Does anyone want to improve their game?

D

Doug the horse

Registered
I'm trying to understand why nearly all of the local tournaments here in central Florida have gone to a league style handicap format. I know it gives the worst players in town a little bit of hope to make it through a few rounds but is that REALLY what keeps new players playing? When I was coming up the ladder I took a beating until I spent enough time and money practicing until I could hold my own. I don't see any incentive in improving your game when you can win with a 3 or 4 handicap. And then there is the whole sandbagging thing and all the bellyaching that goes along with it. I'm getting tired of tournament directors complaining about all of the non stop fussing over handicaps and ROOM OWNERS whining about not making money because their place looks like a ghost town except when a tournament is going on. Maybe if you had to spend some time practicing in order to win the halls would be doing better. In my opinion leagues are GREAT for bars and pool rooms but not for pool room tournaments.
 
where in flare you and whats you apa level?
just askin???:smile:
 
Doug the horse said:
I'm trying to understand why nearly all of the local tournaments here in central Florida have gone to a league style handicap format. I know it gives the worst players in town a little bit of hope to make it through a few rounds but is that REALLY what keeps new players playing? When I was coming up the ladder I took a beating until I spent enough time and money practicing until I could hold my own. I don't see any incentive in improving your game when you can win with a 3 or 4 handicap. And then there is the whole sandbagging thing and all the bellyaching that goes along with it. I'm getting tired of tournament directors complaining about all of the non stop fussing over handicaps and ROOM OWNERS whining about not making money because their place looks like a ghost town except when a tournament is going on. Maybe if you had to spend some time practicing in order to win the halls would be doing better. In my opinion leagues are GREAT for bars and pool rooms but not for pool room tournaments.
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it sounds like you got put out of a tournament by a lower handicap player. just kidding but probably true :grin-square:

here is my opinion and you can call me a nit if you want. i enter a non handicapped tournament from time to time to see where i am at on the totem pole in my area.

it gets frustrating to spend 20.00-30.00 plus another 10.00 - 12.00 in quarters to be some bodys rack boy in a tournament i don't have a chance in hell of cashing in.

as for practicing to win. most family men don't have the time or money it takes to get that good. in my area most of the local tournament winners are young and single. i have talked to a few of them and they all say they spend 4-5 hours 5-6 days a week at the pool hall playing or practicing.

i my self can not devote the time and money it takes to compete with them. in a short handicap race i just need to play at my best at my current level and may have a chance if they are off a little. if they are at their best that day handicaps don't mean shit when you get blowed out 7-0 in a 7-3 race. take it from some one who has been there and done that.

don't get me wrong...i am not afraid to play even up with the best in my area. i am only a 5 and play in our masters division. i have won 1 and lost 3 so far. i do believe it helps to get better by playing against better players. that is why i joined masters. team mates and opponents alike are willing to share their knowledge with me. kinda hard to learn from an opponent in a tournament ...all he wants to do is whip the shit outa you on the table.
 
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In many ways, Doug, it's the same mentality that we see manifested in today's youth. Every one is a winner and no one is a loser. The last thing we want to do is warp little Johnny's mind by having him lose. Oh, hell no. That won't do at all.
So what do they do on league night for those who refuse to pay their dues in a pool hall like so many of the rest of have? They simply elevate their level. If the top is an A, what the hell, make 'em a C. And, if that isn't good enough for them, make 'em a B the following week. Jesus, Joseph, and Mary.
I have to go now, I have a headache. :)
 
I hate to admit it buy yes. You hit the nail on the head! I don't mind getting beat, that's part of life. I just don't like getting beat by someone who's whole strategy is " hit em hard and hope like hell". I recently returned to the game after a 14 year break and it seem like the whole scene has really changed.
 
Most of these tournaments are $10 entry with no green fees. It's an extremely cheap investment in ones self. I keep hearing things like "we want to keep it fair". Where I come from FAIR is a place where they judge pigs!
 
That is true they do play APA in these halls on 9 footers and if they wanted to have a tourney for league players that would make sense. I don't have any interest in playing on a team. I can't commit the time to it. I wish the open tourneys were straight up races. I just don't want to argue with people about handicaps. How about some sportsmanship and self respect. In the last week I've had players get so mad when I beat them they have thrown cues and balls across the room. And people accept this as normal behavior. All of this over $10.
 
This topic has been discussed many times on here before...

To have a tournament you need players, the more the better.

People are not going to keep coming back if all they do is donate.

NOBODY will.
 
I've heard that argument before and if that's truly the case then why is it such a popular debate. I owned a room up north for a number of years and never had a problem getting enough players for a $10 tourney. If people are that scared to lose ten bucks they probably shouldn't be there. How can a person justify giving their money to the local league operator every week and never getting back a dime but scared to invest in their self. Did the masses get brainwashed by the leagues while I was away?
 
Black-Balled said:
This topic has been discussed many times on here before...

To have a tournament you need players, the more the better.

People are not going to keep coming back if all they do is donate.

NOBODY will.
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Not necessarily the truth. I "donated" for months/years before I was a favorite in small weekly tournaments. Even today I "donate" regularly to regional events. I know I'm dead money, but you must pay your dues to get better; or you can "nut" hunt in handicapped tournaments for the next 30 years.
 
Think of it from an owner's perspective. Do you want to put a hundred or two into something that pays itself back and takes effort or do you want to put money into something that'll make money? The answer is in the participation.
 
The way it goes here is $10 entry no green fees. So the only way the owner makes any money is on food and drinks. And if they add money which most do trying to get players then the room owner starts out in the hole! Then they stare at an empty room because nobody is practices to improve. Why bother? If room owners want people to rent tables and maybe even get a few lessons then encourage people to improve by getting rid of handicaps. The more people invest their time and effort in ANYTHING the more likely they are to stay involved.
 
Don't get me wrong, I totally understand why the owner wants to hold handicapp tournaments, they have to respond to their customers. What irritates me is the players who are unwilling to commit their time and money to improve, and piss and moan about competition.
 
There are some nice amatuer tournaments around. Tony Crosby runs a tour and some halls in Ocala have some good monthly tournaments.
 
Why don't you take your own advice then..

Doug the horse said:
That is true they do play APA in these halls on 9 footers and if they wanted to have a tourney for league players that would make sense. I don't have any interest in playing on a team. I can't commit the time to it. I wish the open tourneys were straight up races. I just don't want to argue with people about handicaps. How about some sportsmanship and self respect. In the last week I've had players get so mad when I beat them they have thrown cues and balls across the room. And people accept this as normal behavior. All of this over $10.
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Get good enough to where any handicap doesn't matter.

Jaden
 
That sounds like a good idea. I'm all about playing better! All I know for sure is fewer and fewer people are interested in playing up to their potential and as long as they they don't have to they won't!!
 
Scott Lee said:
Just in case you didn't know...APA is played on 9' tables in several areas around the country.

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
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I play apa, bca and on Tues. start a hdcp AMRO league, at different halls, but all are 9ft tables. Infact all of the larger leages in this area are on 9ft tables. Dont see much action on bar boxes around here at all.
 
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