What "if" Florian Venom Kohler decided to compete at 8,9,10 Ball?

[jrctherake]

You're, not Your; within that specific context.

I respect your opinion on this subject. I am not a pool expert, by any means. I am just a poor old soul who wishes he would have had a table at home all his life. I've seen guys who took advantage of that, and they were calling 4 & 5 rail banks on me; and making those suckers too. Some Efren looking mess.

I know I said I was done here but, lol... I'm still here.

Ok, I'll bite again.

My advice:

Just say "ok", I was mistaken about the artistic player because I was really impressed by what I saw him do and just "assumed" that his artistic pool talents translates to a 1:1 ratio to pro pool players.

You said its "my opinion". Well, it a fact because:

I'm not pro material and he cant get there with me, not even close. So, if he cant get there with me, he's definitely nowhere close to pro speed.

If you dont know what Fargo rating is look it up and this will help:

I beat most players below 675ish.
Players above 675ish but below 710ish usually hold their own with me (~break even).
Players around 710ish, well, I have to be at my "VERY BEST" to just stay even.
Players above 730ish, well...I'm dead meat regardless of day, table, game, bet etc...

Now, having said the above, I believe his Fargo is around 600ish or lower. So, what does that tell you about your "assumption"?

 

[LeftyIke]

Kareem Abdul Jabber, the NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer, put out a Movie called,”On the Shoulders of Giants”, which chronicled the history of the Harlem Rens and the Globetrotters, which led to the integration of Pro Basketball. Jabbar was known then as Lew Alcindor, and was born in New York, saw the Rens play in the famous Renaissance Ballroom in Harlem, and the Rens drew crowds as large as 15,000, when the All-White league was barely surviving. The Rens led to the Globetrotters, and both proved their worth by beating the World Champions in Head-to-Head competition. The Lakers moved from Minneapolis to Los Angeles to try to give them a chance to survive. The Rens played everyday, and twice on Sundays, to big crowds. There is no automatic transition from Trick Shot dominance in Pool to Top-Notch Tournament Play or Gambling, just as a Snooker player playing on a 12-footer with Small Pockets doesn’t necessarily translate into being a Great Pool POlayer on 8 or 9-footers, but it’s possible.

 

[rossaroni]

No problem. The Globetrotters played straight-up Basketball at their outset. They defeated the Chicago Bruins to capture the prestigious World Professional Basketball Tournament in 1940, after winning it the previous year. They didn’t incorporate ball tricks and dribbling exhibitions until the late 1930’s. In 1948, the Globetrotters beat the Minneapolis Lakers, champions of the National Basketball League, the precursor of the NBA. The following year, they beat the Lakers again! You’re welcome. The first Black NBA players(Earl Lloyd and Chuck Cooper) we’re both Globetrotters, and beat the Celtics when Joe Lapchick was a Star Center, and who later drafted the first Black Player,Sweetwater Clifton, when Lapchick became the Knicks Head Coach.

I am going to go out on a limb and guess that the Globtrotter team that people were referring to was not 60-80 years ago.

 

[Rimfirejunkie]

I assume the Harlem Globetrotters would sweep the NBA too?

I spit beer out! Haha

 

[Rimfirejunkie]

No problem. The Globetrotters played straight-up Basketball at their outset. They defeated the Chicago Bruins to capture the prestigious World Professional Basketball Tournament in 1940, after winning it the previous year. They didn’t incorporate ball tricks and dribbling exhibitions until the late 1930’s. In 1948, the Globetrotters beat the Minneapolis Lakers, champions of the National Basketball League, the precursor of the NBA. The following year, they beat the Lakers again! You’re welcome. The first Black NBA players(Earl Lloyd and Chuck Cooper) we’re both Globetrotters, and beat the Celtics when Joe Lapchick was a Star Center, and who later drafted the first Black Player,Sweetwater Clifton, when Lapchick became the Knicks Head Coach.

The Minneapolis Lakers? Wow

 

[LeftyIke]

The Minneapolis Lakers had the first Superstar Center, George Mikan. Mikan was so good, that they created the Goaltending rule because of him, and created the shot-clock. Her also fought for the players to have Pensions, and was one of the Founders of the ABAS, which introduced the three-point shot and popularized Dunking! Sounds like today’s NBA, huh? The Lakers moved to Los Angeles, drafted Elgin Baylor and Jerry West, and helped save the League.

 

[9 Ball Fan]

Points well taken on Basketball. Joe DiMaggio also once said when asked about the best pitching he had ever seen, that Satchel Paige and Sandy Koufax had the stuff.

If Florian spent 6 solid months running racks, and focusing upon position play; I believe he could make the jump to the pro billiards circuit. He would put some guys out of big tournaments. He would turn some heads.

Do you not think he could do it with a full time focus upon 8, 9, or 10 Ball? He has proven his dedication to his endeavors. Hell, I suck at pool compared to him; but give me 6 months, and tell me my bills were on the line. I'd hunt that money ball.

 

[logical]

There are teams they could beat.

Maybe in the the WNBA, but even then unlikely.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

 

[Nostroke]

Florian vs SVB, Race to 21, 10 Ball, on a 9' or 10' Diamond.

If SVB doesn't win by more than 3 racks, then Florian makes his point either way.

Or substitute Alex, Jason, or whoever for SVB. If they can't beat Florian by more than 3, in a race to 21; he deserves to be in the conversation.

I'd give 10 on the wire

 

[noMoreSchon]

Florian vs SVB, Race to 21, 10 Ball, on a 9' or 10' Diamond.

If SVB doesn't win by more than 3 racks, then Florian makes his point either way.

Or substitute Alex, Jason, or whoever for SVB. If they can't beat Florian by more than 3, in a race to 21; he deserves to be in the conversation.

Venom wouldn't get to double digits against any of those guys. You see his awesome shots

on his videos, but what you fail to see is how many times it took to make it. He has 'awesome'

cue ball control, but when you realize that it is better to stop the cue ball instead of

spinning it 6 rails to get shape is when you will see that is the true mark of a professional.

I enjoy watching trick shots, and Venom has stepped up the trick shot game in the last

10 years or so. And I would not bet on any professional going toe to toe with him shooting

trick shots either. He has chosen his billiard path, and makes more money than most

on that list of proposed challengers.

 

[ctyhntr]

Can you share your insight on the cues?

I've heard spraying the cue ball with silicone is why they can get so much more action than normal.

Why hasn't anyone mentioned yet that the cues for trick shots are probably set up differently than a regular playing cue. Tips, ferrules, contours, and weight are different from a regular cue, from what I've heard and read. It is how they can move the cue ball around so easily. Those "trick" cues probably aren't that great for playing a game of rotation with.

Maniac (has a Fargo rate around the same as Florian's for cryin' out loud)

 

[jrctherake]

Can you share your insight on the cues?

I've heard spraying the cue ball with silicone is why they can get so much more action than normal.

I know several artistic players. Almost all of them have a specific cue for specific type shots.

Its common.

Think about players, we usually have a "break cue", a "playing cue" and a "jump cue". So, what makes you think an artistic player wouldn't have a masse cue that is a bit shorter, balanced to be for favorable to masses and have a certain ferrule/tip combo that favors the same?

On the other hand, they would have another "similar" cue set up for more brunt force shots with really hard ferrule/tip combo. Not to mention, stiffer staper.

Does all that make it easy? Nope. Does all that make it easier? You damn skippy.

 

[Maniac]

Can you share your insight on the cues?

I've heard spraying the cue ball with silicone is why they can get so much more action than normal.

I'm sure I've heard a trick-shot person say one time on a video that the shafts of their cues are very low-mass and the tips they use would not be what you'd find on a normal playing cue. I have also heard the trick about the silicone on the cue ball too.

Also, in a real pool match, I'm sure the tournament director isn't going to allow the foxy chick to lay on the table while Florian's shooting. :grin:

I could be wrong about the special cues.

The reason I say I could be wrong is because about 13 years ago I reported on one of my very first posts that C.J. Wiley had passed away. I saw the obituary and everything. I beat myself up for days trying to figure out how in the hell I came up with that crap and the only conclusion I could come up with was I must have been dreaming.

So...….

Maniac

 

[Cornerman]

Can you share your insight on the cues?

I've heard spraying the cue ball with silicone is why they can get so much more action than normal.

People say this, and I can’t say anything what others do, but I’ve seen Mike Massey do several trick shot demos with no chance at adding silicone.

 

[Texas Carom Club]

some times they do sometimes they dont
you can usually see the ball extra shiney
or it doing things you just know arent possible under regular conditions

same for the carom trick shot guys
roberto rojas, semih sayginer, some of the asians i dont know thier names

 

[sjm]

Trick shot cues tend to have shorter ferrules than regular cues.

 

[pt109]

some times they do sometimes they dont
you can usually see the ball extra shiney
or it doing things you just know arent possible under regular conditions

same for the carom trick shot guys
roberto rojas, semih sayginer, some of the asians i dont know thier names

Trick shot cues tend to have shorter ferrules than regular cues.

Massé cues for artistic billiards are different lengths and weights for special shots.
....and they spray the rails with that silicone sometimes also.

 

[asbani]

Interesting assessment. You don't think he could hang with SVB, Alex, and the rest? We need an exhibition match, to test the waters.

No, he can't compete with the top pro's, I don't think he would be able to compete at pro level.

He's just an exhibition, trick shot maker, he creates trick shots and repeat them for thousands of times which enables him to execute them again in front of other people, but in real competitive game/play, I don't think he will win hardly any major tournaments.

He tried in the past and couldn't get past the first few rounds.

I know people love trick shots, especially amateurs who watch them trick shots on youtube and they go "Woah that guy is insane", but he is just a trick shot player, and amateurs feel that he's sick because he made the cueball dance or whatever but they don't understand that he executed the same shot a gazillion time which is why he can do it.

But in a real game, you don't want the cueball to dance, you want to execute a simple shot to get another simple shot, it's a totally different game.

 

[pt109]

People say this, and I can’t say anything what others do, but I’ve see. Mike Massey do several trick shot demos with no chance at adding silicone.

Mike Massey could do a lot of things the average human is incapable of....
....he doesn’t need help.
When he was still the Tennessee Tarzan, he bet he could make the blue off the spot
from the jaws....and draw back into the corner.....with one hand...
...he then bet the guy double or nothing that he could walk around that table on the rails...
...on his hands.
...he WAS the Tarzan

 

[trob]

I assume the Harlem Globetrotters would sweep the NBA too?

Haha this is spot on. The kid is a great trick shot artist and He’s great for the apa. He’s an amazing entertainer and those low level and new players eat it up when he comes in to town but their is a big difference between that and game toughness. Making the cue ball dance as the poster kept saying is only part of the battle. The mental side of running out when the pressure is on and you have to win to get paid and pay the bills is a lot different then getting a check just to show up do trick shots ...smile and shake some hands. He gets paid to perform not for his performance. I would like to see it but for now he’s making a great living doing what he’s doing and he seems like he really loves what he does so he really doesn’t need it.