I want to see world-class players playing for a GIANT stack of cash. Watching them ham it up or 'interact' with the crowd is waaaaaaaay down on my list of things i want in a pool telecast. If it happens so be it but what you don't want is for those interactions to be forced or phony.
What type of audience is best for tv pool?
- Thread starter livemusic
- Start date
Well I suppose the big stack of cash would draw in the usual suspects on the PPV. Poker got lucky with the Moneymaker win. No amount of luck would allow a true amatuer to win a massive cash prize in pool.
...and yes genuine interaction is only one with noting. Again though..., with the pressure of the shot clock. They've pretty much killed any possibility of it during a match.
The OP was asking how to get more non-pool nuts to watch the game. The game needs to be: quick(NO 1p), easy to understand and have some excitement drama. Nine-ball with a shot clock is the obvious choice. Make it fast, easy to follow and exciting. Picture a tour where there was MosconiCup format pool every weekend for decent money.
..and there is your winning formula imo. Not only the format but the atmosphere as well. At least I think it the best idea in the North American market. The whole tucked in shirt, quiet as a church mouse thing doesn't fly on this side of the pond. Boisterous crowds allowed to voice their admiration or frustration. In the same breath, I'd say also respectful enough to shut the hell up when the player is bearing down on the money ball.
Geosnookery
Well-known member
The most watched sports in the world by TV audience are: Soccer, cricket, field hockey, table tennis, tennis, golf.
The first of these has the most insane fans in the world. The last, amongst the most subdued in behavior.
It’s not players or fan behaviour that governs a sports popularity. Yan drew 60 million viewers in China winning the Snoojer Masters...no live audience and emotion during 98% of the match confined to a raised eyebrow.
Manchester United vs Liverpool FC on the last two weekends has tens of millions insane fans captivated from Rio to Rome. Tens of millions play soccer.
In contrast, Americans had NFL football This weekend. How many American adults suit up and play pro rules? Maybe .000001 of 1 percent? But great fans....most of whom at most may toss a football to their son or grandson a couple tines a year. I had to look up Green Bay to find out where it was and was surprised how popular it is.
There’s not really one major common denominator among popularly viewed sorts. It comes down to marketing. Sports can be fun, popular to play, part of a culture, but they need to be marketed ‘if’ the goal is viewership. I go fishing, play pool, ball hockey and slow pitch. I have zero desire to watch any of them. I wouldn’t go watch pro nine ball if given a free ticket...I’d rather play myself: the same with fishing or ball hockey.
The first of these has the most insane fans in the world. The last, amongst the most subdued in behavior.
It’s not players or fan behaviour that governs a sports popularity. Yan drew 60 million viewers in China winning the Snoojer Masters...no live audience and emotion during 98% of the match confined to a raised eyebrow.
Manchester United vs Liverpool FC on the last two weekends has tens of millions insane fans captivated from Rio to Rome. Tens of millions play soccer.
In contrast, Americans had NFL football This weekend. How many American adults suit up and play pro rules? Maybe .000001 of 1 percent? But great fans....most of whom at most may toss a football to their son or grandson a couple tines a year. I had to look up Green Bay to find out where it was and was surprised how popular it is.
There’s not really one major common denominator among popularly viewed sorts. It comes down to marketing. Sports can be fun, popular to play, part of a culture, but they need to be marketed ‘if’ the goal is viewership. I go fishing, play pool, ball hockey and slow pitch. I have zero desire to watch any of them. I wouldn’t go watch pro nine ball if given a free ticket...I’d rather play myself: the same with fishing or ball hockey.
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Pool must become entertaining to the general viewing audience. While some of us enjoy, the commentary of some commentators, detailing what players, may do, will do in their shot selection while playing one pocket, that commentary would put a general audience to sleep in about 60 seconds. If pool commentators were fed interesting but exciting facts, personal life details and relative statistics about the various players currently playing a live match, (like what is done with professional sports on television) the general audience would be far more interested in watching matches. Unfortunately, there is not enough profit/revenue in live streaming pool (or the television broadcasting of pool) to provide that additional data to the commentators.
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Well said.
Yes, but compare Wimbledon and the USOpen. Wildy different atmospheres.... ...and my point about what works in American market. So yes I do agree it boils down to marketing. However the product needs to viable to make it marketable.
Geosnookery
Well-known member
Tennis is worldwide. It wouldn’t be viable if dependent on just the US market.No pro circuit and thus no US Open...or at least that anyone would care about.
The issue with some sports is they are marketed as ‘events’..spectacles. One off events like boxing has to scramble to promote her ‘next’ event and needs to offer something ‘Special’. American Pool has fallen into this trap...Specific events are marketed like a prize fight except even few pool players are interested in the product. American Pool is a popularly played sport but, like Slowpitch, it isn’t going to succeed at a pro level as the product itself is unmarketable.. Chinese 8 ball has moved into the niche.
The point about comparing Wimbledon and the USOpen (tennis) was to point out that its the identical game, played by identical rules (except the all whites apparel), played by the same players, but the atmosphere is wildly different. It's that atmosphere that drvies the USOpen to what it is. I can't think of a successful American version of a game/sport that doesn't have the boisterous crowd.
The comparisons between snooker and chinese 8 ball to the american pool need to stop. Two different cultures.... What flies over there does not work on USA soil.
The lack of a real North American pro tour can be blamed, and I'm sure will continue to be. In this case I think you need to display an entertaining chicken before you can sell a carton of eggs. <<<--write that down
You are absolutely correct about the behavior when Europe hosts. The ones that irritate me and there are always a few are the ones that have to get in the last "stupid sound of the day" after the ref has called for everyone to quiet down. One tool makes what I can only assume must be his mating call which is followed by a few more answering with the next trying to be louder than the previous. Apparently the last to blurt out their mating call at the loudest possible volume is the victor. I have no problem with people applauding and cheering on their team, even some light hearted heckling can be acceptable.
A lot of the Euro sport fan mentality, especially the Brits, is imo a trickle-down effect from soccer. Those folks are nuts. China on the other hand is reserved in just about everything they do. They have come with some razzle-dazzle the last few years:
In that case, you would have to remove Keith McCready from his sarcophagus and give him a day or two to warm up his smack-talking because he is one of the best to ham it up while gambling.
Geosnookery
Well-known member
Ha.,Ha! That was ‘weird’. Marketing at either its best or its worst. It had me skipping forward to the nine ball sinking.
Brit fans are at extremes. Football games can be insane and then go see a cricket match and it’s polite clapping.
As for Chinese being ‘reserved‘. Skip around this video. 90 million viewers. Ding and Selby are the celebrity guests.
This is quite a difficult question, but here's my slant:
The best crowd for pool is what you get at the Mosconi Cup. Whether you're in America or Europe, the European fans sing and dance and really live on the edge of every moment of the competition. The Mosconi Cup, other than the most recent one which had no fans, offers a party atmosphere for attendees.
It's easy to imagine a TV or stream viewer thinking that they'd love to be part of that party atmosphere, and the unswerving enthusiasm of the crowd makes the event seem more important than it would otherwise to a TV or stream viewer.
The wild fans are part of the show. I recall being on a Wembley-bound Underground train on the day of a key British football match. Sure enough, the fans heading for the game were already singing on the Underground. The energy for the event was already building ... on the train!
There's nothing wrong with having relatively stoic fans who are more reserved in their behavior, especially where local culture dictates it, but it can compromise the energy that could otherwise surround the event.
The best crowd for pool is what you get at the Mosconi Cup. Whether you're in America or Europe, the European fans sing and dance and really live on the edge of every moment of the competition. The Mosconi Cup, other than the most recent one which had no fans, offers a party atmosphere for attendees.
It's easy to imagine a TV or stream viewer thinking that they'd love to be part of that party atmosphere, and the unswerving enthusiasm of the crowd makes the event seem more important than it would otherwise to a TV or stream viewer.
The wild fans are part of the show. I recall being on a Wembley-bound Underground train on the day of a key British football match. Sure enough, the fans heading for the game were already singing on the Underground. The energy for the event was already building ... on the train!
There's nothing wrong with having relatively stoic fans who are more reserved in their behavior, especially where local culture dictates it, but it can compromise the energy that could otherwise surround the event.
...and those fans were a travelling billboard for the game/event/sport they were about to take part in. The last few words of that previous sentence is what makes sports great. The Mosconi allows interaction that this game woefully lacks otherwise. Imagine hundreds of people clueless of pool wondering why there's a group of fans singing for the Mosconi or DCC on the subway. Talk about druming up interest...
I just found out yesterday that there was going to be a Super Bowl and who was playing. I thought the whole season was crapped out. Is anyone taking it for real? Like it matters, that is?
That never would have happened in previous times with all the screaming and marketing that usually goes with it.
There's an opp here for other sports to grab a bigger share of the sports' pie.
Jeff Livingston
That never would have happened in previous times with all the screaming and marketing that usually goes with it.
There's an opp here for other sports to grab a bigger share of the sports' pie.
Jeff Livingston
Oh, Moneymaker's influence was mainly on amateurs entering pro events, largely inflating the purses, thus making the events big enough that more of the boring play could be edited out. Participation in home games, etc. has always been there, at least as long as I've been alive. But the question was about TV. What made poker watchable is the hole cam. Except for the big names, I usually can't tell a pro from an amateur in these events, due to the fact that they only show the final table and a little bit of the leadup. The WSOP is different as they show the whole thing, with a feature table or two and exciting play from the "outer" tables. It's never live and it probably never will be, and I don't like the recent "time delay broadcasting" to make it 30 minutes old or so. That reduces the amateur's chances of winning, because it forces changes to your strategy. I think nothing should be shown until the event is over. Pool is different, it can be live because there's nothing hidden in the game, but it might work better if it's edited to just show the interesting shots. I think the commentary is somewhat hit or miss. I like the straight man - funny man style of the WSOP, but because I'm also an amateur player, I like a little strategy discussion too. I don't like the all-strategy commentators. In the NFL, MLB, and NBA they call it play-by-play guy and color commentator. I think the best broadcasts are made by the color commentator. The ones who mix strategy with non-strategy comments are my favorite. Pool needs to find that combination.
The smallest SB is still bigger than ANYTHING that has happened or might happen in the pool world. Its still a big day(est. 13+ BILLION $) for US businesses.
Knowing the problems of one's competition helps but focusing on that alone doesn't help, it distracts from making good moves now while the sun shines.
Jeff Livingston