14.1 no conflict..

The Renfro

The Renfro

Outsville.com
Silver Member
Run 14 balls and leave one on the table... break the balls open and continue to shoot regardless of pocketing the 15th ball... Removes the luck of getting a little less than perfect on your break ball... Just not sure if you get ball in hand behind the line if you get a bad roll on the break and scratch......

Chris
 
Using these rules in straight pool I should be able to run my age, I still will have trouble running my IQ.

Lol


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The Renfro said:
Run 14 balls and leave one on the table... break the balls open and continue to shoot regardless of pocketing the 15th ball... Removes the luck of getting a little less than perfect on your break ball... Just not sure if you get ball in hand behind the line if you get a bad roll on the break and scratch......

Chris
Click to expand...

Could be an ok way to learn straight pool for a newcomer to the game,
I guess. For more advanced players I don't really like the idea, but then again I'm a bit of a purist when it comes to straight pool. Getting perfect on the break ball is almost the entire "heart and soul" of the game, and one of the aspects that keep me interested after many years. Without the requirement that you must get nice position on the break ball, pattern play becomes a bit less important, and to me thats one of the most interesting aspects of straight pool.

If you want to learn straight pool, and you are a good shotmaker, but not good at getting positon on the break ball, you could have the option to get ball in hand behind the headstring if your angle is bad on the breakball. That gets rid of the safing on the full rack, which many players find boring (not me though). To me it's always exciting to see who gets the first shot after the safety battle. For a player of at least moderate skill, straight pool is a game of risk management, playing within your limits and patience, as well as shotmaking and reading the rack. If you smash the rack wide open every time, many of these aspects become much less important and it all becomes a game of staying in the middle of the table and shotmaking. That would be boring to me, but I realise that not everybody likes the kind of straight pool game that I like.
 
There's a great No Conflict golf course in my area,
they took a lot of the hassle and debate out of it by removing the opening drive and having
everyone just putt from the same starting position. It's actually a lot of fun!
 
CreeDo said:
There's a great No Conflict golf course in my area,
they took a lot of the hassle and debate out of it by removing the opening drive and having
everyone just putt from the same starting position. It's actually a lot of fun!
Click to expand...

Makes the game go quicker too. Don't they call that "Miniature Golf"?

Between two equally bad players (I'm in that category) I can see getting ball in hand on the break shot. You still have to pocket the ball and hit the rack but you get to see what it's like IF you'd gotten perfect position. But it seems that not having to pocket the break ball would just encourage what I've come to call Smash Ball.
 
The Renfro said:
Run 14 balls and leave one on the table... break the balls open and continue to shoot regardless of pocketing the 15th ball... Removes the luck of getting a little less than perfect on your break ball... Just not sure if you get ball in hand behind the line if you get a bad roll on the break and scratch......

Chris
Click to expand...

I think the shape on the break ball is a lot of what 14.1 is about. Do not think that would take off as anything more than a practice game.
 
elvicash said:
I think the shape on the break ball is a lot of what 14.1 is about. Do not think that would take off as anything more than a practice game.
Click to expand...

I say NO WAY!! Great idea for practice thought.

To paraphrase a few of the above quotes: getting position on the break ball in 14.1 is the heart and soul of the game. 14 balls made and 1 left over. I don't want to see this game changed! :eek:
 
boogeyman said:
I say NO WAY!! Great idea for practice thought.

To paraphrase a few of the above quotes: getting position on the break ball in 14.1 is the heart and soul of the game. 14 balls made and 1 left over. I don't want to see this game changed! :eek:
Click to expand...

Getting shape on the break ball starts immeadiatly after the break shot. IMO setting up for that and continuing the run after the break is the whole purpose of the game. In my high run of 32 (small I know) my biggest accomishment was shape on the break ball and then making it during the break shot, twice. IMO it's a pretty serious feat which makes this such a serious game
 
It would no longer be 14.1 and would destroy the best part of the game. If this thread is tounge in cheek then I guess nevermind.
 
Any rule-set you use has to be tailored for a specific skill-range. If you're talking about beginner/intermediate players, I see nothing wrong with these rules. In fact, it'd probably be more enjoyable than standard 14.1. If you're talking about advanced/expert level players, no way. For professional-caliber players, it's arguable that the rules are already too one-sided. A game like this would routinely see runs in the 100s with high-runs exceeding 1,000.
 
StraightPoolIU said:
It would no longer be 14.1 and would destroy the best part of the game. If this thread is tounge in cheek then I guess nevermind.
Click to expand...

I agree. The whole concept behind 14.1 is "patterns that wind down to position on the break ball." Throw that away, and now there are no patterns (other than one or two balls ahead to break up clusters) and it's essentially a "free for all" shooting contest. "Just shoot at a bunch of balls in any random fashion that you like."

Heck, this would legitimize the facepalm tactic of "9-ball straight pool" (where short-rack rotation players try their hand at 14.1, only to show the cue ball going all over the place in short-rack rotation style). The idea is not to handicap the game to correspond to the player; but rather the player learn how to play the game correctly in the first place.

I disagree with those that say this may be a good practice game. It's not. Why practice "shooting a bunch of balls" if you're never going to learn how to "get" the root concept of straight pool to begin with? Just so you can "boast" some high run number?

There's more to a high straight pool run number than "just a bunch of balls shot without a miss." Those that think so, are truly completely missing the point.

-Sean <-- looked at his calendar, noticed it's not April 1st, and hopes he wasn't "had."
 
The Renfro said:
Run 14 balls and leave one on the table... break the balls open and continue to shoot regardless of pocketing the 15th ball... Removes the luck of getting a little less than perfect on your break ball... Just not sure if you get ball in hand behind the line if you get a bad roll on the break and scratch......

Chris
Click to expand...

Good going, Chris; you have people responding as if you were serious.

But, actually, with what you suggest, there's no need to leave that last ball out before you rack. Just shoot all 15 in, re-rack, break them open and continue. Then, son of a gun, you'll have the game called "Continuous Pool" that preceded the invention of 14.1 Continuous in 1910!
 
AtLarge said:
Good going, Chris; you have people responding as if you were serious.

But, actually, with what you suggest, there's no need to leave that last ball out before you rack. Just shoot all 15 in, re-rack, break them open and continue. Then, son of a gun, you'll have the game called "Continuous Pool" that preceded the invention of 14.1 Continuous in 1910!
Click to expand...

Yep, I guess he got us! (I had a passing suspicion, hence my "not April 1st; hope I wasn't 'had'" comment.)

Anyway, it's interesting to see how 14.1 progressed -- first, it was smash all 15 open. Then, it was leave a ball out for a break ball, but the cue ball had to contact two rails after pocketing the break ball before contacting the rack. And finally, Jerome Keough's modification to remove the two-rail contact requirement for the cue ball to arrive at the game we play today.

-Sean
 
sfleinen said:
Yep, I guess he got us! (I had a passing suspicion, hence my "not April 1st; hope I wasn't 'had'" comment.)

Anyway, it's interesting to see how 14.1 progressed -- first, it was smash all 15 open. Then, it was leave a ball out for a break ball, but the cue ball had to contact two rails after pocketing the break ball before contacting the rack. And finally, Jerome Keough's modification to remove the two-rail contact requirement for the cue ball to arrive at the game we play today.

-Sean
Click to expand...

Was it a smash and run game initially? I've heard that before, but I remember reading a very old New York Times article that posted years ago, where Jerome Keogh suggests the rule update to what we now know as 14.1. If I remember rightly, he indicated such a change would allow for much longer runs which would set apart the top players and would be good for spectators. I inferred from this comment that they were playing safe breaks at the start of every rack. Here is the article I am referencing, but I can't open it as I guess I must have an account. Perhaps someone with an account can check?

http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive...669D946196D6CF

I get the feeling that the big opening break originated with games like 9 ball and possible 8 ball. I'd love to know either way.
 
Cameron Smith said:
Was it a smash and run game initially? I've heard that before, but I remember reading a very old New York Times article that posted years ago, where Jerome Keogh suggests the rule update to what we now know as 14.1. If I remember rightly, he indicated such a change would allow for much longer runs which would set apart the top players and would be good for spectators. I inferred from this comment that they were playing safe breaks at the start of every rack. Here is the article I am referencing, but I can't open it as I guess I must have an account. Perhaps someone with an account can check?

http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive...669D946196D6CF

I get the feeling that the big opening break originated with games like 9 ball and possible 8 ball. I'd love to know either way.
Click to expand...

I checked The Billiard Encyclopedia to see if it answered your question, but it does not say what happened after the 15th ball was pocketed and all the balls were re-racked. Nor do I have a Times account.
 
I have a feeling the OP's joke would have gone over a little better if he didn't wait 18 months after the original "No Conflict Rules" thread.
 
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