Can pro players be better than they are now?
- Thread starter JB Cases
- Start date
Bravo! Amazing how naive some are...
Wow, age is coming out here...
If you think the old timers were better on that slow carpet and huge buckets, or they could even come close to the top players today, you've lost your mind! Ok Ok enough wolfin.. LOL
I reality, being great takes very hard work, but that is only subject to the parameters. Today's parameters are vastly more difficult than that of 20+ years ago, however, that does not mean that ancient greats could't be great today. This being said, I believe the top players today, would still be the top players, before you respond, consider who are "still" the top players today.
If you think the old timers were better on that slow carpet and huge buckets, or they could even come close to the top players today, you've lost your mind! Ok Ok enough wolfin.. LOL
I reality, being great takes very hard work, but that is only subject to the parameters. Today's parameters are vastly more difficult than that of 20+ years ago, however, that does not mean that ancient greats could't be great today. This being said, I believe the top players today, would still be the top players, before you respond, consider who are "still" the top players today.
If pool tournaments had the money that golf has, of course tons more people would pick up pool, and the competition would increase and the play would get better.
Pool is not like basketball, where the players improve over time by getting "bigger, stronger and faster", but they would get better like robots in pool, hitting perfect position every time.....
They would probably have to change the rules in pool to account for all the runs outs, like the NBA did by moving the 3 point line back (in fact they need to move it back again, too easy for them)
Pool is not like basketball, where the players improve over time by getting "bigger, stronger and faster", but they would get better like robots in pool, hitting perfect position every time.....
They would probably have to change the rules in pool to account for all the runs outs, like the NBA did by moving the 3 point line back (in fact they need to move it back again, too easy for them)
Never understood this either. I mean pool is far more accessible on a number of fronts than golf, I.E. cost to play, cost of equipment, access for places to play, yet it's not as popular.
People say pool is boring to watch & there is very rarely something you can see pool wise on TV anywhere anymore. Watching golf is beyond boring yet it gets major network coverage due to its popularity & draws ratings, I don't get it. I golf regularly and love the game but you couldn't pay me to watch it.
I'm going to make an assumption here. I know that's dangerous, but in this case it's a harmless one. (If your response, was a response to my comment about the level of play then vs now.)
First, I ain't some old curmudgeon, dude. lol People have this weird tendency to think that my association with history makes me this 90 yr old blind man who is stuck in the past. So the "age showing" comment is rather silly. If anything, the older generation has a much better understanding of the past than you, and you should respect that, even if you don't agree with it.
Second, people also have this weird tendency to think that billiards/pool in the past was a walk in the park with all that " shag carpet and giant pockets".
Do you have any idea what the pro tournament table specs were 100 yrs ago?
150?
175?
Get Shane Van Boening playing 14" Balkline on a 10ft table, or American 4ball on a 6 pocket 12ft table, either game with ivory balls, and he'd be lost like a child in the park.
Third - what parameters have changed drastically in the last 20 years?
Minor changes in cloth that are not uniform across the nation?
Low deflection products not used by everyone?
More expensive chalk?
Diamond tables with better rails, not used uniformly across the country?
Here's the explanation. You have a very small percentage of the population playing pool. People with excellent hand eye coordination are not drawn to pool, and most kids today don't want to pick up the game, If there was serious money in pool, and it was a respected sport like any that have been named, I have absolutely NO DOUBT that you'd have better players today than there have ever been. But pool has no broad appeal. It appeals to the kids that skipped school to hang out and smoke at the pool hall. Or people that go to the bar and play pool because there's a table.
There is some kid out there taking batting practice with a broomstick and golf balls right now on some field that has the talent and physical attributes to run 1000 at 14.1. But he'll never enter a pool hall and harness that ability. Because he's chasing a much bigger and more lucrative dream.
And I'd rather watch golf than a weekend long pool tournament any day of the week. I could listen to golf commentary for an afternoon. Listening to pool commentary for anything longer than 15 minutes is like sitting on a beehive. There's about 20M people that share my attitude. The PGA isn't asking an amateur golf league to fund their operation
I have to agree with this if pool is on TV or my computer. If I am there in person, however, I could sit for hours and hours and watch pool. Not so sure I'd feel the same way about golf: ALL THAT WALKING!
I have to agree with this if pool is on TV or my computer. If I am there in person, however, I could sit for hours and hours and watch pool. Not so sure I'd feel the same way about golf: ALL THAT WALKING!
You usually find a good location on the course where you can see a couple of greens, and a few tee offs. Park and watch. And I agree about live events. I like being in a pool hall with other players watching an event. There's a feeling in the air. But I think that exists in any live event.
I think it's a no-brainer that if there was more money in professional pool, there were would be more people playing, at a higher level.
I don't think recreational pool would see as much of an increase as would the more serious players. Think about how many players we hear about that simply don't play in tournaments any more, because they had to get a "real job". In order to play at the highest level, folks will undoubtedly have to focus on it full time, not around the job necessary to make a living.
That doesn't even take into account the local hotshots that perhaps could be even better were they too focusing on the game more. More and more would aspire to work on their games if there were a better chance to actually make some money at it. Instead, they play when they can, gamble locally and what-not, maybe some local and/or regional tournaments. Not a recipe for major development.
And with more people participating at the higher levels, everyone would have to focus on their own development more and more, over time.
At least that's my guess....
I don't think recreational pool would see as much of an increase as would the more serious players. Think about how many players we hear about that simply don't play in tournaments any more, because they had to get a "real job". In order to play at the highest level, folks will undoubtedly have to focus on it full time, not around the job necessary to make a living.
That doesn't even take into account the local hotshots that perhaps could be even better were they too focusing on the game more. More and more would aspire to work on their games if there were a better chance to actually make some money at it. Instead, they play when they can, gamble locally and what-not, maybe some local and/or regional tournaments. Not a recipe for major development.
And with more people participating at the higher levels, everyone would have to focus on their own development more and more, over time.
At least that's my guess....
I think so....I have yet to meet anyone that didn't learn something new each day. Just Imagine what that might be, if they put their mind to it.
IF there were REAL Money on the line & Real Players to compete against, you would see the Players practicing on a daily basis & reading up on Banking.
What we have today is PLAY..... not work....
IF there were REAL Money on the line & Real Players to compete against, you would see the Players practicing on a daily basis & reading up on Banking.
What we have today is PLAY..... not work....
Exactly
Exactly how I feel , I will watch Pool over Golf on a TV any day of the week. I will say this the average person would rather they be mistaken for a well dressed golfer then a Pool player wearing a T and a ball cap on backwards. I think we all wish we knew the answer to bring Pool up several notches.
Exactly how I feel , I will watch Pool over Golf on a TV any day of the week. I will say this the average person would rather they be mistaken for a well dressed golfer then a Pool player wearing a T and a ball cap on backwards. I think we all wish we knew the answer to bring Pool up several notches.
I do think that pool has a reputation of gambling, drinking, hustling, fighting and a lot of other bad traits we find still in some places. I also think that more money in the sport would help to promote it. I do not believe that quality pool instruction and coaching is available to everyone. the I am talking about one on one instruction and coaching, I think that it is pretty safe to say you can pick up a phone book in most places in this country and find several instructors and coaches for Golf, basketball, football or most other sports out there. If you are lucky enough to find a coach or instructor nearby the cost of their services may be very expensive. If you are out there making say ten dollars an hour at your job and want lessons you would likely be looking at the better part of your take home pay for a week just to pay for a couple hours of training. I don't think the average person just starting out to learn pool would be interested in paying say $300 for two hours to learn proper fundamentals. I live in a place that calls itself a City and yet there is not even one pool hall in the city limits. There is one bowling alley that has some tables but that is not the same. Pool needs to have a standardized set of rules and equipment that is accepted by all. There needs to be more access to pool tables that are maintained well in public places. I think that it would be a good idea to offer basic instruction as part of high school electives as well as promoting of more school based team competitions. I think that it needs to be marketed to the businesses and more sponsorships and backing need to be created. If pool was more organized and we still had tournaments at geographical levels from the town, city, county, state level prior to the national level then the international level it would be much more like the big money sports.
let the chopping begin
let the chopping begin
I think the depth of great players would increase quite a bit, but I don't think the quality of play of the champions would. It's not like there would suddenly be a bunch of guys who could give weight to Shane at 10-ball.
I KNOW RIGHT! 20 years....1996? Earl won a million that year....
if we went back to say 90......hummmm thats getting into earl and effren PRIME mode....
he coulda at least gave it a shot and said something about 50+ years ago.....
then we could have just have done as dean did and said whens the last time anyones ever banked 37 balls?
Whens the last time anyone ran 28 racks of 9 ball on a bar box?
Whens the last time someone ran 300+ balls on a 10ft?
The wolves of yesteryear in my opinion would eat the players today alive....very few wouldn't get eaten.....be death and blood and tears everywhere. Guaranteed players today are softer today....just because of today.
players of the past scored thousands of points without a miss...in the not that distant past players in 14.1 have ran 526 and there have been mulitple rumored runs well in excess of that 526, even 600 and over 700 balls....i doubt anyone has that quantity of concentration anymore except maybe say, gary kasparov.
no but if pool had a farm league like tee ball on up there'd be plenty of shanes.....and i'm sure a tiger would show up and beat shane and everyone elses head in lol.
we had true prodigy's before keith mcCready...but i don't think we have had any true ones since. I'd maybe consider cole dixon but i dont know his story that well to know exactly how young he started busting horns with the big boys i know keith was disgustingly young lol
mosconi, harold worst, greenleaf, mcCready, schaffer jr. (anyone else?)
I don't think they can get any better unless an improvement in equipment allows it. The evolution of pool play happens at an individual level. Not as a group.
I too believe the gambling aspect has pretty much denied pool it's acceptance to general audiences. It's one thing to gamble on a sporting event, but quite another when the player does it. Ask Pete Rose.
I also believe that Snooker has more drawing power than other pocket billiard games, but not here in the States.
The problem with pool is not the gambling per se. It is that the gambling created a culture where hustling, which is in its essence DISHONEST gambling, i.e., stealing, became the standard.
Mosconi gambled.
Fats lied and stole. At least on those (rare according to Danny McGoorty) occasions when he was actually playing and winning rather than flapping his gums about playing and winning.
And world of pool reveres Mosconi's skill but follows the lead of Fats' culture.
It is sad that such a beautiful game has been so ill-served by its own culture.
no but if pool had a farm league like tee ball on up there'd be plenty of shanes.....and i'm sure a tiger would show up and beat shane and everyone elses head in lol.
we had true prodigy's before keith mcCready...but i don't think we have had any true ones since. I'd maybe consider cole dixon but i dont know his story that well to know exactly how young he started busting horns with the big boys i know keith was disgustingly young lol
mosconi, harold worst, greenleaf, mcCready, schaffer jr. (anyone else?)
Hoppe won his first world championship as a teenager I believe, so he belongs in that group, if you are including carom players. Won his first WC at age 19 and his last one at age 65. Over three disciplines.