. This is the only way I could possible repay that debt, to share the knowledge that was freely given to me.

Thanks to my Teacher that saved my life from a sentence of boredom and mediocrity. :)

'The Game is My Teacher' - Enjoy Your Day Everyone, WE Got Class.
;)
 
If it was about "money" I wouldn't give away thousands of dollars in information every day.

I'm repaying a debt, a debt to a Game that has given me more than all the gold in Fort Knox. This is the only way I could possible repay that debt, to share the knowledge that was freely given to me.

Thanks to my Teacher that saved my life from a sentence of boredom and mediocrity. :)

'The Game is My Teacher' - Enjoy Your Day Everyone, WE Got Class.
;)

Eh? You do sell your DVDs, correct?
 
I just like all the sterling personalities on this Forum

Eh? You do sell your DVDs, correct?

The Game sell videos through me, I'm nothing more than "the messenger". ;)

Don't fool yourself, my business is consulting for major night clubs, restaurants and pool rooms, Pool is a passionate hobby, there's no money in DVD's, I do it for my "Karma".

I also like all the sterling personalities on this Forum. ;)

Peace My Brothers, Enjoy Your Class, 'The Game is the Teacher'

karma1.jpg
 
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