Bonus Ball Playoffs ******

SJDinPHX said:
Roger, I can't believe you are saying these things ???...Everyone who has ever played even ONE game of pool, knows the basics of 8 ball !..That would include any CEO of a hugh corperation, who may be willing to invest advertising $$$$, in some TV pool venture..

As I've said before, BB had some good concepts, and had they chosen a pro-version of 8 ball, they may have had a prayer, of getting it off the ground ! The inventor, (and his ego) wanted HIS game to shine..but, as all the 'smarts' saw from the git-go... it did not have a chance !..All he did, was alienate, and disrupt, what few good solid promoter's we had !..He may have set pool back 20 years !...Did we need that ???

I am not saying Bonus Ball could not be an enjoyable game, but ONLY for upper level players !..Comparing it with One Pocket, (a game also not suited for the masses),..is a joke !..The confusing rules, and the horrible way it was managed and presented, were a lesson in how NOT to approach something,(anything, for that matter)..A potential sponsor, would be bored to death with the nuances of the game, and would not give someone trying to promote it, 2 minutes of their time !

I consider you a friend, and I know you got caught up in BB at the outset..But, I'm asking you please...Give it up, and move on !!!..We've ALL made mistakes..(but few as bad as embracing Boner Ball.. LOL :wink:) You are better than that ! :sorry: :sorry: :sorry:

Dick
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Please, Dick, don't have a heart attack. I'm just not understanding why so many people are against the game. I do understand why they were not pleased with the way Bonus ball was presented, but I'm having a hard time understanding the animosity toward the game, itself.

It's just a game.

Roger
 
bfdlad said:
Yeah, I agree that there is another target audience beyond the AZB crew a the avid League player but I still believe that they are the stating point an may be able to spread the word. Otherwise It like we would be skipping a major step in growth or a realistic step that needs to be taken. One step at a time and like some say word of mouth is the best advertising. This whole thing is a puzzle.[/QUOTE]

Who's going to successfully connect those 2 dots??? ;)
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PETROBOY said:
Is BB still being streamed? if not did people get their money back that bought a year pass?
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I bought a year pass and wasted my money. I emailed and asked where my money went to. They don't reply to your questions or emails.
 
seussman said:
I bought a year pass and wasted my money. I emailed and asked where my money went to. They don't reply to your questions or emails.
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thats just wrong. I would be pissed. At least give an excuse or something. i am pissed for you.
 
KoolKat9Lives said:
bfdlad said:
Yeah, I agree that there is another target audience beyond the AZB crew a the avid League player but I still believe that they are the stating point an may be able to spread the word. Otherwise It like we would be skipping a major step in growth or a realistic step that needs to be taken. One step at a time and like some say word of mouth is the best advertising. This whole thing is a puzzle.[/QUOTE]

Who's going to successfully connect those 2 dots??? ;)
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Matt,I would love to connect those dots. I have some ideas and think I know what to do but I need someone with a TON of credibility behind me. I have had some interesting conversations latley I will leave it at that for now and its not going to happen overnight. Check our American Billiard Radio this week.
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elizabeth9 said:
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I listened to an interview regarding tv and professional events...and the reality is the focus and target should be placed on attracting an audience that does not play pool.
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There is a logic error in there somewhere.

That makes sense from the perspective of a bigger target market, but reality says most of those people would rather watch American idol than pool.
 
When BB was all the talk, I went to their site, read the rules, and watched all the early matches in the first few weeks. (The free ones).

In all that time I was constantly confused with the rules. It was very hard to keep track of strategy because of that.

Now, I'm just an average player, but I play all the games. From 9 ball to bank pool to 3 cushion Billiards. I have no trouble with any of their rule sets.

Even when I was a banger about the only things that confused me were the minutia rules. Such as ball must hit a rail or it's a foul. But in all the games, I was never confused with the basic principle and strategy. In watching BB I just could rarely figure out what was going on.

This is just my perspective, after being genuinely excited about BB and giving it a chance.
 
Roger Long said:
Please, Dick, don't have a heart attack. I'm just not understanding why so many people are against the game. I do understand why they were not pleased with the way Bonus ball was presented, but I'm having a hard time understanding the animosity toward the game, itself.

It's just a game.

Roger
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I don't think that anyone had animosity toward the game itself. It was the poor execution coupled with arrogance that turned people off. That and the fact that the game felt irrelevant at the outset, period. Why in the world would legions of league players want to watch something other than the game they know and can relate to? Little league baseball players can watch the pro game with ease. Its easy to know whats going on and then root for a player or team. Not so with pool and bonus ball.

I will concede that a team based approach has merit and promotes a human dimension to the game which is good. But SJ Dick got it right in his comparison to onepoocket, another great but sadly unmarketable game.

I'll leave it to rest with suggesting that a team based 8 ball approach would be where my money would be invested. And believe me, I'm not mad at my money. I love pool, but people have got to separate their egos and their passion from what is realistically possible in pool.
 
seussman said:
I bought a year pass and wasted my money. I emailed and asked where my money went to. They don't reply to your questions or emails.
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We've called BB 3 times, left messages, been on automated hold for hours. Nothing, nada, zip. Others we know have as well. Why no one (Kim Spies?) doesn't remotely access the voice messages or return emails and respond???

We've asked Nathan about this, prior to the resumption of play in the beginning of November. He told us something along the lines of "no one is there now." He suggested we call when play resumed, but we failed to do so.

Perhaps those that lost their subscription money should call BB (# can be found at www.wpbltv.com) @ February 5th, when playoffs are scheduled. Good luck.

BTW, we spoke with Michaela at the Cup at the Euro after party. She says the playoffs are "on" and she's reffing. There will... ummm, likely be player changes... She also said BB doesn't want to "sell" BB to media until the playoffs are completed. "We need a completed product".

Time will tell. As much as a clusterFk this has been, I want to watch it.
 
jalapus logan said:
I don't think that anyone had animosity toward the game itself. It was the poor execution coupled with arrogance that turned people off. That and the fact that the game felt irrelevant at the outset, period. Why in the world would legions of league players want to watch something other than the game they know and can relate to? Little league baseball players can watch the pro game with ease. Its easy to know whats going on and then root for a player or team. Not so with pool and bonus ball.

I will concede that a team based approach has merit and promotes a human dimension to the game which is good. But SJ Dick got it right in his comparison to onepoocket, another great but sadly unmarketable game.

I'll leave it to rest with suggesting that a team based 8 ball approach would be where my money would be invested. And believe me, I'm not mad at my money. I love pool, but people have got to separate their egos and their passion from what is realistically possible in pool.
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Hard to argue with this post. If it's completed, gets on the air and is received well by masses, gets another season, doesn't jam a stick up other events and is a success - I'll be happy. But I'll eat my hat first.
 
Roger Long said:
Please, Dick, don't have a heart attack. I'm just not understanding why so many people are against the game. I do understand why they were not pleased with the way Bonus ball was presented, but I'm having a hard time understanding the animosity toward the game, itself.

It's just a game.

Roger
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My take on this is that BB might be fun to play but its rather dull to watch (even for some avid pool fans) not to mention if you want to play bonus ball you pretty much have to buy a special set of balls. 8-ball on the other hand is the universal game. Even the total novices out there have at least a basic understanding of how to play 8-ball. I think people are going to be more apt to watch a game that they understand and can go down to the bar to play on their own time.

The big problem is we cant just put pool on TV and hope to build a fan base (no matter what the game is)...In my opinion thats putting the cart ahead of the horse and is a big waste of money...We have to find a way to increase the fan base so that there is a demand for it on TV and then it could take off. In other words people have to WANT to watch it or they will just change the channel.
 
Roger Long said:
Please, Dick, don't have a heart attack. I'm just not understanding why so many people are against the game. I do understand why they were not pleased with the way Bonus ball was presented, but I'm having a hard time understanding the animosity toward the game, itself.

It's just a game.

Roger
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Bonus Ball forces multi-rail banks, multi-rail kicks, and involves a fairly high degree of strategy. In these respects, it is most similar, IMO, to my very favorite game: one pocket. But nobody sane thinks a league player, much less a non-player, would ever enjoy watching one pocket. So the Game of BB was pretty well designed to force hard shots and be played at a fast clip, two things that could make pool more fun for regular people to watch.

The BB League, however, has made a lot of mistakes and appears to be continuing to do so.

It's a shame, really.
 
You don't need to buy a new set of balls to play Bonus Ball. Use 4 solids balls to replace the purple and 4 stripe balls for the orange. Simple.

The biggest problem with the game is not knowing what you and your opponent is on. I have solved this problem by changing the scoring. 1 point for orange and 1 for purple and 2 points for Bonus ball. This way when you have an even score you are always shooting purple and and odd score means you are shooting orange. A "sequence" would be worth 4 points instead of 6, so you would play the game to 20 points if you wanted to follow the format the league uses. However, I prefer the game played to 50 or 100 points using my scoring system but you can play to any number you like. I also prefer racking 10 balls instead of 8 like the 10 ball rack.
 
Cory in DC said:
Bonus Ball forces multi-rail banks, multi-rail kicks, and involves a fairly high degree of strategy. In these respects, it is most similar, IMO, to my very favorite game: one pocket. But nobody sane thinks a league player, much less a non-player, would ever enjoy watching one pocket. So the Game of BB was pretty well designed to force hard shots and be played at a fast clip, two things that could make pool more fun for regular people to watch.

The BB League, however, has made a lot of mistakes and appears to be continuing to do so.

It's a shame, really.
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IMO, the absolute most exciting event in all of pool is when a player puts up a big package like a five or six pack. While BB, 14.1, and one pocket may be great games, they do eliminate this possibility. I play all pool games myself, BB excluded, but as a fan and spectator, I'd rather see packages in rotation based games or 8 ball. I suspect that I'm not alone with this sentiment.

I watch the other games to learn and to improve my own game, but when it comes down to my spectating enjoyment, I do love those packages, sorry Bonus Ball.

Note: I don't think that 9 ball, 10 ball or even 8 ball are broken either. Nice sized packages happen with enough infrequency that they are special and memorable and exciting. All my opinion of course.
 
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One last thought: if I'm not the target audience here, then something is very, very wrong. I'm no broke a$$. I have a decent job and have decent disposable income earmarked specifically for entertainment to include pool. Put simply, I have money to burn on pool, no problem. If bonus ball is my option in pool, then I'll be spending it on other pursuits. I showed some of my well heeled pol buddies bonus ball and he couldn't even watch 5 minutes of it. His exact words were "what the f%&k was that? He never tuned in again. That's sad, because he really enjoys events like the mosconi cup. Economically, that dog don't hunt...
 
Cory in DC said:
Bonus Ball forces multi-rail banks, multi-rail kicks, and involves a fairly high degree of strategy. In these respects, it is most similar, IMO, to my very favorite game: one pocket. But nobody sane thinks a league player, much less a non-player, would ever enjoy watching one pocket. So the Game of BB was pretty well designed to force hard shots and be played at a fast clip, two things that could make pool more fun for regular people to watch.

The BB League, however, has made a lot of mistakes and appears to be continuing to do so.

It's a shame, really.
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No its not a shame,, what would have been a shame is if the gimmick game would have been a success ,,,
The wheel does not need to be reinvented

Pool certainly wont mirror top tier sports but it certainly can do much better ,, it just needs someone to grab the bull by the horns a get a tour back thats marketed better



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