A Huge Thank You from CueSports International (CSI)!

S

shoreboy

Banned
cleary said:
I'm going off of what ozzy said...

"...Neither of the three parties knew that we had already scheduled and announced The Kamui Challenge and The Tiger Challenge for July 22 and 23 beginning at 5pm each day.

When I saw the flyer for their match, I immediately called Ray Hansen..."


I have no idea who posted first, nor do I care. It's no excuse for strong arming Sky
Click to expand...

So if you had guaranteed $30,000 of your money and needed to earn some of it back by selling a stream, what would you have done? Would you have ignored Skylers refusal to cooperate (which would cost you viewers and money) and still let him play for a chance to win your money? Please tell us all what you would have done. Would you have wished him the best of luck against Oscar and then welcomed him to your tourny.
 
BeiberLvr

BeiberLvr

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Last edited:
Kid Dynomite

Kid Dynomite

Dennis (Michael) Wilson
Silver Member
shoreboy said:
So if you had guaranteed $30,000 of your money and needed to earn some of it back by selling a stream, what would you have done? Would you have ignored Skylers refusal to cooperate (which would cost you viewers and money) and still let him play for a chance to win your money? Please tell us all what you would have done. Would you have wished him the best of luck against Oscar and then welcomed him to your tourny.
Click to expand...

I would recognize that a big corporation worth several million dollars and its employees with multiple degrees are a big mismatch for a 20 something pool player! Its like a pitbull against a chihuahua.

Based on my read, Sky was not the problem his backer was the problem. Applying pressure on Sky worked, but was not appropriate given the situation was beyond his control in my opinion and CSI made the decision to apply pressure knowing it was beyond his control.

Based on previous post by Mark Griffin and his feelings on double booking in the pool industry, Ozzy was forced to act accordingly to what he thought his bosses wishes are or would be. Ozzy is not the bad guy. Just an employee trying to act in the manner his boss would like.

Most troubling is CSI "motives" are very elusive?

#1. Make Money
#2. Give Back to the players
#3. Give back to the fans

I ask this above question because they have been so vocal about losing money. but, vocal about giving back to the BCA members at nationals with lessons and matches.

The players are not asking for handouts. They just want it recognized that they are vulnerable as players and would not like that vulnerability exploited. To me, that is the point of this discussion

KD
 
P

Put_upor_shutup

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Football season has been extended to 12 months next year.Each team will sign an agreement with a different broadcasting company and there will be one game broadcasted every day.This way no team will compete with others for views.

Next up on Lifetime for Women:The Dallas Cowboys vs The Minnesota Vikings..

I am however excited about starting some shit on here..Now if we could only get some more pool productions from JCIN...
 
cleary

cleary

Honestly, I'm a liar.
Silver Member
shoreboy said:
So if you had guaranteed $30,000 of your money and needed to earn some of it back by selling a stream, what would you have done? Would you have ignored Skylers refusal to cooperate (which would cost you viewers and money) and still let him play for a chance to win your money? Please tell us all what you would have done. Would you have wished him the best of luck against Oscar and then welcomed him to your tourny.
Click to expand...

If I added $30,000 to a tournament I wouldn't worry about what's happening before the tournament even starts. I would do my best to recoup the money added by selling the product I'm adding the money to. They did, as Ozzy said, have the best sales EVER in CSI history... So the 30k was a breeze.

Players made a game, set a date (around the tournament schedule), got a streamer and secured the location all prior to announcing. What they were doing had nothing to do with CSI. Sure, recoup your money but don't get butt hurt when Dancing With The Stars conflicts with your plans.
 
Mr. Bond

Mr. Bond

Orbis Non Sufficit
Gold Member
Silver Member
* cue lonely dramatic music*

..Will Oscar ever again schedule a match on top of another match...

..Will Skylar miss Turning Stone and get bumped from Team USA....

...Will the Fargorate system require chip implants in all players...

...Will Charlie and Dechaine arm wrestle for seeds...

...Will The Hustlers ever hustle again..

...Will Barry heist the prize money and move to Zimbabwe...

..Will Ralph ever pull out of anything other than his wife...

...Will Rodney stop having more babies...

...Is Earl really the offspring of an alien race....

...Does Glen Hancock really have his own zipcode....

* music swells and fades*


These are the days of our lives.
 
S

shoreboy

Banned
Put_upor_shutup said:
Football season has been extended to 12 months next year.Each team will sign an agreement with a different broadcasting company and there will be one game broadcasted every day.This way no team will compete with others for views.

Next up on Lifetime for Women:The Dallas Cowboys vs The Minnesota Vikings..

I am however excited about starting some shit on here..Now if we could only get some more pool productions from JCIN...
Click to expand...

Yep...and in the first four weeks of the season when Tom Brady isn't playing for the Patriots, he is going to promote and star in a mini football league. The games will be broadcast at the same time as the first four Patriot games. The Patriots, NFL, or TV stations will surely have no problem with that.
 
TATE

TATE

AzB Gold Mensch
Silver Member
Well, the bottom line is, if it did affect the match, I don't think it affected the final outcome. Sky's momentum going into the finish was strong. He just couldn't get there from such a large hole. If the match was longer, he may have caught Oscar. The kid has oodles of heart. Now if Sky had made the comeback run and won, I would say the 2nd day delay likely affected Oscar and the outcome.
 
Last edited:
P

Put_upor_shutup

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
TATE said:
Well, the bottom line is, if it did affect the match, it hurt Oscar on the 2nd day. Sky's momentum going into the finish was strong. He just couldn't get there from such a large hole. Given another hour, he might have. The kid has oodles of heart. The delay probably did not affect the final outcome since Oscar was ahead most of the match.
Click to expand...

sky was up 6 0 or and oscar caught a gear and was surging ahead..i think with no break oscar would have had an even bigger lead going into day 2..
 
lfigueroa

lfigueroa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
mikepage said:
That's a good point Lou. There has always been a voyeuristic interest in players "putting it on the line."

There has emerged an important distinction, though. It used to be the audience was secondary to what was going on. Now, with pay-per-view internet streaming, the audience is primary...

It used to be whispers of "what are they playing for?". Now the $20K event--or $40k in the middle because it sounds better--is the hook to get the audience.

It doesn't matter if the PLAYERS aren't playing for $20K. Hell, it doesn't even matter if the two backer groups have a saver for three fourths of the purse. What matters is you can entice viewers by saying these players are matching up for big money.

I for one love the idea of big matchups but am uncomfortable with the big money aspect for a variety of reasons.

I would prefer to see a split of the gate/subscription fees between promoter and players, and for the players' portion to be split 60/40 or 70/30 or whatever between winner and loser.

Keep the whispering behind-the-scenes "investors" with big wads of cash out of it, imo. We don't want our top players to have conflicting incentives and conflicting forces and who knows what else.

And for the record, drawing the ball in a key match of the Mosconi Cup, with everybody watching, including your teammates as well as the detractors who didn't think you should be on the team, is, I'm guessing, as hard as it gets.
Click to expand...


And I believe that the MC is huge prestige thing for the players.

So many of them have described the experience as being like no other in pool. I don't think some guys get it: the MC is not about the money.

Lou Figueroa
 
S

shoreboy

Banned
cleary said:
If I added $30,000 to a tournament I wouldn't worry about what's happening before the tournament even starts. I would do my best to recoup the money added by selling the product I'm adding the money to. They did, as Ozzy said, have the best sales EVER in CSI history... So the 30k was a breeze.

Players made a game, set a date (around the tournament schedule), got a streamer and secured the location all prior to announcing. What they were doing had nothing to do with CSI. Sure, recoup your money but don't get butt hurt when Dancing With The Stars conflicts with your plans.
Click to expand...

Dumb. The challenge matches were part of an overall stream package. scheduling on top of them could affect sales of the overall package and make it harded to get back some of the added money. Then the guy that takes money from your pocket wants to play in your tourny. you just seem to be blinded by some type of hate for CSI or Ozzy. Maybe because your bff is a disgruntled former employee?
 
lfigueroa

lfigueroa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Celtic said:
What about the possible negative consequences of breaking an action match up by 3 hours in the middle of the session? What about negative results on his match that CSI may have ultimately caused by strong arming him into taking that break?

Some players are momentum players that take a while to get into a groove and those types of players might not want to take a three hour break in the middle of a match that causes them to get out of stroke.

What about the negative hurt caused to Bigtruck's own stream when it is now forced to start earlier in the day, and go later into the night screwing up potential customers on both sides of the start and end? In effect what Ozzy forced this match to do resulted in the stream for that day being 3 hours more of a time commitment for every person watching it.

What about those negative results Ozzy basically caused by forcing their hand? That is cool that he looked out for his own interests while stepping all over the interests of those invested into the action match?
Click to expand...


I do have to say that if a player & corporation don't want to break it's their privilege for any number of reasons. I have only one experience in this regard and if anyone had asked me to delay day two of my match with JB for three hours I would have told them to go pound sand. You don't know until you're there.

Lou Figueroa
 
lfigueroa

lfigueroa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
SUPERSTAR said:
Business as usual i see.

There is one thing that sticks out about this particular thread that I find interesting.

The fact that some former pro CSI people are now coming out and criticizing CSI's actions, is in itself, very telling.

There is a way to be professional about things, and there is a way to do it like a scumbag.
Veiled/direct threats about someone's future earning ability is the way of the scumbag.
And people wonder why pool is in the sh!tter.

Next thing you know, CSI's gonna have it's VERY OWN collection of room keys.
I mean, hey, they are learning from the best, right?
Click to expand...


I believe it's important to note that having an honest disagreement is one thing. Hurling unwarranted insults is another. In particular, making comparison between CSI and CW's operation/history is below the belt, IMO.

Lou Figueroa
 
lfigueroa

lfigueroa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
mikepage said:
lol... This isn't a shitstorm. This is AZperusual. Try asking a question about aiming...

You've got the most significant pool organization in the country in the midst of its annual hurrah for both amateur and professional play scheduling two challenge matches amongst pretty much the best players on US soil for people all over with an internet connection to see.

Then you've got Oscar--a top player and up-and-coming promoter who appears all around to be a class act, and Ray--a promoter extraordinairre who has done a ton to bring excitement to many events--who inadvertently scheduled a competing pay-per-view match.

It's an unfortunate situation, but if we're all for pool, it is a no-brainer how to proceed. "Oscar, Ray, and I [Ozzy] all agreed that this was a good solution and would benefit everyone."

Good! Cool! Good for cooperation. Good for the kind of relationship building from which we all will benefit. Good for pool.

But wait!

Then word comes that "the other player's backer" had a problem...

the other player's backer?

really?

Skyler seems like a nice kid, and he's certainly one of the best players in the country. I just don't see Skyler being recalcitrant like that.

... the other player's backer...

tail trying to wag the dog

let's move on to CTE aiming or something...
Click to expand...


Mike, I don't know what your experience with backers is. Mine is admittedly limited. But believe me: once you're in the position of playing for a significant amount of another man's money you give any thought they pass along due consideration.

Lou Figueroa
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top