Sky confirmed for Team USA Mosconi Cup
- Thread starter terryhanna
- Start date
Yowser, that would leave out the two who were, in my view, the best Team Europe performers at the 2017 Mosconi, meaning Filler and Alcaide. Still, the European selection formula always seems to work, so who can argue with success?
It may seem a little strange they picked Ouschan instead of Filler, although when I looked at the current Euro Tour top rankings, Ouschan is ranked 3rd behind Kaci and He, whereas Filler is not to be found in the top 12. However, both Shaw and Feijen were also not ranked in the top 12. Feijen likely got selected based largely on his long successful reputation as one of the top 9-ball players in the world and for winning this year's World Pool Masters tournament, and certainly no one would question Jayson Shaw being one of 5 best European 9-ball players. Filler did not do as well in the big events, his only major win being the 10-ball Players Championship. Just another sign of how strong the Euro team is that a player with the firepower of Filler did not make their MC team despite being the MVP in last years MC.
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Filler is not playing all that well this year. Went out of the Leende Eurotour event early, and has been a piggybank for the Filipinos this year. I actually wish he would have been given a spot this year, might make it a little easier on us...
Perhaps if Justin thought this out more he would actually make a smart decision on it one of these years. He will be paid a minimum of $10,000 just for making the Mosconi cup team and showing up and losing, with a chance to double that and make $20,000 if they somehow managed to pull out the win, and everybody agrees that he is pretty much guaranteed making the team if he will just show the minimum effort.
Let's make his expenses to make the team the absolute worst case scenario. First, let's say he doesn't win a single dime doing the extra events and stuff to make the team. As one of the top players in the world it is almost impossible that he wouldn't cash in any of the additional events that he played, but we are making this as absolutely worst case scenario as possible to see if his choice makes any sense whatsoever. Let's have him going to an overseas event as you said, for a cost of about $2,000. Now let's have him go to four different events/training sessions in the U.S. at a cost of about $1,000 each.
Do you think it would be smart to spend $6,000 to make a guaranteed $10,000? It is a no brainer. That is smart money all day long every day. Only a fool wouldn't do that. Now add on the fact that you will be doing what you enjoy anyway in the process. Now add on the fact that you probably wouldn't even spend $6,000 because you could cut your costs even more with a little frugality and/or smart planning. Now add on the fact that he would again cut his costs even more because he is going to win some money in the process in those events. Now figure in that he has a long shot chance to win $20,000 instead of the $10,000. Now figure all the playing experience he gains in this process, as well as the free coaching, and how that experience will likely ultimately translate into playing a little bit better and earning a little more money in the future because of it.
After you net out his winnings in the process of qualifying, and traveling on the cheap, he would probably actually make the team for $3,000 or less, possibly even no cost after winnings, but even at $3,000 cost that leaves him pocketing at least $7,000 in net earnings for making the team doing what he likes to do anyway. Absolutely worst case totally unrealistic scenario is that he nets $4,000 in his pocket after all is said and done, plus he got to travel and gain experience etc. More realistic scenario is that he nets $7,000-$10,000. Again, you would have to be an absolute fool not to do it. The numbers all line up to a guaranteed nice net pay day with the only question being exactly how nice.
You're ignoring alternative uses of the time Justin would have spent on all the Cup-related activities. Maybe it's winning money playing pool during those times (tournaments or gambling), maybe it's family-related activities, maybe it's fishing.
He should be able to choose whether to participate in Cup activities without being called a foul.
I do remember that at one point he said he would pursue qualifying for the 2018 team by playing in more points events. Then a new process for determining the team was announced, and he decided to forego it. So be it. He's only 31, and I imagine he will be on several future Cup teams.
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As long as they aren't taking any government benefits everybody is entitled to work as little as they wish. Never said otherwise. Doesn't make it a smart decision though, and it sure takes away your right to complain about about not being able to make enough money in pool (not that I specifically recall him complaining about that but just saying).
shaw and ouschan were the wild cards, the others were default. i would have preferred melling, kazakis or ruslan to ouschan..but hey, the captain probably knows best
You're making a lot of assumptions here and none of us know what Justin was thinking during this process. Everything in life is not about the bottom line or how much money you can make if you do something. We are each entitled to live our life the way we see fit as long as we don't harm others in the process. I happen to like Justin and think he is an excellent pool player, certainly one of the best in this country. He proved that last week at a major International tournament. Once again I'm hopeful that somehow we are pleasantly surprised and see him chosen for Team USA.
It wasn't too long ago that Shane was out of the running as well and somehow miraculously he found himself back in the good graces of those who choose the team. It's not to late to find an avenue for Justin either.
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As a point of fact, there is a 16 event qualifying period, the last one being the recent International Open. The top three players are then automatically selected with those players being #1 Eklent Kaci, #2 Mario He and #3 Niels Feijen. The two wildcards were Albin Ouschan who was #4 and Jayson Shaw who was #12. Both wildcards are selected by the captain, Marcus Chamat.
Thanks for clarification. Where exactly online can I find that 16 event point standings? Thanks
So true.
Because Europe so clearly out performs the U.S. in so many respects, it strikes me as extra bonkers to include two players in the final group with a fargorate under 750 while not even considering Bergman, Dechaine, Deuel, and Josh Roberts.
I realize these players I am mentioning didn't go to the super important boot camps and trips abroad, but by requiring super important boot camps and trips abroad, Johan had to know that he would be excluding many high quality players. So requiring camps and trips in the first place, seems unwise...if winning is the goal.
After the same 'ole five got drilled in London 11-2, I was and am totally on board with giving other players a chance, but the methodology for making the decision on who will go should be more sound.
kollegedave
Because Europe so clearly out performs the U.S. in so many respects, it strikes me as extra bonkers to include two players in the final group with a fargorate under 750 while not even considering Bergman, Dechaine, Deuel, and Josh Roberts.
I realize these players I am mentioning didn't go to the super important boot camps and trips abroad, but by requiring super important boot camps and trips abroad, Johan had to know that he would be excluding many high quality players. So requiring camps and trips in the first place, seems unwise...if winning is the goal.
After the same 'ole five got drilled in London 11-2, I was and am totally on board with giving other players a chance, but the methodology for making the decision on who will go should be more sound.
kollegedave
Deuel is still in consideration last I heard unless something changed. He took Hatch's spot when Hatch dropped out.
Here is an alternative way of looking at it, the way I think Johan is looking at it, that I don't think has occurred to most people and it is worth at least giving some consideration to it (and then we can decided if we agree or disagree with the strategy after at least considering it). Johan isn't just looking to pick the five best players, at least for the moment. That strategy hasn't worked for years and if we keep with that strategy the U.S. may never win again so he is trying to come up with a new strategy so that we may actually have a realistic chance to win again, even if it lowers our chances a bit in the first couple of years.
Our five best aren't good enough to win (unless it is a rare fluke) and haven't been for years and it isn't looking like they will be capable any time soon either. Since picking our five best is never going to make us equals to the European team, logic says to ask yourself if there is any other strategy that might work better. The answer is that there is only one thing. We have to get better. We have to improve our level of play. It is the only option when our five best just don't have a realistic chance.
So now the question becomes, as the coach of the team, how do you get the players to get better. Well there is really only three ways. One, you have to be active and playing a lot of events. Two, you have to be putting in a personal effort to improve. Three, you have a good chance of seeing improvement through good coaching.
Essentially Johan has required all three of these things through his policies in order to be able to make the team. Not because he wants to exclude any of our best players, but because he knows that improving is the only way we will ever have a chance, and so he has no choice but to set policies that force us to have to improve, or at least be trying.
Does this hurt us in the short term? Yeah, a little bit, but that is more the fault of the player/s that aren't willing to go along with the program, even when it is clearly in their best financial and playing interest to do so. Will Johan's plan end up working out in the long run? It remains to be seen, but there are some early indications that he may be having some effect on upping the level of play from several of our players, and several of them have given him credit. What we pretty much know for sure though is that picking our top five hadn't been working and wasn't likely to start working any time soon. IMO it isn't an awful idea to try something new when what you have been doing hasn't been working and doesn't look like it will start working any time soon, and there is definitely a lot of logic to his strategy of trying to actually raise our level of play. And really, even with this new strategy we could still be sending our very best five if they would just go along with it, and even though it is in their best interest in every way to go along with it a few have chosen not to which is really more their fault (and also their right) than Johan's fault.
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Is there a sheet like this for USA players, if not do you know how players got picked for USA team this year?
Thanks!
Take a deep bow for a well reasoned, well presented post.
http://www.matchroompool.com/news/styer-set-partypoker-mosconi-cup-debut/
Looks like Tyler is on the team.
Looks like Tyler is on the team.
I like this kid. It's a step in the right direction, introducing some new blood to the fray, just like when Billy Thorpe was added a couple of years back. I'm not sure why Billy's game has gone a little stale in the last year, but maybe the MC will bring out the best in him.