Putting Mosconi Cup "pressure" into perspective

N

NYC cue dude

Banned
Did anyone pick up on Albin's remarks after his singles match victory?

"I won the 9 ball world championship this year. The pressure was a JOKE compared to this"

Got have respect and understanding for anyone willing to step up and then not perform to their abilities. These guys are taking it to heart.
 
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I've seen great play down through the years in the MC, and right now what we are seeing is very average play by our best players. It's easy to say the pressure got to them, but why? Why now and why to this team? Other teams and other players have stood up well under the same pressure and most of these guys have been here before, some of them many times.

I say something is wrong in their preparation that needs to be fixed. Somehow the lead up to this event is not working and I have a good idea why. Hitting a lot of balls in a practice room is not necessarily going to have you ready for the atmosphere and import of the MC. The problem lies between their ears and not in their arms. Enough said, thanks.

If you remember, when we were winning the MC on a regular basis, most of our top players were traveling to play in all the major events. Granted most of them were here in the USA back then, but players like Rempe, Varner, Archer and Strickland never shied away from traveling overseas to take on the best players from every continent. The only American player I see doing for the last few years has been Shane.
 
jay helfert said:
I've seen great play down through the years in the MC, and right now what we are seeing is very average play by our best players. It's easy to say the pressure got to them, but why? Why now and why to this team? Other teams and other players have stood up well under the same pressure and most of these guys have been here before, some of them many times.

I say something is wrong in their preparation that needs to be fixed. Somehow the lead up to this event is not working and I have a good idea why. Hitting a lot of balls in a practice room is not necessarily going to have you ready for the atmosphere and import of the MC. The problem lies between their ears and not in their arms. Enough said, thanks.

If you remember, when we were winning the MC on a regular basis, most of our top players were traveling to play in all the major events. Granted most of them were here in the USA back then, but players like Rempe, Varner, Archer and Strickland never shied away from traveling overseas to take on the best players from every continent. The only American player I see doing for the last few years has been Shane.
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Hi Jay- hope you are well!!

Anyway- can't discount the exponential accumulation of pressure, as it's now going to be a 7 year losing streak. They go in each year carrying a bit more baggage than the last.

Also, we just aren't as talented. None of our players can win anything on the world stage. Shane is the exception, and yet he's always played sub par pool at the MC. Also- when we started out, we had a distinctive advantage over the lesser experienced European players. Just like the Chinese and Taiwanese were, and have all surpassed us.
 
NYC cue dude said:
Hi Jay- hope you are well!!

Anyway- can't discount the exponential accumulation of pressure, as it's now going to be a 7 year losing streak. They go in each year carrying a bit more baggage than the last.

Also, we just aren't as talented. None of our players can win anything on the world stage. Shane is the exception, and yet he's always played sub par pool at the MC. Also- when we started out, we had a distinctive advantage over the lesser experienced European players. Just like the Chinese and Taiwanese were, and have all surpassed us.
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You've got it right on all counts. Stay warm my friend! :)
 
jay helfert said:
I've seen great play down through the years in the MC, and right now what we are seeing is very average play by our best players. It's easy to say the pressure got to them, but why? Why now and why to this team? Other teams and other players have stood up well under the same pressure and most of these guys have been here before, some of them many times.

I say something is wrong in their preparation that needs to be fixed. Somehow the lead up to this event is not working and I have a good idea why. Hitting a lot of balls in a practice room is not necessarily going to have you ready for the atmosphere and import of the MC. The problem lies between their ears and not in their arms. Enough said, thanks.

If you remember, when we were winning the MC on a regular basis, most of our top players were traveling to play in all the major events. Granted most of them were here in the USA back then, but players like Rempe, Varner, Archer and Strickland never shied away from traveling overseas to take on the best players from every continent. The only American player I see doing for the last few years has been Shane.
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BS, and if you want MW's job just come out and say so.

It is our system of play. We have no real organized tour and events to compare to the Euros. We have scattered events on all kinds and size of equipment. And you can call it an excuse -- but we don't play on Rasson tables here. Call me stupid but I never knew how important the table was was -- in terms of how the pockets and rubber react -- until I got the chance to play on Diamonds on a regular basis.

We are light years behind the Euros in terms of prep and that is not to fault MW.

Lou Figueroa
 
lfigueroa said:
BS, and if you want MW's job just come out and say so.

It is our system of play. We have no real organized tour and events to compare to the Euros. We have scattered events on all kinds and size of equipment. And you can call it an excuse -- but we don't play on Rasson tables here. Call me stupid but I never knew how important the table was was -- in terms of how the pockets and rubber react -- until I got the chance to play on Diamonds on a regular basis.

We are light years behind the Euros in terms of prep and that is not to fault MW.

Lou Figueroa
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I would like to be Captain one day. Can I count on your vote? :smile:
 
lfigueroa said:
BS, and if you want MW's job just come out and say so.

It is our system of play. We have no real organized tour and events to compare to the Euros. We have scattered events on all kinds and size of equipment. And you can call it an excuse -- but we don't play on Rasson tables here. Call me stupid but I never knew how important the table was was -- in terms of how the pockets and rubber react -- until I got the chance to play on Diamonds on a regular basis.

We are light years behind the Euros in terms of prep and that is not to fault MW.

Lou Figueroa
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Rasson is relatively new. They were used during bonus ball. And the 14.1 World used it this year for the first time. For most players, it was their first experience with them. They aren't widespread, including in Europe. So, they don't have a table advantage.

And Darren and Jayson aren't part of the European tour anymore, either. They share a mostly "American" schedule.
 
If the USA loses tomorrow all they have to do is look back to day 1. They got beaten badly and have not recovered. It is obvious in their body language and just as obvious on the European side. They are playing with confidence and the USA is trying not to suck. Very poor choice of words by Mark Wilson, IMO. Blaming Shane is wrong, they lost that first day as a team.
 
NYC cue dude said:
I won the 9 ball world championship last year. The pressure was a JOKE compared to this.
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Albin's memory is failing him. He won the World Championship this year, so we can discount the rest of the statement.

When one's competitive resume is reviewed for BCA HOF consideration, nobody much cares about whether a Mosconi win is on your resume, but whether you won even one WPA World Championship is a huge matter.

When you get to the finals of a World Championship, you have to wonder whether you'll ever have another chance to win the event. That's what makes the pressure excruciating. Same thing at the World Cup of Pool.

In the case of the Mosconi, the wait will be just one year for a player of Albin's caliber and how much pressure can there be when you have already won a few of them?

Albin's right, the comparison is ridiculous. Europe was a 9/4 favorite this year and well knew that it had the stronger team. They came in with six consecutive wins at the Mosconi. Why would they feel much pressure? Does this even qualify as a rivalry?
 
sjm said:
Albin's memory is failing him. He won the World Championship this year, so we can discount the rest of the statement.

When one's competitive resume is reviewed for BCA HOF consideration, nobody much cares about whether a Mosconi win is on your resume, but whether you won even one WPA World Championship is a huge matter.

When you get to the finals of a World Championship, you have to wonder whether you'll ever have another chance to win the event. That's what makes the pressure excruciating. Same thing at the World Cup of Pool.

In the case of the Mosconi, the wait will be just one year for a player of Albin's caliber and how much pressure can there be when you have already won a few of them?

Albin's right, the comparison is ridiculous. Europe was a 9/4 favorite this year and well knew that it had the stronger team. They came in with six consecutive wins at the Mosconi. Why would they feel much pressure? Does this even qualify as a rivalry?
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Sorry- that was my misquote of Albin. I'll fix the original post.
 
sjm,
This Mosconi Cup has you all turned around. If a World Champion says he feels more pressure at the Mosconi Cup than at the World Championship then it's probably true. I bet they all feel that way. Why would you or anybody else dismiss that?
 
BasementDweller said:
sjm,
This Mosconi Cup has you all turned around. If a World Champion says he feels more pressure at the Mosconi Cup than at the World Championship then it's probably true. I bet they all feel that way. Why would you or anybody else dismiss that?
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Because there is so much less at stake.
 
BJTyler said:
It worked for Trump!

In all seriousness Jay, what are the top 3 concrete changes you would make if selected to be team captain?
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1. I would personally sponsor several of our top players into all the major International events, so they can get the experience and knowledge from competing against the top players in the world. Shane has his own sponsorship and he doesn't need mine.

2. No pre MC celebrations of any kind! We can save the celebrating for after it's over. Being selected is just the start of the process. That's when the real work begins. We need to learn how to win, and we will. We will be playing a lot of scotch doubles events that I create specifically for this purpose. We will arrive well prepared! I can promise that.

3. A lot of one on one time with all our best players over the course of the year. I want to find out how best I can support them and to do that I need to know what makes them tick. That way when the time comes I will know what to say and when to say it. Marcus does a good job of that for team Europe.

There's more but that's enough for now. I'm not saying anybody else has done a poor job. I'm just saying I have a different approach. I'm VERY results oriented, always have been. Other than the actual results, everything else is just a nice story. I will only add this. Our practice sessions won't look anything like what they are used to. On some days we may do more talking than playing. And on other days it may look like the Karate Kid, going over and over the same thing until I'm sure they got it! I have no problem having them play matches where every shot must be a safety! Or only kick shots today!

Given the opportunity I would dedicate a year of my life to making winners out of these guys. That's my promise. I only want one year to exact change and I feel that I can do it. I happen to like all our top players and I really want them to win this thing, at least once in their life. I believe that when Team Europe sees how well prepared we are, that will instill some doubt in their minds. That's the only opening I want for our team, just a hint of concern on their part. They will know they are facing a different bunch than before.

I will put my ass, my reputation and my money on the line for this. I'm just sick of what I've seen here this week and I know it can be altered, given the chance.
 
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sjm said:
Because there is so much less at stake.
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I totally agree that it doesn't seem to make sense that you would feel more pressure at the MC... but isn't that really the only thing that explains the poor play that we see from Shane? The decisions are different than other tournaments, the execution is different etc.... I know the format is different, but that is probably part of the pressure also.

I remember watching Justin play last year at the MC.. and he's someone that has played some huge money matches and been on big stages and he didn't look like himself at all at times.... I think something about carrying the weight of your country on your back adds a certain amount of pressure that is hard to quantify. And, I know that all of America isn't tuning into this etc.. but the entire American pool community is paying close attention.
 
jay helfert said:
1. I would personally sponsor several of our top players into all the major International events, so they can get the experience and knowledge from competing against the top players in the world. Shane has his own sponsorship and he doesn't need mine.

2. No pre MC celebrations of any kind! We can save the celebrating for after it's over. Being selected is just the start of the process. That's when the real work begins. We need to learn how to win, and we will. We will be playing a lot of scotch doubles events that I create specifically for this purpose. We will arrive well prepared! I can promise that.

3. A lot of one on one time with all our best players over the course of the year. I want to find out how best I can support them and to do that I need to know what makes them tick. That way when the time comes I will know what to say and when to say it. Marcus does a good job of that for team Europe.

There's more but that's enough for now. I'm not saying anybody else has done a poor job. I'm just saying I have a different approach. I'm VERY results oriented, always have been. Other than the actual results, everything else is just a nice story. I will only add this. Our practice sessions won't look anything like what they are used to. On some days we may do more talking than playing. And on other days it may look like the Karate Kid, going over and over the same thing until I'm sure they got it! I have no problem having them play matches where every shot must be a safety! Or only kick shots today!

Given the opportunity I would dedicate a year of my life to making winners out of these guys. That's my promise. I only want one year to exact change and I feel that I can do it. I happen to like all our top players and I really want them to win this thing, at least once in their life. I believe that when Team Europe sees how well prepared we are, that will instill some doubt in their minds. That's the only opening I want for our team, just a hint of concern on their part. They will know they are facing a different bunch than before.

I will put my ass, my reputation and my money on the line for this. I'm just sick of what I've seen here this week and I know it can be altered, given the chance.
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They'd be fools not to take you up on this offer. Well done.
 
jay helfert said:
1. I would personally sponsor several of our top players into all the major International events, so they can get the experience and knowledge from competing against the top players in the world. Shane has his own sponsorship and he doesn't need mine.

2. No pre MC celebrations of any kind! We can save the celebrating for after it's over. Being selected is just the start of the process. That's when the real work begins. We need to learn how to win, and we will. We will be playing a lot of scotch doubles events that I create specifically for this purpose. We will arrive well prepared! I can promise that.

3. A lot of one on one time with all our best players over the course of the year. I want to find out how best I can support them and to do that I need to know what makes them tick. That way when the time comes I will know what to say and when to say it. Marcus does a good job of that for team Europe.

There's more but that's enough for now. I'm not saying anybody else has done a poor job. I'm just saying I have a different approach. I'm VERY results oriented, always have been. Other than the actual results, everything else is just a nice story. I will only add this. Our practice sessions won't look anything like what they are used to. On some days we may do more talking than playing. And on other days it may look like the Karate Kid, going over and over the same thing until I'm sure they got it! I have no problem having them play matches where every shot must be a safety! Or only kick shots today!

Given the opportunity I would dedicate a year of my life to making winners out of these guys. That's my promise. I only want one year to exact change and I feel that I can do it. I happen to like all our top players and I really want them to win this thing, at least once in their life. I believe that when Team Europe sees how well prepared we are, that will instill some doubt in their minds. That's the only opening I want for our team, just a hint of concern on their part. They will know they are facing a different bunch than before.

I will put my ass, my reputation and my money on the line for this. I'm just sick of what I've seen here this week and I know it can be altered, given the chance.
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That's exactly the mentality that these men need, Mr Helfert.
You clearly are not intimidated by them and you would command their attention. (I've posted previously that the current coaching seems to be coming from an angle of too much admiration and not enough criticism). You would be their Micky to Rocky - qualified through life to be able to call one out when they are training like a bum.

Very impressive and I'm sold. Any chance of you working with Mark Wilson for 2017? Or does he have to be completely out of the picture?
 
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