TheOne said:
Then I'm on the boat with you. I'm not so upset about the 1500 charge. Rather, the change after the announcement wthout any explanation is a bit disheartning. Perhaps there is method to this...umm...you know the word I'm looking for.
$1500 for the new round of qualifiers!
- Thread starter APA9
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Then I'm on the boat with you. I'm not so upset about the 1500 charge. Rather, the change after the announcement wthout any explanation is a bit disheartning. Perhaps there is method to this...umm...you know the word I'm looking for.
Poking around the IPT site, I see that the purse for the World Open is $3mil - which is 50% more than the $2mil listed for the North American Open. So it kinda makes sense that the qualifiers for the WO would be 50% higher than the qualifiers for the NAO.
*shrug*
*shrug*
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T
Timberly
Guest
That's the exact same thing I used to say in defense of the IPT but the constant changes and upping of entry fee's is starting to be nothing short of ridiculous.ScottW said:
Timberly said:BIG TIME bad analogy there. They don't spend millions out of their own pocket & they don't have one or two stake horses spending it... they have groups and companies DONATING it. THEN, when they get there.... they give themselves a hefty raise, have their choice of FREE medical benefits, and they get FULL RETIREMENT..... they go in spending millions of someone else's money and leave retiring on millions of OUR dollars.
Point blank, the CONSTANT changing of the "rules" of qualification from an alternate list to qualifying by a tourney to continually upping the entry fee's for the qualifier is BS. It doesn't matter if you like the IPT or not.... you can't deny that being told one thing, having another happen, being told one thing again, having another happen again, and so on and so on, isn't total BS.
I've said it before and I'll say it again... I want it to succeed... I'm all for the IPT, but they need to get their sh!t straight, make a decision, and stick with it.
I'm impressed Timberly, seriously. This is the strongest 'ANTI-party' comment you have ever stated on this board. Glad to see you no longer blinded like others.
T
Timberly
Guest
I never was "blinded", I've always tried to be realistic while also being hopeful. Jake is the epitome of blinded... always has been, always will be. If the IPT closed up tomorrow, 2 yrs from now Jake would still be sitting here telling us how great the IPT is.watchez said:
I'm still hopeful but I'm also getting fed up... In the past I've given the IPT the benefit of the doubt because I want it to work and I know that new endeavors go through growing pains.... with each passing day, each new change that negates promised things of the past and each new jacked up entry fee, my benefit of the doubt patience is wearing quite thin.
I'm just rather curious as to what the qualifiers will look like next year. There are going to be many surprises. Many will not be back and I believe that the list of those not returning will be surprising to many. This format is for the young and fit.ScottW said:
Many who were given the free pass this year will struggle to participate next year. They had better save what they make this year. It is going to be expensive.
watchez said:
There is one school of thought that the pool players around the world who are serious about their profession, want to play pool for their profession, do desire to participate in the IPT.
If they are blinded, then the only thing they are blinded to is the negative opinions which come from those who don't play pool professionally.
Every single pool player I know who, again, is serious about competing in a professional tour which has decent payouts is trying to participate in the IPT.
I am sitting on the outside, looking in, but I do not consider myself blinded. I have seen some changes since the IPT came to the fore that can affect a pool player's financial security, and that is why I, at this time, believe in the IPT vision. As a spectator, railbird, TV watcher, and the like, what the IPT does has no effect on my life whatsoever.
However, when I see pool players excited about competing in a professional tour, players coming out of retirement, roadsters transforming themselves to be tournament soldiers, and youngsters getting interested in advancing their skills set on a field of green, this reason and this reason alone is why the IPT, in my most humble opinion, is a good thing.
Maybe the IPT members who were "selected" to be on the tour should complain that the membership fee was reduced from $1,000 to $1. That is another sudden change that was instituted before the first tournament, the one in Vegas next month, begins.
JAM
I already made reference to the IPT in the past doing more than what it said. Yes they lowered membership from $1000 to $1, gave bonuses for racks run & 8 balls banked, etc. But in this instance, if they are changing the entry fees for qualifiers, the IPT is wrong. Period. End of discussion. Three rights don't make a wrong.
Unfortunately, pool players as a whole are not very smart. I would like to see one pool player stand up & put one of these local tournament directors 'on TV' for pulling out $10-$15 a player when they are advertising a tournament as added money. Pool players are quick witted when it comes to matching up & someone trying to get into their pocket. But they are slow when it comes to a tour/tournament in doing the same. I have the fear that the IPT will realize this (and looks like they already have). Let's see a IPT qualifier walk up to Deno or KT in Vegas, show him the rules where it says the qualifiers were $1000 and ask why they changed it to $1500. Then let's wait & hear what the public explanation is.
Unfortunately, pool players as a whole are not very smart. I would like to see one pool player stand up & put one of these local tournament directors 'on TV' for pulling out $10-$15 a player when they are advertising a tournament as added money. Pool players are quick witted when it comes to matching up & someone trying to get into their pocket. But they are slow when it comes to a tour/tournament in doing the same. I have the fear that the IPT will realize this (and looks like they already have). Let's see a IPT qualifier walk up to Deno or KT in Vegas, show him the rules where it says the qualifiers were $1000 and ask why they changed it to $1500. Then let's wait & hear what the public explanation is.
watchez said:
Good grief! Then, Watchez, show me the proof-positive where the IPT raised the qualifier entry fees after stating that every single qualifier from here ever after would be $1,000. I cannot show you proof-positive either way.
watchez said:
Good grief! What a stereotypical statement. A little prejudice, Watchez?
watchez said:
Must be a Midwestern thing, Watchez. Around my neck of the woods, the pool players are very cognizant of which tournaments have ADDED monies, which tournaments are GUARANTEED monies if they have 254 players in attendance, and which ones take out monies for green fees and the like.
watchez said:
Please enlighten the readers of this forum and display for all to see where the IPT stated that every qualifier entry fee forever more will be $1,000.
BTW, are you interested in competing on the IPT tour, or are you a spectator, pool enthusiast, or railbird? Is the reason you are discontent because you want to play pool professionally? How does the cost of the IPT qualifier entry fee affect you in your pool world? Just curious!
JAM
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watchez said:
So gas should still be fifty cents a gallon, movies a buck, TV should still be in black and white?
Changes happen. If you don't like them, that's kinda tough noogies.
Frankly, it's THEIR playground and if they want to make changes to the fee structure, it's their business. If people choose not to participate due to the changes, "voting with their wallets", that's their choice.
Just for the record I don't think anyone is claiming that the IPT said all qualifiers "forever" would be $1000, lets not start getting silly. The point is they clearly stated it would be $1000 for the world open, and they changed it effectively half way through a two tournament qualification process AFTER players had already bought into it and invested significant amounts of money.
The problem with these discussions is that the only people defending the IPT are the tour card players who don't have to PAY these fees, or the fans that just want to watch pool on TV and are never going to play either.
It's so sad to see how the lure of vast amounts of money changes peoples principles.
The problem with these discussions is that the only people defending the IPT are the tour card players who don't have to PAY these fees, or the fans that just want to watch pool on TV and are never going to play either.
It's so sad to see how the lure of vast amounts of money changes peoples principles.
ScottW said:
It has been on the website for over 6 months, I saw it many times, they have now changed it of course (hence the increase and the number of threads). I was looking at it just a few weeks ago as I had always planned on entering the world qualifiers. I also know somebody who asked <wont say names> but a certain person why it was increased and got it confirmed it was due to increase in prize money. I also remember hearing it on the Audio on the website, wouldn't be suprised if this gets deleted now too lol.
Just to make sure that the end of year entries don't increase I want to remind everybody of this quote from the Audio:
"Jake just got a chance to listen to the latest IPT Audio and one interesting point that has been missed was the amounts for the 2007 Qualifiers.
The end of year qualifiers will be the same amout $2000, PLUS the IPT will offer the same deal as the open events. If you only pay half $1000 you can still enter but will only get half your 2007 winnings. These qualifiers will be all around the world."
Anyone want to bet that the 100k tour card won't remain the same price as stated?
Sorry, I was just going off of what others have stated in this thread. Since you didn't single out their posts, I figured their facts to be true. Sounds true to me.JAM said:
No, not prejudice. I have lots of friends that are pool players. I know plenty more. Most are not that intelligent. Sorry to burst your bubble. Some are intelligent. Those are the exception. That is why these tours get 75-100 players to play and then pay a tournament director $1000 to put names on a bracket board.JAM said:
How many ADDED money tournaments has Keith played in the past 6 months? I am simply curious how many there are on the East Coast.JAM said:
Well then they should make it $10,000. I am sure at least two people would still show up.JAM said:
Sorry I still can't draw my ball. I am working on it & my billiard coach thinks by Christmas it should come to me. But until then I still refuse to justify my 'being' by being the sidekick of a professional pool player. And I'll still choose to be a spectator, pool entusiast & railbird if I can join your club. That being said, it doesn't effect me that A-Rod makes 18 million a year but I can still talk about it. It doesn't effect me if someone is killed in Texas but I can still talk about it. It doesn't effect me that the sky is blue but I can still talk about it.JAM said:BTW, are you interested in competing on the IPT tour, or are you a spectator, pool enthusiast, or railbird? Is the reason you are discontent because you want to play pool professionally? How does the cost of the IPT qualifier entry fee affect you in your pool world? Just curious!
JAM
TheOne said:
By the same token, did the IPT ever say that qualifiers would be the EXACT same price for all tournaments?
TheOne said:
What's silly to you may not be silly to me. You are entitled to your opinion, as am I. It is evident that you are not content with the IPT tour. At every juncture, you have made your opinions known in an intelligent manner, the majority of the time, and that is okay.
TheOne said:
I respectfully disagree with your suggestion that the IPT "CLEARLY STATED" any such thing. Please provide any written or audio documentation for this assertion of yours rather than create a thread with the words "MORE LIES" in it, incinuating that the IPT has told an untruth.
TheOne said:
So, in essence, TheOne, you are upset because the increase of the entry fees will prevent you from participating on the IPT Tour. Considering your well-documented opinions about the IPT, I cannot imagine why you would want to expend any monies to be a part of this tour.
TheOne said:
I think this statement of yours is a little silly, but I guess that is only my opinion.
Let me state for the record that I am not a player, like you, TheOne. I have no financial interest in the IPT, other than to get my counterpart there in one piece. I do work for a living, and money doesn't change my principles. I have a great deal of work integrity and meet all of my deliverables. Vast amounts of money makes me work harder. This is why the pool players who are serious about playing pool professionally have given up smoking, are in the gyms getting in shape, have sought medical advice on improving their health, and want with every ounce of their being to be a part of the IPT tour.
Let's see what has happened since the IPT came to the fore. Mike Sigel has come out of retirement and pocketed six figures for playing pool. Loree Jon Jones has also come out of retirement and pocketed six figures for playing pool. The BCA's Hall of Famers have pocketed $30,000 for attending the KOTH in Orlando. Forty-two invited players received at least $6,200 just for showing up in Orlando, win or lose. Many, like Efren Reyes, Francisco Bustamante, Marlon Manalo, Johnny Archer, and Nick Varner pocketed five figures for their good showing at KOTH in Orlando.
The IPT has garnered the interest of players who used to only play pool in regional events. Road players have taken to turn and are now competing like tournament soldiers, wanting to be a part of the IPT. The KOTH in Orlando is on TV here in America at a designated time. There are several multi-million-dollar tournaments occuring in the year 2006. Qualifiers before each of the multi-million-dollar tournaments, 25 in number, are being held in an effort to provide an opportunity for any living human being on the face of the earth to compete in. There is a tour website which provides live coverage of not only the tournaments, but the qualifiers as well for the inquiring minds who want to know. AND let's not forget that the first official event on the IPT touranment trail has not even happened yet, the one that pays out $350,000 for first place, the $2-million total purse.
The IPT may not be the ticket for every pool player in the world. However, the ones I have spoken to are very excited about this tour. It is not possible to please everyone, but for the pool players themselves, I have witnessed a great deal of enthusiasm for this tour to succeed.
JAM
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watchez said:
"Facts" is the key word here, Watchez. The majority of things I have read pertaining to the IPT are sucker-punches at Kevin Trudeau and Mike Sigel, the amount of the tournament qualifier entry fees, and the quality of the broadcast of the KOTH on OLN. I do not believe them to be factual or true. Rather, they are opinions, the majority of which are stated by those who do not desire to play pool professionally.
watchez said:
I may disagree with you on this point. I think the TDs are supposed to get paid for their efforts. It would be assine for them to run tournaments and pay for all of the tournament expenses out of their pocket. There have been many posts on this topic pertaining to the expenses a TD can incur, long-distance phone calls, gas getting to the venue sites, postage for mailings, lodging, et cetera. Have I forgotten anything about what a TD expends to run a tournament, Watchez?
watchez said:
LOL. I don't desire to put Keith on the butcher block to be cut up and sucker-punched, as he has in times gone by. However, if you're asking ME how many events I have attended in the last 6 months that have added monies, I'd have to say quite a few. I cannot imagine attending a tournament that does not have added monies and incurring expenses to get there, unless it is a local $20-entry-fee 9-ball tournament up the street from my home. Sometimes players like to get out there and practice. The horse has to get out of the barn and run sometimes.
watchez said:
Have you had any experience in running a pool tour? I would be interested in your thoughts on how to produce a tour as large as the IPT without expending monies out of your own pocket.
watchez said:
I can draw my ball, Watchez, quite well as a matter of fact! It's actually one of my best shots, but I do not currently play pool.
It is fine to have an intelligent discourse about the pros and cons of a tour, but I think the majority of the dissenters are non-pool players who do not desire to compete professionally. It is the players themselves who have an interest in having the IPT tour succeed. I do not know what the future holds for anyone, but so far I have seen the IPT follow through and put pool on the map, something nobody or no entity has been able to do in my lifetime. And it's about damn time, I say!
JAM
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Very well said Jam.
There really are only two people here who get a kick out of debating the IPT and taking the negative side. It is time to stop giving them any credence by responding to their inane arguments.
A year ago who would have thought that so many players would be in the IPT looking forward to this first Tournament?
Who would have thought that 25 qualifiers would have gone off without a hitch? That in itself is amazing.
Sure changes have been made as the IPT is growing. Nothing wrong with that. Had they not made changes where they were necessary would have been wrong.
Of course some people are just born nitpickers. They latch on to one little item and beat it to death.
It is time for you and Keith to rise above it, bask in the limelight, work him to death on 8-ball and get ready for Vegas. You will be rewarded for your hard work. It will be a true battle and no one will be taking any prisoners.
Jake
There really are only two people here who get a kick out of debating the IPT and taking the negative side. It is time to stop giving them any credence by responding to their inane arguments.
A year ago who would have thought that so many players would be in the IPT looking forward to this first Tournament?
Who would have thought that 25 qualifiers would have gone off without a hitch? That in itself is amazing.
Sure changes have been made as the IPT is growing. Nothing wrong with that. Had they not made changes where they were necessary would have been wrong.
Of course some people are just born nitpickers. They latch on to one little item and beat it to death.
It is time for you and Keith to rise above it, bask in the limelight, work him to death on 8-ball and get ready for Vegas. You will be rewarded for your hard work. It will be a true battle and no one will be taking any prisoners.
Jake
JAM said:
JAM, I think at this point I'll take a leaf out of sjm's book and leave all the IPT haters and lovers to battle it out. The fact is the IPT website stated the world open qualifiers would be $1000 entry, half way through a qualification process they have shifted the goal posts. I have stated many times in the past I play pool for the love and competition not for the cash, I can do that anytime I choose. I just don't like being made a fool of in life. I have spent a great deal of effort singing the IPT praises early days, and passing on info to other players - now for the second time they have made me (and others I know) look foolish. If I choose not to play in the IPT qualifiers money will be the last reason why.
Its a shame you only remember the improvements I have suggested with regards the IPT and have chose to ignore the praise I have also lavished on them. Your recent post is proof I guess that when somebody like yourself has such a strong opinion about a topic they only see the bad in what others say. I hope they don't mind me saying but Timberly, Jimmy and many others feel the same way as me, we are not able to say anything against the IPT without being labeled as a "hater". I have read much of what you say about the IPT, rarely do you write a sentence about the IPT without a large dollar value in it. I have yet to meet a player that isn't an IPT card holder that is happy with what they are being asked to do to live their dream.
I consider myself Pro IPT, but perhaps more importantly more Pro Pool than Pro my own interests.
I wonder if you would feel the same way if the prize money was slashed?
ScottW said:
I'm fairly certain that I saw the same thing. Naturally, no link exists because the entry fee isn't $1000 any more. I'm pretty sure that the schedule for the Reno tournament, as well as the others where non IPT members were allowed to play, mentioned a $199 entry fee for IPT Members and a $1000 entry fee for non IPT Members. Of course, as we all learned later, the $1000 entry fee was to a qualifier, not the event itself.