Jay Helfert resigned as Tourney Director at the US Open

[JAM]

It is okay to have opinions on how things should be, of course.

I think there may be some assumptions being drawn on this thread. Without knowing who said what to whom, where, and when, nobody knows what happened except Barry, Jay, and Allen.

Everything we share on this thread, other than those three, is nothing more than railbird chatter, myself included. :grin-square:

 

[markgw]

It is okay to have opinions on how things should be, of course.

I think there may be some assumptions being drawn on this thread. Without knowing who said what to whom, where, and when, nobody knows what happened except Barry, Jay, and Allen.

Everything we share on this thread, other than those three, is nothing more than railbird chatter, myself included. :grin-square:

I enjoy the chirping, it's the disrespect from the Alfred Hitchcock birds that get under my skin

 

[watchez]

How did it tarnish the event? Archer got crushed 11-1, should he have stayed home?

Because it is this negativity people are talking about. Has nothing to do with the tournament results. He shouldn't have been put into the tournament or requested he be put in. If you don't see that, then there is no reason to have you comment. You can nuthug on Allen all you want but him playing was dead wrong. So much so that Jay walked out. Get it?

And we don't need to ask Allen what happened -- we have heard from Jay and heard that Allen was made aware that his move of being placed into the tournament due to some back agreement of giving Barry some stupid plaque is what caused it. Jay has shown here he knows right from wrong.

 

[alstl]

Could somebody give me the short attention span version of what happened because I'll be damned if I can figure it out.

 

[JB Cases]

Allen did do wrong -- if he was ok with not playing then simply don't play. Did Barry put a gun to his head and make him play? He chose to play, forcing Jay to make a decision of ethics and tarnishing the event. I wonder what goes on behind the scenes at the Expo each year.

I have to agree with this. Except Allen might have been told by Barry that it was all good. He could have been waiting around to see if he would get in or not and when he got the call he just played.

BUT

I also think that ANY first round forfeits should be filled with players on a waiting list. So Jeremy Jones' spot that WAS listed should have been filled by Allen Hopkins in this instance.

I think every player should agree that first round forfeits are subject to player replacement.

 

[SUPERSTAR]

So Jeremy Jones' spot that WAS listed should have been filled by Allen Hopkins in this instance.

I think every player should agree that first round forfeits are subject to player replacement.

This would have messed up the 14.1 tournament.

 

[ElCorazonFrio]

Could somebody give me the short attention span version of what happened because I'll be damned if I can figure it out.

Allan was or wasn't promised a spot in the tourney by BB. Allan showed up and BB wanted to put him in when the bracket was already filled.

Jay refused.

Jay went to bed and the next day heard Allan announced to play Warren on the TV table. BB had gotten another player to drop out of the tourney.

Jay went home.

 

[JLange]

The Only person in the right here is Jay, Kudo's to you sir for doing the right thing.
The draw was made and set. Can you imagine you paid or better yet qualified through a qualifier for entry into the US OPEN.
Then before your match Barry comes up to you and asks you to give your spot up because I want (____) to play. You say no so cash or who knows entry into next years US OPEN is negotiated.

It's all wrong. I feel sorry for the guy who lost his spot, even if he had ZERO chance to win.

Allen is wrong in this case and I lost a bit of respect for him. He had every opportunity before the 128 field was confirmed to make sure he was in the event. The right thing was to just say NO.

Jam you can stick up for Allen all you want but he is wrong in this situation.
Barry is a complete idiot and No disrespect to the US OPEN but this puts a big Black mark on it once again.

The only person with enough balls to do the right thing here was Jay. Your a good man and you gained my respect.:thumbup:

 

[alstl]

Allan was or wasn't promised a spot in the tourney by BB. Allan showed up and BB wanted to put him in when the bracket was already filled.

Jay refused.

Jay went to bed and the next day heard Allan announced to play Warren on the TV table. BB had gotten another player to drop out of the tourney.

Jay went home.

Is there a history between Helfert and Hopkins?

 

[JoeyA]

Just finished reading the whole thread.

It seems that there is plenty room to spread the blame around, but imo none of it belongs on Jay Helfert's shoulders.

I actually appreciate Fran's comments that Jay's staying would have benefited the players because that's true. However, Jay made his decision to leave based upon his belief that he would be complicit in the tournament chart altering that took place, if he stayed and I agree that he would have been and the fact that altering the tournament chart was the wrong thing to do.


The problem started with Barry. It's not Jay's fault and Allen came to the event believing that he had a spot, because Barry told him so. Faulting Allen is pinning the tail on the wrong donkey.

Could things have been done differently? Sure. Is Barry Beelzebub? Hardly. He has made and continues to make mistakes in judgment and by Jay leaving the event, this may in fact help Barry to make better judgment calls in the future. Pat Fleming being added to the U.S. Open crew was a GREAT MOVE on Barry's part. Kudos to Pat for stepping up to handle the money. Barry's moving in the right direction but he needs to allow men of principle to help him manage the U.S. Open 9 Ball Championship without interference from him and stop using his BOSS CARD, when delegation of duties has already been established.


JoeyA

 

[poolguy4u]

I'm glad Allen got in and I'm glad Barry let him in.


Best tournament for 40 years running in the USA.



Wow...pool players cry a lot!:sad:






.

 

[couldnthinkof01]

The Only person in the right here is Jay, Kudo's to you sir for doing the right thing.
The draw was made and set. Can you imagine you paid or better yet qualified through a qualifier for entry into the US OPEN.
Then before your match Barry comes up to you and asks you to give your spot up because I want (____) to play. You say no so cash or who knows entry into next years US OPEN is negotiated.

It's all wrong. I feel sorry for the guy who lost his spot, even if he had ZERO chance to win.

Allen is wrong in this case and I lost a bit of respect for him. He had every opportunity before the 128 field was confirmed to make sure he was in the event. The right thing was to just say NO.

Jam you can stick up for Allen all you want but he is wrong in this situation.
Barry is a complete idiot and No disrespect to the US OPEN but this puts a big Black mark on it once again.

The only person with enough balls to do the right thing here was Jay. Your a good man and you gained my respect.:thumbup:

Well said. Buddy Hall is a hall of famer too does the challenge of champions debockle go away because some b.s. hall of fame committee put him in, no! Pro pool gets no respect from the people with the $ for good reason.

 

[markgw]

Because it is this negativity people are talking about. Has nothing to do with the tournament results. He shouldn't have been put into the tournament or requested he be put in. If you don't see that, then there is no reason to have you comment. You can nuthug on Allen all you want but him playing was dead wrong. So much so that Jay walked out. Get it?

And we don't need to ask Allen what happened -- we have heard from Jay and heard that Allen was made aware that his move of being placed into the tournament due to some back agreement of giving Barry some stupid plaque is what caused it. Jay has shown here he knows right from wrong.

I had no idea this was a huge political issue involving Jay! Had I known that I would have kept my mouth shut!! Jay is a straight shooter and my buddy and I stand by him 99% of the time! I came into this thread thinking it was Allen Hopkins hater hour but I see now I was wrong and I'm sorry...

 

[HawaiianEye]

I've read through this whole thread and, unless I missed something, have yet to hear about the guy who lost his spot...other than his name.

What did he think about getting the boot? Or, bribe to get out?

As long as no matches were played, I think the sole decision rests with him.

If he "willingly" gave up his spot, so be it and nobody is hurt.

If he got "thrown out and replaced", then that is another subject.

Aloha.

 

[BmoreMoney]

I've read through this whole thread and, unless I missed something, have yet to hear about the guy who lost his spot...other than his name.

What did he think about getting the boot? Or, bribe to get out?

As long as no matches were played, I think the sole decision rests with him.

If he "willingly" gave up his spot, so be it and nobody is hurt.

If he got "thrown out and replaced", then that is another subject.

Aloha.

I've said / asked the same thing but no responses.

 

[Neil]

I have to agree with this. Except Allen might have been told by Barry that it was all good. He could have been waiting around to see if he would get in or not and when he got the call he just played.

BUT

I also think that ANY first round forfeits should be filled with players on a waiting list. So Jeremy Jones' spot that WAS listed should have been filled by Allen Hopkins in this instance.

I think every player should agree that first round forfeits are subject to player replacement.

I disagree strongly with that, John. Look at the Vietnamese player that forfeited his first match. He flies in from VietNam to play in it. Gets sick right away. Hopefully will feel better enough the next day to play. Should he be forfeited out of a dbl. elim. tryny because he had to miss his first match? NO!

What should be done, is a role call at the players meeting. If you aren't there for that, or haven't called in for it due to other commitments, then you don't go on the roster of players, and the first on the waiting list gets in.

 

[FranCrimi]

Allan was aware. Jay spoke to him directly. Allan should've refused once the charts were drawn up. Period.

And Fran's suggestion that a player agree to an additional match is preposterous. This is supposed to be the most prestigious, US tournament in existence. And a move like this most certainly would put WPA support in jeopardy for the future. And, at a $1000 entry, how is an extra match remotely fair?

So then leave it up to the players. Call a meeting ask for an anonymous vote. Each player gets a piece of paper and can write one of three things:

1.) Redraw: Add the extra player, redraw and use a 256 player chart.

2.) Extra match: Leave the draw alone and have the player draw into an extra match (which is the same as a 256 player chart without the redraw)

3.) No change. Alan is out and everything stays the same.

There were options. Jay opted to leave.

 

[JAM]

Somebody on site at the Open used their cell phone to get this reply. Now we all know what really happened. This should silence the naysayers for good. ---> HERE

 

[BmoreMoney]

so then leave it up to the players. Call a meeting ask for an anonymous vote. Each player gets a piece of paper and can write one of three things:

1.) redraw: Add the extra player, redraw and use a 256 player chart.

2.) extra match: Leave the draw alone and have the player draw into an extra match (which is the same as a 256 player chart without the redraw)

3.) no change. Alan is out and everything stays the same.

There were options. Jay opted to leave.

how is there an extra player??? What am i missing???

 

[BRussell]

I appreciate FranCrimi's different opinion on this. It's good to have a different perspective. Maybe they could have worked something out, like letting Allen wait to see if someone dropped out.

But I wonder at what point you stop compromising and working with a promoter who does things like change brackets. What if he changes the brackets to give a friend - or someone he's bet on - an easy couple of matches? If you quit you would be getting on your high horse and abandoning the players, after all. What if he's stealing money and refuses to stop when you catch him?