Predator "black shafts?"

ONTOPIC:
I still haven't found anything more than a few photos with Darren. Could somebody paste links?


OFFTOPIC

SamLambert said:
Don't worry I know about this :)

I'm just kinda excited for this new shaft tech. I think it's strange that wood is still the norm for cues. You would think that will all the tech out there it would have been replaced long ago.
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Well - wood does a lot of things right.

Also everybody thought we would be living in 100 stories high concrete bunkers by now.
Actually, a lot of people are building pure wood houses now, with new "high tech" supplementing the wood or construction techniques.
And they are so much better than concrete for you.

Kinda the same for cues - new high tech is used in manufacturing but the materials stay (or are treated by high tech).

Looking forward to "toasted maple" as they do in guitar necks ;)
 
Pleinairrider said:
Third generation Predator shafts are out but there's a new line coming out in March. Darren Appleton posted a video where he's using the new gear - all black shaft, dent resistant maybe proof.

Whose got the scoop?
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What's up bud? Hope all is good with you.

I was with Darren at the Steinway classic last November and he had it with him. He cracked me up because when I told him I didn't believe it was dent resistant he started banging it over the counter and I mean he wasn't holding back. Not one dent after that. I didn't hit with it , but it felt smooth and natural. It doesn't look bad either. I'm laughing my ass off now just thinking how he was smashing that thing.

One thing is for sure. It is dent resistant. At least for what pool players will use it for.

Take care pal.

Ron
 
M.G. said:
ONTOPIC:
I still haven't found anything more than a few photos with Darren. Could somebody paste links?
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A few weeks ago he was posting a lot of trickshot videos with Florian Kohler & others. In most of them he was using the black shaft in question.

Just gotta look at the recent videos on his profile.
 
RonMason said:
What's up bud? Hope all is good with you.

I was with Darren at the Steinway classic last November and he had it with him. He cracked me up because when I told him I didn't believe it was dent resistant he started banging it over the counter and I mean he wasn't holding back. Not one dent after that. I didn't hit with it , but it felt smooth and natural. It didn't look back either. I'm laughing my ass off now just thinking how he was smashing that thing.

One thing is for sure. It is dent resistant. At least for what pool players will use it for.

Take care pal.

Ron
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That really is quite funny! Gave me a good laugh :D
 
SamLambert said:
I got a few questions!

1. Roughly estimated price tag?
2. Can you buy the shaft separately or it comes with a butt?
3. Release date?
4. Available in Canada upon release?
5. Tip size?
6. Taper?
7. How's the deflection?

Thanks in advance!
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Ira Lee with the Molinari booth at Turning Stone this past January had the latest prototype predator carbon fiber/graphite shaft and it was nice to examine it up close and ask some questions.

I asked a lot of what you just did, and I can paraphrase from memory, but maybe Ira can come on here and post more complete answers.

The shaft itself can be weighted to what the player wants. Weights can be placed in the back or more forward to adjust the balance and feel.

It's still in the testing phase but they are getting closer to a final version. Price tag would be around $600-$700 (I asked why so high, because they will last forever and never change our wear out, dent, etc)

No release date as of yet.

The basic idea is that they can be made any diameter, shaft taper style, tip size, whatever the player decides. Totally customized to the player.
 
A weight adjustable shaft -- I really like this !!!

My biggest problem with most LD shafts is that they are too light and buzzy.

McDermott has used carbon fiber and or graphite in their shafts for some time, and Mezz has taken it to new heights with their Ex pro shaft, but this new Predator shaft sounds to be void of maple all together.

However at 700 dollars a shaft I don't know .. I mean wow .. that would be a very expensive shaft!
 
SamLambert said:
I think it's strange that wood is still the norm for cues. You would think that will all the tech out there it would have been replaced long ago.
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While I share your enthusiasm for seeing and learning about new pool-related products, many of these "new" ideas have been tried before and they didn't go well. Either poor construction, no compatibility with other cues, plain old terrible hit, looks too different than the norm, etc... There's nothing new under the sun. These ideas have not come to fruition in the past.

M.G. said:
Well - wood does a lot of things right.

Looking forward to "toasted maple" as they do in guitar necks ;)
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MG, you said it best. Wood does a lot of things right.

I think toasted maple has been tried as well (imo it's a bit ugly). From the CM's I've heard from, it takes a lot of the properties that you want in a shaft, out of a shaft. Cue shafts are subject to different forces than guitar necks (which are constantly being bent).



While I commend those who try new things (and trust me, I've seen weird things in the cue world) I believe that there are certain methods that have stuck around, and some methods that have died for good reason. Who knows, maybe Predator can pull it off. Make it super exclusive, or market it with the pros, all that jazz. I don't believe the zero deflection hype, but if it works for those who use it, good for them.
 
the future is here.

I had a chance to recently hit with the shaft at a pro tournament. The information i received was unofficial from the pro but here are my impressions of the shaft.

The entire length of the shaft is not coated. The version i had my hands on was the newer version. I believe it is heavier than the previous version..weighing in almost 4 oz. *which i believe to be a great thing because ld shafts tend to be forward light..due to it's properties.

The tip did not have any ferrule and although it may seem anti intuitive it makes sense. There was some carbon fiber pad at the tip but still no ferrule.

I spent about 5 min look closely as the pattern and color of the shaft. It looked very very uniform but did have a few marks on the shaft maybe from manufacturing but it was absolutely silky smooth in every way possible. There was no dings, nicks or any surface scratches at all. It was so smooth i could feel the need to no longer use a shooting glove.

My hands were slightly sweaty from being so excited to hold this thing that i had to wipe my hands a few times. Each time i wiped them on my shirt then touched the shaft it was completely smooth. No sticky feeling at all.

the shaft hit with extremely low deflection. I felt solid but not the typical feedback that i get from wood shafts. Even ld wood shafts felt different than this. As people began to stand around me while i examined the shaft. I saw someone test hit with a shot that revealed how extremely low deflection the quality had on this gem. And end results were unreal.

At first i thought it would be weird to see a high end playing shaft that wasn't made of wood. But the more i think about it: no dings, no warping, almost little to no maintenance. It's hard to knock the benefit of this new product.

Folks believe it or not..maples shafts play great but finding consistency and good old wood is difficult. Like it or not the predator revo is the future.

For non disclosure..i cannot name the pro whom graciously let me test the shaft and will not have contact info on how to obtain. one..but if anyone does know...feel free to pm so they can shut up and take my money.
 

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Tony Robles was showing it on Facebook last week. He said the company was taking good all the critiques from him and Darren and other pros the whole way and kept making it better. He said it almost like cheating, there not much deflection if any at all.

Problemy is no one has price yet, but I've heard from some outside sources it's going to be in the 500-600 range just for the shaft. If that is the truth I'll be waiting a long time on a price drop to pick one up to try out.
 
I'm sceptical.
No or nearly no deflection? Hmm....
Will never wear or dent? Even more hmm...
700 dollars? Hmm....

Seems to me they have finally found a way to charge more for a product that will ultimately be cheaper to make. Everybody wins except the people shelling out the dough.

Have you ever seen a fiberglass cue after a year of use in the pool hall? Bending? Check. Peeled off finish? Check. Ugly appearance? Check. Repairs possible? NO!

Carbon fiber is not in itself very good at taking sharp blows from a direction other than the one that they were designed for. With a fishing rod you can hit a rock or whatever with your fishing rod and it will seem fine. Then all of a sudden, during a cast or reeling in a fish, the rod will break at the exact spot where the impact occurred. So, to add to the longevity and impact resistance they add fiberglass or some other substance. Obviously, a surface consisting of fibers running lengthwise or weaved will need some sort of coating to remain slick to the touch. What happens with coatings such as these over time? They wear off, exposing the sharp, unpleasant-to-the-touch fibers underneath. Will that coating be available to cue repairmen, I wonder?
 
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Thank you for the pics and info :smile:

Im looking forward to seeing how they match up to maple, should be interesting :rolleyes:
 
Anyone with an inside sauce know the approximate release date? One poster mentioned March so I'm hopeful for a Q1 release window.

All hyperbole aside, this shaft could potentially be a game changer along the lines of the leather tip.
 
Break and One said:
I know this is an old thread but was wondering if their was any update about this shaft. I was unable to find anything.
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Kinda funny you brought this up. I was just contacted by Predator the other day. They said after reading my thread " Super cool shafts, Super unique shafts" right here on AZB, they decided there was in fact a market for their black shafts. They also informed me the official name of said shafts is now " BMOREBLACK SERIES" How cool is that yall !!!

Sam, in all seriousness these shafts are very reminiscent of the new shafts by Cuetec back in the 90's that were " gonna revolutionize what we thought a pool cue is from now on and into the future". They were composite in nature, I think fibergalss actually. Remember the black or white ones? While there may be some small advantages, at the end of the day I still thinks its all hype. A marketing ploy designed to help you by shedding weight - the weight of your and mine wallets that is.

Companies constantly are trying to improve products and come out with new ones. Think about it, as a business they have to. Look, we can buy a shaft, take good care of it and pretty much we could have / use it for the rest of our lives. That's not a great business model. They NEED to continuously come out with new products to generate new sales. I think this shaft fits nicely into that description.
 
BmoreMoney said:
Kinda funny you brought this up. I was just contacted by Predator the other day. They said after reading my thread " Super cool shafts, Super unique shafts" right here on AZB, they decided there was in fact a market for their black shafts. They also informed me the official name of said shafts is now " BMOREBLACK SERIES" How cool is that yall !!!

Sam, in all seriousness these shafts are very reminiscent of the new shafts by Cuetec back in the 90's that were " gonna revolutionize what we thought a pool cue is from now on and into the future". They were composite in nature, I think fibergalss actually. Remember the black or white ones? While there may be some small advantages, at the end of the day I still thinks its all hype. A marketing ploy designed to help you by shedding weight - the weight of your and mine wallets that is.

Companies constantly are trying to improve products and come out with new ones. Think about it, as a business they have to. Look, we can buy a shaft, take good care of it and pretty much we could have / use it for the rest of our lives. That's not a great business model. They NEED to continuously come out with new products to generate new sales. I think this shaft fits nicely into that description.
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I agree. Some "advancements"/changes are made JUST for the sake of marketing and moving new product. However, every once in a while a change is truly revolutionary and will forever change it's market.

With that said, this shaft could be the next Sardo Tightrack.
 
riskytrousers said:
I agree. Some "advancements"/changes are made JUST for the sake of marketing and moving new product. However, every once in a while a change is truly revolutionary and will forever change it's market.

With that said, this shaft could be the next Sardo Tightrack.
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I strongly believe this will be the case with this shaft.
 
this without a doubt 100% will not and is jokingly a laughable product compared to wood....and no i have not used or tried one...

yes we can play pool with even a cuetek ad win championships.....thats not the point

but ill tell you a fact......man doesn't have the tech to build a synthetic that can compete with wood for a cue and be like wood on all afronts....


tell you what you all give me your cues out there....i'll keep them safe while yall go listen to the bullshit and drink the bad punch....

they will be safe with me untill your return from fantasy land full of marketing BS.

Matter of fact, some of you guys and girls always looking to "buy" a better game....contact a custom maker and get a LD shat made of real wood with no laminations or holllows....then comment on LD how it can feel and such...because all the *****es about LD shafts only come from the ones that are production made, all ofwhich are either laminated, or laminated with use of light ferrule thats weak (not OB though) and or holes/hollows

oh they feel dead...they buzzz bla bla bla......REALLY? BIG SURPRISE THERE!

go live in a trailer if you want to but dont run your mouth talkin about how its built as well as a home made by some actual craftsmen.....you just didn't want to pay for a "name' lol.......when in pool terms your spending the same quanitity of money mostly.....

sardo tight rack....still makes me want to vomit....i was never a supporter, couldn't pay me enough to lie and bulllshit for a trash product

-greyghost
 
Pleinairrider said:
Third generation Predator shafts are out but there's a new line coming out in March. Darren Appleton posted a video where he's using the new gear - all black shaft, dent resistant maybe proof.

Whose got the scoop?
Click to expand...

Hi Guys,

I have spoken with Predator directly today so that you receive accurate information regarding the new black shaft.
The Predator black shaft prototype was produced and released to a select few pro players for testing and feedback.
The material used on the black shaft is composite carbon fibre.
Predator is not releasing any further details on the construction on the shaft at this time.
A retail release date has also not been announced.
 
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