Thank you! I'm really only a novice & not questioning you just absorbing. I'll try it too & perhaps bring the cb closer.
Best way to shoot this shot
- Thread starter Canadian cue
- Start date
This is NOT a novice shot.
I was beating myself up for missing this shot at the time but when I got home and started practicing it I realized that it deserved more respect than I had given it. It is being frozen to the rail which I find makes the shot difficult. If you stick to the center axis on this shot you have the most repeatable results no matter if you hit it thicker or thinner, rail first. When you start adding spin your results can change drastically depending on where you hit first. In the z shot the side pocket scratch looms large as well as when you try going forward the corner pocket scratch is also very possible. I do like the results of the slightly below center with inside but you have to hit this shot perfect, so difficult to do consistently. What I should have done was pick a different ball to make my way back to the 8 with. I had three easy shots to that corner, I picked the the wrong ball to go back up table with.
Thanks again for the responses.
Thanks again for the responses.
I'm always absorbing too. On the shot where you slightly grab rail first with low inside, then go to the side rail and spin up table, it looks like this....
https://youtu.be/FY6NEjrvvYc
The angle isn't as steep, but it works the same way.
Exactly. You gotta know your cue well, and the table, and have the stroke needed to pull it off.
I’ve been in a fair amount of action....if my opponent puts inside english on this shot...
...that is my best chance of losing.
...if he puts outside english on the shot....he can raise the bet.
CC, practise alternating ‘rail first’ and ‘ball first’ on this shot....
...don’t try to judge it in a rational manner...FEEL IT.
The cue ball has to hit the rail first and still be partly in the cushion when it hits the object ball. The ball is thrown back into the pocket.
Lots of players don't realize how far into the cushion the cue ball sinks.
And PT's advice is probably what you should follow. Get a feel for the shot -- if you think about the details you will run off the rails. And although it may be easier with inside, you need to be able to make it with outside as well in case of adverse traffic.
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Thanks for the link!
I immediately checked the link went down and potted those placements. Yes that angle is very friendly, I make that consistently.
As we know the first post had OB two diamonds up vs. one and CB dead table center and that makes it very challenging for sure.
Problem with your first diagram on left is, with the extreme high inside spin, if you don't hit it real good just very slightly ball first, you can fail to get the cue ball to the end rail and scratch in the corner or miss the shot entirely or if you accidentally catch is slightly rail first the cue ball just comes straight across the table and doesn't get up table.I like these two options. Using top inside (left example) is easier to hit than using bottom inside (right example). I shoot both at a normal medium speed, probably a touch firmer when shooting the bottom inside, which is a great shot to know when the 3-rail option is blocked. This shot requires the cb to slightly hit the rail 1st, I mean barely rail first before hitting the ob.
If I were to shoot the Z shot with low outside (not shown), I'd stroke it medium soft and aim to hit the ob a little thick. But if you don't catch it thick enough that side pocket scratch bites hard. On a Diamond table I favor the 3-rail with top inside. On a slow barbox with shag felt I favor the Z shot with low outside.
The zig zag shot you don't hit with outside spin, you actually hit it with extreme bottom inside spin and make sure you hit it slightly rail first. The cue ball shoots straight across the table to the opposite side rail, but then the spin sucks the ball back up table for a good angle on your next ball, pretty much on the same path your diagram shows. Yes, it is clearly a high risk low percentage shot, but a beautiful shot when executed successfully. The diagram you show on the right, with outside bottom, unless the cue ball gets past the side pocket on it's first trip across the table, it will never get back up table off the opposite side rail with the spin it has on it.
After re-reading your post, it appears your diagram on the right is suggesting bottom inside, my mistake.
Depending on your skill level, it might be best to accept that you're just not going to get great shape on the next ball and cinch it, planning your safety strategy for the next ball if you don't end up with a makeable cue shot on it.
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Now THIS is what the forum is all about! Thanks fellas!
This ^^^ just make sure to get past the side pocket. I try to hit the OB a
little fuller with low outside, just before hitting the rail. More chance of
scratching in the side if you hit the rail and the ball simultaneously. $.02
I usually just take the harder shot on the next ball. Most of the time just going back and forth across the table to get back near the side pocket as the original object ball.
If I'm feeling pissed and don't care I'll hit mostly bottom left, more left than bottom.
With your last ball frozen on the rail, I think you are better off to just play for a slightly harder shot (essentially the same shot you are shooting on the first ball) than play for perfect shape.
If I'm feeling pissed and don't care I'll hit mostly bottom left, more left than bottom.
With your last ball frozen on the rail, I think you are better off to just play for a slightly harder shot (essentially the same shot you are shooting on the first ball) than play for perfect shape.
I like these two options. Using top inside (left example) is easier to hit than using bottom inside (right example). I shoot both at a normal medium speed, probably a touch firmer when shooting the bottom inside, which is a great shot to know when the 3-rail option is blocked. This shot requires the cb to slightly hit the rail 1st, I mean barely rail first before hitting the ob.
If I were to shoot the Z shot with low outside (not shown), I'd stroke it medium soft and aim to hit the ob a little thick. But if you don't catch it thick enough that side pocket scratch bites hard. On a Diamond table I favor the 3-rail with top inside. On a slow barbox with shag felt I favor the Z shot with low outside.
Neither one of these is an easy shot. And the second diagram is pretty much not doable, unless you have a stroke like Mike Massey. And even then I'm betting against anyone getting the cue ball to follow anything like the path shown here. Either of these shots takes a high level player to execute with any degree of confidence. That's why I recommend for most players to shoot this shot like Patrick Johnson recommended, back and forth across the table (leaving the cue ball maybe one diamond or more below the side pocket) and accept a longer shot on the next ball which is on the rail and close enough to be made fairly easily. But what do I know!
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Neither one of these is an easy shot. And the second diagram is pretty much not doable, unless you have a stroke like Mike Massey. And even then I'm betting against anyone getting the cue ball to follow anything like the path shown here. Either of these shots takes a high level player to execute with any degree of confidence. That's why I recommend for most players to shoot this shot like Patrick Johnson recommended, back and forth across the table (leaving the cue ball maybe one diamond or more below the side pocket) and accept a longer shot on the next ball which is on the rail and close enough to be made fairly easily. But what do I know!
To each their own I suppose. But that 2nd one is very doable, maybe the cb path off that right cushion should be more toward about the second diamond down on the left rail. Anyway, the op didn't ask for the easiest shot, lol. He asked for shots to get the cb to the 8. If you feel confident shooting the 8 from where the cinch leaves you, provided your speed is perfect, then by all means go that route. Either that or just play safe and give your opponent a tough leave on the 8.
One thing is certain....you gotta know your limitations before attempting a good stroke shot like either of the ones I diagrammed.
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How close is, say Buddy Hall's (or Kid Delicious) clock system going to be for determining cueball path assuming you hit OB first. I am guessing the OB being frozen monkeys up the system, but it would be handy to have a good mental reference to go by, and I have never really set that shot up and specifically practiced it...
If the cue ball is in the center of the table (between the side pockets) I'm going to bet against that last position.
I think the condition of the cloth would have an impact on my decision. But put me down for a stun shot back and forth to near where the OB was to start, leaving the longer shot. Maybe some draw just to make sure I didn’t accidentally drift down table.
I think the second diagram has disaster written all over it. Including missing the OB.
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I think the second diagram has disaster written all over it. Including missing the OB.
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