Get em' SJD - here you go new target.
Learn with an aiming system or not
- Thread starter Mike81
- Start date
Get em' SJD - here you go new target.
Let me help you out a little Dick.
Some information on eye-hand coordination.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eye–hand_coordination
Some videos on the quiet-eyes method, which Dr. Dave advocates.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=knfC978EoWc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mKtV01-okI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w62JZe_rBmk&t=131s
The above technique has also been found to help with accuracy in situations where the subject has to react quickly such as when police have to look and shoot in milliseconds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWiGflJNFWk
What's this....an objective aiming system for kegel bowling........
http://bowlingknowledge.info/index.php?option=com_content&task=section&id=24&Itemid=64
This is how to train your eyes to focus
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnsxnIQsgKg
"At 48 I learned a new way to see" (Can you learn a new way to see Dick?)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCCtphdXhq8
I guess your google might be broken SJD and you just didn't take the time to research the points you wanted to make. The above person is a neuroscientist who thought that she was 40 years past the point of being able to develop 3d vision. Yet with a simple device created by an optometrist she was able to develop 3d vision. Something that she was told would never be possible for her.
So, maybe, just maybe, objective focused aiming like CTE has a lot of actual scientific merit behind it. In any event what people know now is vastly different than what was known in the 70s. There is a much larger world out there than pool and in that world people study things like vision and cognition and how to improve them. So as much as you hate to hear it, you are wrong about what people are capable of learning to do.
Some information on eye-hand coordination.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eye–hand_coordination
Some videos on the quiet-eyes method, which Dr. Dave advocates.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=knfC978EoWc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mKtV01-okI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w62JZe_rBmk&t=131s
The above technique has also been found to help with accuracy in situations where the subject has to react quickly such as when police have to look and shoot in milliseconds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWiGflJNFWk
What's this....an objective aiming system for kegel bowling........
http://bowlingknowledge.info/index.php?option=com_content&task=section&id=24&Itemid=64
This is how to train your eyes to focus
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnsxnIQsgKg
"At 48 I learned a new way to see" (Can you learn a new way to see Dick?)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCCtphdXhq8
I guess your google might be broken SJD and you just didn't take the time to research the points you wanted to make. The above person is a neuroscientist who thought that she was 40 years past the point of being able to develop 3d vision. Yet with a simple device created by an optometrist she was able to develop 3d vision. Something that she was told would never be possible for her.
So, maybe, just maybe, objective focused aiming like CTE has a lot of actual scientific merit behind it. In any event what people know now is vastly different than what was known in the 70s. There is a much larger world out there than pool and in that world people study things like vision and cognition and how to improve them. So as much as you hate to hear it, you are wrong about what people are capable of learning to do.
Maybe to point this discussion in another direction:
If you look at snooker, which has produced some of the greatest cueists of all time, why are there no such things like aiming controversies and players/ coaches stick to the philosophy of working on basics and mainly potting drills?
Side note:
As I read through this (and other) threads, this "pivot" thing comes up quite often and maybe the deeper meaning gets lost in translation a bit, but...for me it sounds like making adjustments or motions AFTER aiming? Which is against everything I learned about cuesports.
If you look at snooker, which has produced some of the greatest cueists of all time, why are there no such things like aiming controversies and players/ coaches stick to the philosophy of working on basics and mainly potting drills?
Side note:
As I read through this (and other) threads, this "pivot" thing comes up quite often and maybe the deeper meaning gets lost in translation a bit, but...for me it sounds like making adjustments or motions AFTER aiming? Which is against everything I learned about cuesports.
The pivot is totally misunderstood, no comment on that as it's been covered a zillion times. It's truly not a big deal.
And snooker coaches, some of them anyway do put a lot of emphasis on aiming.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M18didHSIBE&list=PLSKV5CK_fziWkD6rLGWvyv2KTSoIjqeWr
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fs2XZWyjVKk
Aiming systems/methods in snooker,
1. B.O.B. Back of Ball (contact point)
2. Dummy Ball - Ghost Ball
3. Line of the Shot (whatever that means)
Ooops - heretical dissent!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMtMTD0P9-g
Well let's just disagree with all the "conventions" while we are at it and destroy the empire in the process.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXEzWmhm5z0
Oh no, the world is truly about to collapse into a black hole.....it's a Snooker Aiming System....and FOR SALE too..... and with a PIVOT - kiss your loved ones good bye as the apocalypse is upon us.
The Approach-Line Potting System
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vdnje5W1NZQ
But wait there is more!
No less than Steve Davis says there are only FIVE potting angles. That sound you hear is everyone's head exploding!
https://youtu.be/e7M3z-lSSwI?t=73
Not convinced yet? Well hold on if you order RIGHT NOW I will throw in how learn the potting angles in 30 seconds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nh3VTCVjOrg
Oh what's this???? Same thing I have been saying for years?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95etYD9N4yQ
Where's the pic of the objective reference points?
Oh.......go to the table freeze two balls togather, look down at them.......nope....no 1/2 ball hit.
The point..........all aiming systems are subjective because it requires the player to visualize the "objective reference point" or the 1/2 ball hit.
See the thing is I cant be proven wrong.......unlike others.
Oh.......go to the table freeze two balls togather, look down at them.......nope....no 1/2 ball hit.
The point..........all aiming systems are subjective because it requires the player to visualize the "objective reference point" or the 1/2 ball hit.
See the thing is I cant be proven wrong.......unlike others.
John, if you devoted one 100th of the time you have spent working on your game, that you have spent gathering information from all the nutty scientests (who think like you do) maybe you would become a better pool player!..Give me your best estimate..How many of these scientific minded pool wizards, do you think would have had a prayer of beating me at pool?..I'm guessing maybe .0000000000001% of them!..(and that would only be for funsies
)PS..Give it up John..Pool is not a science, its a challenging skill! But your buddy, Mr.HawiianEye thinks anyone can easily master it, he says he's made millions at it, and he can teach 10 yr.old kids and complete idiots, to play top notch pool in 6 mos.!..Why can't he teach you?
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Geeze - yet another thinly veiled attempt to sneak AS arguments back into the Main Forum.
PLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZE
teleport this to the Aiming sub
Dale(perfecting his aiming)
First of all, I'm not trying to sneak any arguments about this topic anywhere.. Or trolling? I don't get any satisfaction from guys arguing about this or any other social media nonsense that is out there. I don't even own a computer. I posted this from my phone. I was seeking advice on whether or not I should start using an system in hopes of trying to improve or shorten the learning curve a bit or not. That's it! This was not meant to be a debate if aiming systems work or not. I was hoping someone may have been in my shoes at one point in time and could offer their experience on the topic. Obviously some believe they do and some believe they don't. I didn't expect this much back and forth over it and this was not my goal!! Obviously it's a touchy subject here. I have my answers and thanks to everyone for the advice. Delete this if you'd like, or move it, or whatever. Not trying to p*ss anyone off
It's funny how these guys pop up and one of the first things they ask is about a aiming system hummm..,,
1
GoldenFlash
Banned
They show simple stuff.????
John Barton....
The problems I have with these videos on aiming, is the guys making them always seem to demonstrate simple shots. Shots that just about any class D player can make.
This doesn't mean that the system being demonstrated doesn't work....it does mean, though, that long time players aren't interested in these simple shots.
The systems should be demonstrated as being effective on those long miserable full table shots where the cue ball is frozen on or very close to a rail. (I have said this in previous posts). ESPECIALLY on a big snooker table with those pockets.
Stan Shuffett is the only instructor I've seen who shows the effectiveness of the method in question on any long hard shots.
Although I did see one by an old man who was touting "edge of the ferrule" as a method and he did whack off some of those long ones.
This probably contributes to some of the resistance to these ideas of aiming systems.
Don't get angry with me at what I'm going to say next.
I watched that match between you and that Lou fellow again. I think both of you missed some of those long ones, hit balls to hard, chose the wrong shots, because the "dog was out" and you were choking under the pressure. Both of you. An aiming system isn't much good under those conditions....the nervous system has the body too disconnected from the brain.
Keeping "the dog" at bay is a lot tougher than making balls or drawing good position, in my opinion, no matter which process or procedure is used to make the shots and play the game at the higher level of ability.
We all saw that recently in the Super Bowl when the Falcons had a 25 point lead, then proceeded to choke to death, and lose the game. We've seen it hundreds of times in all games and sports.
Just a friendly observation....not looking for trouble.
John Barton....
The problems I have with these videos on aiming, is the guys making them always seem to demonstrate simple shots. Shots that just about any class D player can make.
This doesn't mean that the system being demonstrated doesn't work....it does mean, though, that long time players aren't interested in these simple shots.
The systems should be demonstrated as being effective on those long miserable full table shots where the cue ball is frozen on or very close to a rail. (I have said this in previous posts). ESPECIALLY on a big snooker table with those pockets.
Stan Shuffett is the only instructor I've seen who shows the effectiveness of the method in question on any long hard shots.
Although I did see one by an old man who was touting "edge of the ferrule" as a method and he did whack off some of those long ones.
This probably contributes to some of the resistance to these ideas of aiming systems.
Don't get angry with me at what I'm going to say next.
I watched that match between you and that Lou fellow again. I think both of you missed some of those long ones, hit balls to hard, chose the wrong shots, because the "dog was out" and you were choking under the pressure. Both of you. An aiming system isn't much good under those conditions....the nervous system has the body too disconnected from the brain.
Keeping "the dog" at bay is a lot tougher than making balls or drawing good position, in my opinion, no matter which process or procedure is used to make the shots and play the game at the higher level of ability.
We all saw that recently in the Super Bowl when the Falcons had a 25 point lead, then proceeded to choke to death, and lose the game. We've seen it hundreds of times in all games and sports.
Just a friendly observation....not looking for trouble.
For his second question, he should ask if dropping the elbow is ok or not.
Spikeithard
Registered
Dont want to start a whole new thread so Ill ask here. I have a couple questions about CTE
I get the basics of lining up edge of CB to 'a' 'b' or 'c' on the OB. BUT... what about snooker cues that are 10mm? what about using a 10mm with smaller 2 1/16 balls?
also, when lining up the cue stick with the edge of the CB, do you go to the outside of the cue stick or the inside? Hard to explain but does your cue shaft go right outside the view of the cue ball or is the exact edge of the CB in the middle of your shaft line?
thanks
I get the basics of lining up edge of CB to 'a' 'b' or 'c' on the OB. BUT... what about snooker cues that are 10mm? what about using a 10mm with smaller 2 1/16 balls?
also, when lining up the cue stick with the edge of the CB, do you go to the outside of the cue stick or the inside? Hard to explain but does your cue shaft go right outside the view of the cue ball or is the exact edge of the CB in the middle of your shaft line?
thanks
I know that my stroke is wonky which is one reason I don't do a lot of "tough" shots in my videos. The other reason is that I find it to be easier to explain whatever it is that I am wanting to convey in a smaller space on the table.
That said, here you go.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6B46emAxuc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lHJ2NYLzps
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAOEywF8z3A
Best I got for you right now.
Mike81...There is no magic pill (substitute 'aming system here) to shorten the learning curve. It takes time on the table. The only possible way to shorten the learning curve is to get yourself some quality instruction...and practice correctly.
Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
GoldenFlash
Banned
Thanks.
Good shooting on those long ones.(better than anything I can do)
By the way, I LOVED the music on the second one.....that's some good stuff.
Regards,
Flash
There is an APA 3 that plays in our ACS league. Nice lady, mid 50's, being play pool forever, loves the game, plays at least 3 times a week in various leagues.
She misses cut shots, any cut shot, about 50% of the time, maybe even more. I finally got sick of it, and showed her fractional aiming, so at least she has a reference. Her mind can't ever find the right spot in the past, because she missed so often.
She would aim with her cue on the 1/4 of the object ball, and then use her cue to line up the cb (the actual system is NOT the point, so lets not discuss that part)
She had a hard time even understanding the this simple aiming system. I showed her again the next week cause she was doing it wrong. And I showed her again the next week, and she was finally starting to understand.
Finally, she was making shots, a LOT more than 50%. Maybe 80% now, on routine, NOT length of table cut shots. And now she is not even using her cue to "aim" it up anymore because her mind now knows where to go instinctively.
Yeah, she will need to learn about throw, English, and develop a little better stroke to bring that 80% up to 95%, and that will be some increments at that point. But at least her brain now has a point of reference. For whatever reasons, not all persons learn the same, or will ever play the same.
Some folks have no natural ability and need to "devise" some of their own. Is it a crutch, yep. But crutches are fuggin GOLDEN when you are crippled. And for all intent and purposes, she was a crippled pool player that was never going to "see" where she had to hit the object ball.
Of course, not everyone is going to be this bad. But that guy out there that is only hitting 80% wants to get to 95% one day, and a reference for his brain is not going to hurt him. It may or may not help him. who really knows. But when all else fails and hitting a million balls badly is not working, you got to try something else.
It's just a guide, to help folks "train" their brain, to learn how to sight the object ball, to learn that when things look "wrong" they might actually be right, and to trust you judgment and not make corrections once you are down on the shot.
Bottom line, is for many folks, they need it and badly. How more millions of balls is this mid 50's lady got left in her before she can actually starting winning a few games? For me, it was time. She needed to do something different, because whatever she had been doing for the last 15 years simple was not working, and was never going to work, no matter how much she played.
Remember, most league players are not shortstops, and most aiming systems are developed for these league players. The majority of the pool playing public. And they want to get better without hitting a million balls, and for those that hit a million and still can't pot a ball to save their life.
Insanity is doing something over and over, but expecting different results.
She misses cut shots, any cut shot, about 50% of the time, maybe even more. I finally got sick of it, and showed her fractional aiming, so at least she has a reference. Her mind can't ever find the right spot in the past, because she missed so often.
She would aim with her cue on the 1/4 of the object ball, and then use her cue to line up the cb (the actual system is NOT the point, so lets not discuss that part)
She had a hard time even understanding the this simple aiming system. I showed her again the next week cause she was doing it wrong. And I showed her again the next week, and she was finally starting to understand.
Finally, she was making shots, a LOT more than 50%. Maybe 80% now, on routine, NOT length of table cut shots. And now she is not even using her cue to "aim" it up anymore because her mind now knows where to go instinctively.
Yeah, she will need to learn about throw, English, and develop a little better stroke to bring that 80% up to 95%, and that will be some increments at that point. But at least her brain now has a point of reference. For whatever reasons, not all persons learn the same, or will ever play the same.
Some folks have no natural ability and need to "devise" some of their own. Is it a crutch, yep. But crutches are fuggin GOLDEN when you are crippled. And for all intent and purposes, she was a crippled pool player that was never going to "see" where she had to hit the object ball.
Of course, not everyone is going to be this bad. But that guy out there that is only hitting 80% wants to get to 95% one day, and a reference for his brain is not going to hurt him. It may or may not help him. who really knows. But when all else fails and hitting a million balls badly is not working, you got to try something else.
It's just a guide, to help folks "train" their brain, to learn how to sight the object ball, to learn that when things look "wrong" they might actually be right, and to trust you judgment and not make corrections once you are down on the shot.
Bottom line, is for many folks, they need it and badly. How more millions of balls is this mid 50's lady got left in her before she can actually starting winning a few games? For me, it was time. She needed to do something different, because whatever she had been doing for the last 15 years simple was not working, and was never going to work, no matter how much she played.
Remember, most league players are not shortstops, and most aiming systems are developed for these league players. The majority of the pool playing public. And they want to get better without hitting a million balls, and for those that hit a million and still can't pot a ball to save their life.
Insanity is doing something over and over, but expecting different results.
You're good. the HAMB crowd can't stand to let a question like yours be answered in any pro-aiming system way without turning it into a flamewar.