2014 us open unpaid prize money

Poolplaya9 said:
I agree that Jay is one of the good guys in the industry, one of the very best. But when you know someone is a liar and a thief with a long and proven track record of such, you don't support them. And working for or with them is supporting them. It was a big mistake.

Had he insisted on an escrow for the prize funds then it would have been ok, because the great risk for thievery would have been removed. And it would have been doing a great thing for the players at the same time, so win/win all the way around. But he chose to "take Barry's word" on it contrary to what ALL evidence and common sense says you should do. It was a mistake, a big one. He already more or less owned up to it above, so not sure why you feel the need to defend what was clearly a horrible choice that he even acknowledges to a great extent.

I was not in any way trying to run Jay into the ground, and was mostly trying to say that we all collectively have to stop supporting Barry and any other thief, and we collectively have to stop "taking their word" when their track record is suspect to the say the very least, and we all collectively have to start insisting on prize funds being escrowed. Jay is still one of the best there is, and like the rest of us, he sometimes makes mistakes, even big ones. Hopefully this was a good learning moment for us all that we stop supporting these thieves in any way.
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Well, there isn't much I can say to combat your post. I can't disagree with you other than I believe that Jay "Wanted" to believe it and also felt that if he wasn't involved it could have been a real shambles on the tourney side as well as the back end and did it not only out of belief that all was going to be fine but to give the event the best possible chance of success. Yeah, I he is probably kicking himself and sounds like he is not afraid to say he feels like a sucker for buying into it. I think we are on the same page PP9.
 
Not getting paid a joke?

I wasn't at the Open but watched it on the stream. I watched Barry giving a speech during the event, where he made a sarcastic joke about players not getting paid. It brought back memories when Kevin Treadeau said he couldn't understand why all the players that were intending on playing his events were worried about not getting paid, before he screwed them too.It's a shame pool is where its at now. I used to go to the Open every year. I stay home now and watch it on live stream, half to see the great matches and half to see how many and which players are getting screwed. I notice he makes sure players like Shane, Archer and others he knows not to screw over, don't have a problem getting their part. He either needs to post the money in Escrow or just stop completely. Another sad year in pool for the US Open. :(
 
bfdlad said:
I can't disagree with you other than I believe that Jay "Wanted" to believe it...
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Agreed. He let the best of intentions allow him to make the worst of decisions. We all do it at times. My posts weren't intended to slam Jay or single him out, they were intended as a reminder for us all not to allow hope and desire to overrule history and track record, or blind trust to overrule common sense, and that supporting thieves in any way at all is almost always a horrible idea on a number of levels.
 
jay helfert said:
That's okay, I deserve it for trusting him to keep his word. I should know better by now. Just for the record my main motivation this past year was to make sure the U.S. Open was run properly for the sake of all the players, many traveling long distances to get there. I think I succeeded in making that happen. I was given assurances that there would be no problem with prize money payouts this year, just like last year when everybody was paid fairly promptly. All seemed to go well on this account also, until I began to get e-mails regarding a player who is a close friend of mine and who remained partially unpaid.

You and Lou can knock me to your heart's content if it makes you feel any better. I did what I did in the interest of our sport and I won't make excuses for being there. I lost more money that week (in the stock market) then I made by working there. :frown:
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I only questioned your choice of words 'beginning'. 40 years is longer than a beginning. Kudos for you to try to help the players and obviously there were no issues from them about how the event was run.

The only assurance I would be comfortable with is if the money was posted. Keep it on simple pool terms. Anything else and the pool world sees what happens.

And here is a few free stock tips for you - DXCM, CVS, RTRX - you can thank me later.
 
This is a VERY important year to Barry and to the history of the US Open 9-Ball. Barry would be crushed if players told him there was a boycott unless the money was secured.

It has been explained the reason for slow pay is that checks come in late from players, sponsors etc and that it takes a little while for all the money to hit the bank. So Barry needs to have a deadline for everything. Maybe other than gate. Entry fees and sponsor money in by the end of July lets say. That way the money should be secured ahead of time. Maybe that's the answer. OR maybe I am just delusional. I know what most are going to say I am. :)
 
itsfroze said:
Maybe a better question is what’s your agenda....

You seem to have a lot to say about what Jay should and shouldn’t have done.
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My agenda is to see thieves prevented from being thieves, and hoping that others would do the same. Have a problem with that?

Anybody that chooses to run an event for a promoter with a long and extensive track record as a liar and thief and a mega history of non/slow payment of prizes, without insisting on the prize fund being escrowed, was at best cavalier and derelict in their judgement and duties, and at worst a part of the problem instead of a part of the solution.

I don't have a lot to say about Jay. In fact, I have very little to say. Jay is one of the best there is in the industry, period. He does the right thing almost every single time and has about as good a record as anybody out there, and better than 99%. He made a huge judgement error this time (like we all have), and has admitted as much. Not much to say at all, and all fact.

The take away here, if you don't get it yet, is that when somebody has the horrible history and track record that Barry does, the only way to get the lying and thievery to change is for everyone involved (tournament director, officials, players, fans) to refuse to participate until the funds are truly guaranteed. And the only way to truly guarantee funds is with escrow.

I know Jay had good intentions. I know that he wanted to just run a good tournament and hope and pray that Barry did his part on actually paying out and on time, regardless of his horrible track record in that regard, but it wasn't the right approach. When you care about your reputation, and care about whether players get paid or not and whether it is in a timely manner, and when you care about helping to stop lying and thievery, the best thing is to refuse to participate and let Barry know why. Trust me, if nobody would participate unless the funds were in escrow, Barry would put the funds in escrow. The only thing that means more to Barry than being able to screw people is being able to be in the limelight and thinking he is getting the public's adoration.
 
bfdlad said:
This is a VERY important year to Barry and to the history of the US Open 9-Ball. Barry would be crushed if players told him there was a boycott unless the money was secured.

It has been explained the reason for slow pay is that checks come in late from players, sponsors etc and that it takes a little while for all the money to hit the bank. So Barry needs to have a deadline for everything. Maybe other than gate. Entry fees and sponsor money in by the end of July lets say. That way the money should be secured ahead of time. Maybe that's the answer. OR maybe I am just delusional. I know what most are going to say I am. :)
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Terms @ Net 90? bullshit. i was told @ 2 weeks, as well as 5 days prior, that all players' entries had been paid in full. i can't vouch for the vendors' invoices.

yet, i couldn't get an answer regarding WHEN or HOW the pmts would be issued?

good thing the Ko's didn't show....
 
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itsfroze said:

and who are you ?
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It's immaterial to the discussion. But before you think I am anonymous and not known to anybody on here, not that that would matter in the least or make any difference whatsoever to this discussion, plenty of people on here know me in "real life".
 
bfdlad said:
This is a VERY important year to Barry and to the history of the US Open 9-Ball. Barry would be crushed if players told him there was a boycott unless the money was secured.

It has been explained the reason for slow pay is that checks come in late from players, sponsors etc and that it takes a little while for all the money to hit the bank. So Barry needs to have a deadline for everything. Maybe other than gate. Entry fees and sponsor money in by the end of July lets say. That way the money should be secured ahead of time. Maybe that's the answer. OR maybe I am just delusional. I know what most are going to say I am. :)
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Here is a solution. Set up the escrow account prior to accepting entry fees. All "guaranteed added" money is to be deposited into the escrow account before it is claimed as guaranteed. If you don't have the money, then it isn't guaranteed. Entry fees are to be deposited into the escrow account daily as they are received. Have the escrow account be monitored and administered by someone known and trusted like Jay Helfert, Mark Griffin, or AzBilliard's own Mike Howerton or Jerry Forsyth, and if at all possible, publicly viewable as well.

At any time, whoever is monitoring the account can see whether or not the amount in the account is equal to the total of whatever money is claimed as being guaranteed plus the number of paid sign ups to date. If it isn't, you have a problem. A real big problem.

As to your suggestion that Barry would be crushed if the players boycotted unless the full prize fund was escrowed? He shouldn't be crushed in the least or expect any less as he knows that it is 100% fully deserved. I mean who in their right mind could really blame them? Not Barry of all people. The players are out of their minds if a large number of them don't get together (and hopefully all of them) and demand exactly that or that they will be boycotting. And so is the WPA if they don't also demand the full prize fund being escrowed in order to receive their sanctioning again.
 
leminhnam said:
I have not yet been contacted by any US OPEN officials
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itsfroze said:
Q-Master Billiards

Address: Arrowhead Plaza Shopping Center, 5612-A Princess Anne Road, Virginia Beach, VA 23462
Phone (757) 499-8900 <---------------Barry is there most days.
Hours:

Open today · 10:00 am – 2:00 am EST


1) wire transfers take 1 hour & 1 email correspondence
2) who is in Newport News tonight @ Q Masters?
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I have a question. How is this guy still allowed to run this tournament and why are players still playing in it if you have to chase him down to possibly get paid?
 
PINKLADY said:
itsfroze said:
Q-Master Billiards

Address: Arrowhead Plaza Shopping Center, 5612-A Princess Anne Road, Virginia Beach, VA 23462
Phone (757) 499-8900 <---------------Barry is there most days.
Hours:

Open today · 10:00 am – 2:00 am EST


1) wire transfers take 1 hour & 1 email correspondence
2) who is in Newport News tonight @ Q Masters?
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My friend living in the States called twice but nobody picking up the phone
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Poolplaya9 said:
I'm not saying you didn't have good intentions or are a horrible person or anything like, as we all make mistakes. But I also want to call a spade a spade. You dropped the ball on this one, badly. Live and learn (hopefully).
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Wow hold on a minute. You make some good points but saying Jay dropped the ball is not. Jay is just an employee TD and Barry is his employer. Money/ finance is controlled by Barry. The blame falls 100% on Barry unless someone can prove that he has a partner or accomplice who is involved in his conman antics . You are inferring that Jay is somehow guilty by association which is absurd. What next ? Blaming those who attended the event or those who paid for PPV for supporting the event ?
No wonder people blame Azers for Team USA losing Mosconi Cup.
It is convenient to scapegoat Jay when Barry is not around to take the bullets. I will start a bullet proof vest business cos the way blame is gratuitously dished out by trigger happy folks, I can make tonnes of money :)


itsfroze said:
Jay didn't drop the ball, he ran a fine tournament, I agree.
You've got to lay the blame where it belongs PP9
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+1 correct correct
 
Roberta just PMed me asking my email to pass on to Barry on Monday US time :)


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