What Does The Public Really Want?

[Old Nine Baller]

I'm not so sure they want clean-cut, honest, church-going, non-gambling, non-dumping poolplayers on their T.V. screen.

After seeing Deadwood, Oz, The Sopranos, SOA and a few other shows I'd say the public wants to see the "real" poolrooms and what happens in them.

Freddy Bentivegna agreed with me. We could be wrong but we've tried everything else. Why not the truth?

I am actually in contact with a few media people from ESPN, maybe they can cook up some kind of reality show. I just think writing about the old hustlers is something like writing about the Old West. It is a fascinating era that is no longer with us.

In regards to pool on T.V.; I believe the public wants to see the backroom gambling, the seedy underbelly of the beast. Much like your comparison to the Old West, they want to see shootouts and blood and bad guys. They may or may not want to see the good guys win but they want to see a showdown on Main Street at High Noon.

My sentiments exactly re what the public would like to see.


Freddy

Freddy and I may have been wrong but there's nothing wrong with trying it out.

ONB

 

[slide13]

I'm sure that is a great idea if you want to market a pool show to the lowest common denominator creating yet another vapid reality program that appeals to the masses. I don't think it would be good for pool in the long run, but I'm sure it could be done such that the show itself would be a success.

 

[sjm]

I'm sure that is a great idea if you want to market a pool show to the lowest common denominator creating yet another vapid reality program that appeals to the masses. I don't think it would be good for pool in the long run, but I'm sure it could be done such that the show itself would be a success.

Well said. A reality show could possibly succeed, but if it reinforces to parents that pool is a sport in which everybody tries to rob everyone else, it's a long term failure. Without young players, the game is in trouble. As many on this forum have noted, in America, we've already lost a generation of young players, and we must somehow reverse this trend.

 

[Old Nine Baller]

I'm sure that is a great idea if you want to market a pool show to the lowest common denominator creating yet another vapid reality program that appeals to the masses. I don't think it would be good for pool in the long run, but I'm sure it could be done such that the show itself would be a success.

I enjoyed Oz without wanting to be in a maximum security prison. I enjoyed Deadwood but never once dreamed I would've liked to have been there in 1876. The same feelings with Sopranos and SOA and other well-done shows. I feel these shows made me "feel" as if I was there and I felt as if they were "real". That's why I liked them.

I am not "the lowest common denominator" although I quite take your point. I don't think Freddy & I were thinking of a "reality" show where a bunch of idiots act like idiots but a "real" depiction of what poolplayers are and what they do. Some are decent and some are not. Vive La Difference.

ONB

 

[slide13]

I enjoyed Oz without wanting to be in a maximum security prison. I enjoyed Deadwood but never once dreamed I would've liked to have been there in 1876. The same feelings with Sopranos and SOA and other well-done shows. I feel these shows made me "feel" as if I was there and I felt as if they were "real". That's why I liked them.

I am not "the lowest common denominator" although I quite take your point. I don't think Freddy & I were thinking of a "reality" show where a bunch of idiots act like idiots but a "real" depiction of what poolplayers are and what they do. Some are decent and some are not. Vive La Difference.

ONB

Are you talking about a reality show or a scripted drama? I agree, a scripted drama done in the style of the shows you listed and with equally quality writing could be a cool show. I think the chances of getting a show about pool done to that level are extremely low, but it could be a cool show and I would certainly want to watch it.

If we're talking a reality show and not something scripted...I find very few of them with redeeming quality. I do think some sort of documentary could be done, much more short form than a full series, but it would be interesting.

Either way, regardless of the show, I'm not convinced it would be good for pool in the long run. A popular scripted drama could create an uptick in people checking out pool but it might also scare people away as it doesn't sound like it would present the pool world as a very welcoming and friendly type of place.

I agree that the "hustler" aspect of pool is what would appeal to people, but not sure that would help pool as a sport. As you said, "I enjoyed Oz without wanting to be in a maximum security prison." I can see people also enjoying a qualityscripted drama about pool...without making them want to ever step foot into a pool room.

 

[Ky Boy]

I'm sure that is a great idea if you want to market a pool show to the lowest common denominator creating yet another vapid reality program that appeals to the masses. I don't think it would be good for pool in the long run, but I'm sure it could be done such that the show itself would be a success.

While I hesitate to equate pool to society, I think at this point it's safe to say society as a whole is becoming less moral and ethical. With that, the general public seem to gravitate toward shows with a seedy image and drawn to the underbelly of happenings that go on in everyday life.

Shows like Duck Dynasty are an anomaly but have a strong following nonetheless as they go against the grain of what has become popular in both drama tv and reality shows. Survivor for instance, would fail without the backstabbing, lying, cheating etc.

Pool is not much different imo. I think a reality show with pool would succeed but the game itself would only be an afterthought to all the drama's created. And the drama is what draws eye's like a moth to a flame. It's evident by the post count of various threads that blow up like bombs here at AZ.

I am guilty as well of not following a thread until I see the post count rising and curiosity gets the best of me until I open the thread and watch as sh!t is slung in every direction. Life is no different either. We love conflict and even thrive on it at times.

A well thought out reality show with a professional production would be a hit as long as it incorporates the seedy side, loud boisterous people, and the pursuit of the almighty buck. But it's gotta at least appear real and not cheesy and fake.

Just my opinion!


Gary

 

[slide13]

A well thought out reality show with a professional production would be a hit as long as it incorporates the seedy side, loud boisterous people, and the pursuit of the almighty buck. But it's gotta at least appear real and not cheesy and fake.

I don't disagree with you here, I'm sure plenty of people would like the show. My question is, do you think a show that gained broad popularity by focusing on this aspect of our sport would be beneficial to pool in the long run?

I don't think it would, I feel many people already have a slightly negative view of pool players and pool halls, I don't think it would be good to reinforce that notion on a broad scale.

 

[Old Nine Baller]

Are you talking about a reality show or a scripted drama? I agree, a scripted drama done in the style of the shows you listed and with equally quality writing could be a cool show. I think the chances of getting a show about pool done to that level are extremely low, but it could be a cool show and I would certainly want to watch it.

If we're talking a reality show and not something scripted...I find very few of them with redeeming quality. I do think some sort of documentary could be done, much more short form than a full series, but it would be interesting.

Either way, regardless of the show, I'm not convinced it would be good for pool in the long run. A popular scripted drama could create an uptick in people checking out pool but it might also scare people away as it doesn't sound like it would present the pool world as a very welcoming and friendly type of place.

I agree that the "hustler" aspect of pool is what would appeal to people, but not sure that would help pool as a sport. As you said, "I enjoyed Oz without wanting to be in a maximum security prison." I can see people also enjoying a qualityscripted drama about pool...without making them want to ever step foot into a pool room.

Even though Freddy wrote "reality" show we were talking about a scripted drama along the lines of Deadwood, Oz, or other great HBO shows.

I can agree to a point with " I can see people also enjoying a quality scripted drama about pool...without making them want to ever step foot into a pool room. " but the elders of society may love the show and the youngsters may flock to poolrooms to see what the fuss is all about.

You never know until you try. We've tried everything else.

ONB

 

[Old Nine Baller]

I don't disagree with you here, I'm sure plenty of people would like the show. My question is, do you think a show that gained broad popularity by focusing on this aspect of our sport would be beneficial to pool in the long run?

I don't think it would, I feel many people already have a slightly negative view of pool players and pool halls, I don't think it would be good to reinforce that notion on a broad scale.

This has been a recurring theme since the 1950's. It's never gotten anywhere. It's time to try something else.

ONB

 

[Old Nine Baller]

This has been a recurring theme since the 1950's. It's never gotten anywhere. It's time to try something else.

ONB

Remember one thing; any publicity is good publicity.

ONB

 

[slide13]

You never know until you try. We've tried everything else.

True enough.

Honestly, I think the best thing would be a show that had some similarities to Poolhall Junkies. Love or hate the movie, it had some good things going for it.

• A young group of guys playing pool, like the ones we'd want to attract
• An approachable, likable lead character who operated on the "friendly" side pools seedier side

Add in a strong female character, better writing and story lines, and production quality like the shows you mention and I'll admit, you could have something that could have mass appeal while still helping pool as a sport. It would have to walk a very fine line to pull off both aspects at once, but maybe it could be done.

 

[Island Drive]

Well said. A reality show could possibly succeed, but if it reinforces to parents that pool is a sport in which everybody tries to rob everyone else, it's a long term failure. Without young players, the game is in trouble. As many on this forum have noted, in America, we've already lost a generation of young players, and we must somehow reverse this trend.

Ironically, while talking with Tom Rossman this year I asked him this question, ''why is it when people that don't know you, find out your a pool player'' WHAT'S do they respond with 99% of the time

Oh your must be a pool shark.............then they giggle.

I said....Tom I blame the Color of Money and how it portrayed our game, it's because of this....the POOL SHARK expression just dribbles out of their mouths EVERY FRICKIN' TIME.

He thought about it, said I never really did think about that way but your probably right! He was surprised himself to realize this, and he agreed.

If EVERY person in the US thinks this, doesn't that give us a clue NOT to go in this direction, probably NOT because herding cats in impossible :thumbup:
Many of the posters and thread starters have this mindset and just think pool is a game in the basement ONLY. Can't blame em. Anyone know someone whos grooming their kids to become pool players/pros? that U know of? :boring2:

 

[Banks]

You never know until you try. We've tried everything else.

ONB

What has everybody tried? Begging for handouts? Stealing? Hoping a conman will save the game? Throwing old, crappy tables in a strip mall and selling overpriced bags of chips and sodas?

Some people have worked their butts off - a few made it, a few are still working at it. Most everybody else just has opinions of what others should do. Just ask any business owner how often they're told "what they should do is.." by people that don't do squat, or when they do, aren't even remotely successful.

A "reality" show with a couple of misfits is not going to "save" pool. Pool needs something created that will sustain itself. Cart before the horse (and all that other stuff) applies here.

Got about as many keyboard business pros here as we do keyboard pool pros.

 

[Celophanewrap]

I think the thing is that it's already assumed that's what's in pool halls. I don't gamble or drink (much) and I know many like me. The truth is that in pool halls there is a mix of people just like everywhere else, however, drinking and gambling are much more romantic and make a far better story then some square that would rather play alone. What I've come to realize is the truth is pool doesn't interest anyone but those involved.

 

[JustPlay]

99.9% of the public play pool for fun and have no interest in pool beyond that. A well made documentary on the Pro's that play pool would be more well suited for the television viewer than another "reality" show on pool's con men . Show the public the best pool has (past and present). It would take lots of travel, money and time. But in my opinion, that would be best.

 

[macguy]

I don't disagree with you here, I'm sure plenty of people would like the show. My question is, do you think a show that gained broad popularity by focusing on this aspect of our sport would be beneficial to pool in the long run?

I don't think it would, I feel many people already have a slightly negative view of pool players and pool halls, I don't think it would be good to reinforce that notion on a broad scale.

As opposed to what is happening now? In other words, nothing in happening. Yet people keep touting doing the same thing that has proven over and over to not work. There is no doubt, like boxing, real pool played by real players would get a following.

I used to hang in action rooms and I can tell you, when something was going on you could not get in the place. 3 am and not a parking space to be found.
People like the action side of the game it has always been the games mystique. Convert that to an entertainment show and people will watch.

 

[Black-Balled]

I'm not so sure they want clean-cut, honest, church-going, non-gambling, non-dumping poolplayers on their T.V. screen.

After seeing Deadwood, Oz, The Sopranos, SOA and a few other shows I'd say the public wants to see the "real" poolrooms and what happens in them.

Freddy Bentivegna agreed with me. We could be wrong but we've tried everything else. Why not the truth?







Freddy and I may have been wrong but there's nothing wrong with trying it out.

ONB

I find t a bit of a stretch to associate you with da beard.

And to the question: the public doesn't want pool.

 

[Island Drive]

99.9% of the public play pool for fun and have no interest in pool beyond that. A well made documentary on the Pro's that play pool would be more well suited for the television viewer than another "reality" show on pool's con men . Show the public the best pool has (past and present). It would take lots of travel, money and time. But in my opinion, that would be best.

Nice...............

 

[Straightpool_99]

How about building up pool from programs such as the Mosconi cup. Pool as an international team sport, with national or even regional teams competing, with boistrous crowds and cheering. Its fun and exciting! There is always the library atmosphere of the poolroom for the enthusiasts, but for the viewing public (non poolplayers) lets make pool as exciting as it deserves to be! Lets get it on the tv, and on the public radar. Even darts get more tv coverage than pool, and they have boistrous crowds. I realize that snooker doesn't but the snooker model is a product of history and culture, and is not necessarily possible to copy. I believe that for pool the dart way is the way forward.

For this to work there needs to be a national ranking system in the US. How hard would it be to unify the various pool tournaments under a common banner? It wouldn't necessarily cost much to do IMHO, just the willingnes to cooperate on in the easiest, low cost way. Without a ranking system and a tour the US pooplayers are doomed to fight bs politcs and poverty forever.

Make a national team you can be proud of, that have risen to the top through merit. May the best man win, etc. Imagine how it would be with a Mosconi cup atmosphere in the Phillipines, China, Taiwan, Germany, England, Poland, The Netherlands, Canada etc when your team came to visit. Nation vs. Nation competing in a sportsmanlike manner. Nobody will be an instant millionaire from this, but there is a chance to make a decent living I think and some respect from the viewing audience and maybe even the Olympic commitee one day. Sponsorship should be possible to get as well. Maybe in the future when you tell someone you are a poolplayer they will think athlete/competitor instead of huster....

 

[Old Nine Baller]

As opposed to what is happening now? In other words, nothing in happening. Yet people keep touting doing the same thing that has proven over and over to not work. There is no doubt, like boxing, real pool played by real players would get a following.

I used to hang in action rooms and I can tell you, when something was going on you could not get in the place. 3 am and not a parking space to be found.
People like the action side of the game it has always been the games mystique. Convert that to an entertainment show and people will watch.

Yep, that's the way it is.

ONB