1949 Fats and Mosconi
- Thread starter billinboston
- Start date
It's easy to say that when your only video of him was in his 70s and upward.
One of the shots he fired in on TV was a cross-side bank that he had to really spike in with low-left to shorten it up (about a diamond's worth). He called out "I ain't missed one of these since World War I" and then split the pocket.
I'll agree that his primary schtick was entertainment, but I imagine he was a ferocious competitor in the early part of the 20th century. The shots he popped in effortlessly showed an incredible amount of knowledge, no B player is making those shots.
I heard that Willie once said "Every time Fats opens his mouth I make money'
or something like that.
or something like that.
https://www.onepocket.org/61JohnsonCityLeaderBoard.htm
Since Fats played in the 1961 one pocket tournament at Johnston City I wonder whether a detailed record of the event exists. Vevis apparently won the tournament.
Since Fats played in the 1961 one pocket tournament at Johnston City I wonder whether a detailed record of the event exists. Vevis apparently won the tournament.
That's pretty much word for word what he said to Howard Cosell.
I think Fats finished third and it was the only year he played in it (Vevis did win). But Fats came to JC every year to gamble and see all his old buddies. He was close with Lassiter, Cokes, Shriver and the older crowd. He was not so close to the Straight Pool guys like Crane. He didn't really care for anyone who wouldn't gamble.
billinboston
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20 players ? Even if there were 50 player’s... still a compliment to fatty
There is a video of him shooting banks ... he misses a lot... but he makes a hell of a lot of the shots too
And you can tell that the guy knows what he’s doing. If you were a so so player in one pocket in 1970, Ronnie was known for giving insane weight ... like 10-4 ..... obviously at that time, fatty was respected enough by Ronnie to only give fats pretty much the same as he gave any good one pocket player... a ball or 2
There is a video of him shooting banks ... he misses a lot... but he makes a hell of a lot of the shots too
And you can tell that the guy knows what he’s doing. If you were a so so player in one pocket in 1970, Ronnie was known for giving insane weight ... like 10-4 ..... obviously at that time, fatty was respected enough by Ronnie to only give fats pretty much the same as he gave any good one pocket player... a ball or 2
I think there were only 15 or 16 players in that first JC tourney. Ronnie would give up huge games but usually always got the break in return. Most people considered the break to be worth two balls, but Ronnie told me in confidence it was worth four balls to him.
That should answer the question of whether he could play then because that's an impressive group of one pocket players. That is probably one of very few tournaments he played in. Didn't benefit him to show his speed when he was trying to negotiate games.
Master of Psychology
What fatty did, is what teachers do to their students. By throwing stuff there way, they learn how/when/why/ and in what way they react to the situation, no different than a Psychologist figuring out how your brain works. Once he did this, he knew very well how different people would act and react when he put em in a $$$$ situation. Evelyn said, if Fats talked into a psychologists office, by the time he walked out, Fats would of had the psychologist figured out better than the other way around. Evelyn said, ''he'd be wearing his purse strings". Quote Ev.
What fatty did, is what teachers do to their students. By throwing stuff there way, they learn how/when/why/ and in what way they react to the situation, no different than a Psychologist figuring out how your brain works. Once he did this, he knew very well how different people would act and react when he put em in a $$$$ situation. Evelyn said, if Fats talked into a psychologists office, by the time he walked out, Fats would of had the psychologist figured out better than the other way around. Evelyn said, ''he'd be wearing his purse strings". Quote Ev.
This! So much this.
I play decent one hole but tried my chances against an absolute ball runner and got my a$$ handed to me. I couldn't leave him anything that even remotely looked like a shot. If I did, he'd make it and run out.
*Lesson* Don't challenge high caliber players.
I play decent one hole but tried my chances against an absolute ball runner and got my a$$ handed to me. I couldn't leave him anything that even remotely looked like a shot. If I did, he'd make it and run out.
*Lesson* Don't challenge high caliber players.
I didn't know that Cayton was involved in those matches. I remember his work as a boxing promoter.
The story of him beating Richie was that he beat him out of a few hundred each day over a period of a couple of weeks. He would come up with an excuse and leave on the days that Richie was playing good and play as long as he could stand on the days that Richie wasn't playing good.
He was going home when he left the pool room while Richie was living out of a hotel.
The version of the story I recall goes something like this.
I think it was Johnston City and Richie was in non-stop action. Fats, knowing this, would sleep all day. Then, he'd saunter in late at night and challenge Richie to a game. I'm not sure but it may have been something like $200 game and Fats may have gotten something like a ball.
Fats, fresh as daisy, and Richie tired as a dog, would play and Fats would end up winning a few games for like $800 to $1200 a night. But he did this night after night for a couple of weeks. All told Fats took Richie for something like $20,000.
Lou Figueroa
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I was there for part of it (yes, it was in Johnston City). Fats would call ahead and see what condition Richie was in before driving over (Dowell was a short drive away). He would usually show up late at night and watch while Richie was playing someone and Richie would be itching to get his money back from Fats. They played 8-7 for 300 a game (a big bet in the mid 60's) from beginning to end. He was beating Richie for anywhere from four to eight games each time they played. Fats had Richie's nose wide open. They must have played ten to twelve times over a period of three weeks. At last count Richie had lost 26K and had to borrow 500 from Fats to get home on. He actually repaid Fatty at Beenie's poolroom a couple of years later.
P.S. Richie could really play then too! He was one of the best 9-Ball players in the country (top five for sure) and could run 100 balls on shooting ability alone. Many games went down to the last two balls. Richie and Fats both needing one. It seemed like Fats won every game that ended that way.
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Correct me if I'm wrong but I get the impression the reason so many people thought and continue to think he couldn't play is because he wanted them to think that.
I had an Uncle who lived in that area and I think Fats' house in Dowell had an extra room added which had a pool table in it. I suspect he didn't just show up cold at the Jansco bar. He had warmed up at home before going.
Correct me if I'm wrong but I get the impression the reason so many people thought and continue to think he couldn't play is because he wanted them to think that.
I had an Uncle who lived in that area and I think Fats' house in Dowell had an extra room added which had a pool table in it. I suspect he didn't just show up cold at the Jansco bar. He had warmed up at home before going.
I would agree with all of this’ !
I was in JC near the end of Fatty playing Richie.
I had just come in from the road and found Richie in the bar. I sat down with him and he told me how Fats was punishing him. He kept saying over and over "everyone says that Fats can't play, Fats can't play".
Well he learned otherwise.
I spent a lot of time with Fatty at JC watching him play and match up.
He truly could play very well and almost always got the money.
He also helped me in Evansville, IL to get a game with Blackie LeSure who I beat for $1000. playing even one pocket.
After I started making cues I got on a plane to Louisville for the trade show.
I was going coach. Fatty was sitting in First Class. As I walked down the aisle Fatty said "Hello Billy" come sit with me. The attendant said OK. Try that today!
As we were talking Fatty said he was returning from a TV show and pulled out a check for 35K to show me.
Later in Louisville we would walk around the show together.
We were walking down the aisle when a pretty little Blonde woman approached Fats and asked for an Autograph. Without hesitation Fats pulled out his rubber stamp and stamped her right on the forehead. She had this incredulous look on her face as she walked away.
It broke me up completely.
Those of you that only know of Fatty by watching TV don't have a clue about how well he banked and played one pocket. I don't know how many 2 rail end rail banks I have seen him make for the money. All the while cracking jokes and telling stories.
He was a real legend and a generous man with both his time and money and did more to put pool in the spotlight than just about anyone.
Miss him a lot.
Bill S.
I had just come in from the road and found Richie in the bar. I sat down with him and he told me how Fats was punishing him. He kept saying over and over "everyone says that Fats can't play, Fats can't play".
Well he learned otherwise.
I spent a lot of time with Fatty at JC watching him play and match up.
He truly could play very well and almost always got the money.
He also helped me in Evansville, IL to get a game with Blackie LeSure who I beat for $1000. playing even one pocket.
After I started making cues I got on a plane to Louisville for the trade show.
I was going coach. Fatty was sitting in First Class. As I walked down the aisle Fatty said "Hello Billy" come sit with me. The attendant said OK. Try that today!
As we were talking Fatty said he was returning from a TV show and pulled out a check for 35K to show me.
Later in Louisville we would walk around the show together.
We were walking down the aisle when a pretty little Blonde woman approached Fats and asked for an Autograph. Without hesitation Fats pulled out his rubber stamp and stamped her right on the forehead. She had this incredulous look on her face as she walked away.
It broke me up completely.
Those of you that only know of Fatty by watching TV don't have a clue about how well he banked and played one pocket. I don't know how many 2 rail end rail banks I have seen him make for the money. All the while cracking jokes and telling stories.
He was a real legend and a generous man with both his time and money and did more to put pool in the spotlight than just about anyone.
Miss him a lot.
Bill S.
Thanks for adding more value to this thread in one post than 97% of the other posters have combined.