9 Ball Roll Out Situation

Island Drive

Island Drive

Otto/Dads College Roommate/Cleveland Browns
Silver Member
After the break.... the only ball that spots during a roll out situation is the 9.
If the shooter says ''roll out'' & intentionally hits the 9 off table, would his opponent get ball in hand?
Rules say No.
 
If you mean jumped ball off the table and not pocketed then it's a foul per BCA rules.

5. PUSH OUT. The player who shoots the shot immediately after a legal break may play a push out in an attempt to move the cue ball into a better position for the option that follows. On a push out, the cue ball is not required to contact any object ball nor any rail, but all other foul rules still apply. The player must announce his intention of playing a push out before the shot, or the shot is considered to be a normal shot. Any ball pocketed on a push out does not count and remains pocketed except the 9-ball. Following a legal push out, the incoming player is permitted to shoot from that position or to pass the shot back to the player who pushed out. A push out is not considered to be a foul as long as no rule (except rules 7. and 8.) is violated. An illegal push out is penalized according to the type of foul committed. After a player scratches on the break shot, the incoming player cannot play a push out.

10. OBJECT BALLS JUMPED OFF THE TABLE. An unpocketed ball is considered to be driven off the table if it comes to rest other than on the bed of the table. It is a foul to drive an object ball off the table. The jumped object ball(s) is not respotted (exception: if the object ball is the 9-ball, it is respotted) and play continues.


If you're using "off the table" to mean pocketed though, then absolutely not a foul and comes up fairly frequently actually.
 
I thought so too, but I talked with HOF referee Tom before I posted and he said.... no foul.
Makes sense, but gamblers wouldn't go for it, that's for sure.
 
Island Drive said:
Slide... WPA rules say it not a foul...
Click to expand...

What rule is that?

From WPA I see:

3.5 BALL DRIVEN OFF THE TABLE It is a foul to drive an object-ball off the table. Whether that ball is spotted depends on the rules of the game (see 2.6 Driven off the Table).

5.4 SECOND SHOT OF THE RACK – PUSH OUT If no foul is committed on the break shot, the shooter may choose to play a “push out” as his shot. He must make his intention known to the referee, and then rules 3.2 Wrong Ball First and 3.3 No Rail after Contact are suspended for the shot. If no foul is committed on a push out, the other player chooses who will shoot next.

5.6 SPOTTING BALLS If the 9-ball is pocketed on a foul or push out, or driven off the table, it is spotted (see 1.5 Spotting Balls). No other object-ball is ever spotted.


I don't see anywhere that says driving an object ball off the table isn't a foul on a push out.
 
slide13 said:
What rule is that?

From WPA I see:

3.5 BALL DRIVEN OFF THE TABLE It is a foul to drive an object-ball off the table. Whether that ball is spotted depends on the rules of the game (see 2.6 Driven off the Table).

5.4 SECOND SHOT OF THE RACK – PUSH OUT If no foul is committed on the break shot, the shooter may choose to play a “push out” as his shot. He must make his intention known to the referee, and then rules 3.2 Wrong Ball First and 3.3 No Rail after Contact are suspended for the shot. If no foul is committed on a push out, the other player chooses who will shoot next.

5.6 SPOTTING BALLS If the 9-ball is pocketed on a foul or push out, or driven off the table, it is spotted (see 1.5 Spotting Balls). No other object-ball is ever spotted.


I don't see anywhere that says driving an object ball off the table isn't a foul on a push out.
Click to expand...
Pocketing a ball on the push in no foul, jumping a ball of the table is. Everything you've posted is spot on.
 
Island Drive said:
I thought so too, but I talked with HOF referee Tom before I posted and he said.... no foul.
Makes sense, but gamblers wouldn't go for it, that's for sure.
Click to expand...
Tom, whoever that is, is dead wrong if he says jumping a ball off table is not a foul. The fact that it happens on a push doesn't change the rule.
 
how does it come up in a rotation game where you can drive an object ball off the table and it now is the right shot and you can do it.
 
maha said:
how does it come up in a rotation game where you can drive an object ball off the table and it now is the right shot and you can do it.
Click to expand...
its not a legal shot. jumping a ball, any ball, off the table is a foul in any pool game. maybe some chickenshit biker bar allows it but not real pool.
 
in the past in one pocket it was perfectly legal to knock an object ball in and or off the table and scratch.
and if just the object ball went off it got spotted. didnt happen often almost never.
 
maha said:
in the past in one pocket it was perfectly legal to knock an object ball in and or off the table and scratch.
and if just the object ball went off it got spotted. didnt happen often almost never.
Click to expand...
its a accepted tactic but its still a foul hence having to spot the ball(s). a lot of places have banned this due to spectators/fans getting hit by flying balls.
 
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All this confusion is the result of ineffective initial communication

"intentionally hits the 9 off table"

With a golf club? In the pocket or to the floor?

Set up for failure, dude's playing 5d chess up in hrrre
 
maha said:
how does it come up in a rotation game where you can drive an object ball off the table and it now is the right shot and you can do it.
Click to expand...
I break, make a ball I call push out but my push out choice is this.
I bank the 9 ball off table for it to be respotted, now it's incoming players turn.
garczar said:
its not a legal shot. jumping a ball, any ball, off the table is a foul in any pool game. maybe some chickenshit biker bar allows it but not real pool.
Click to expand...
I thought so zar, but Tom (50 yrs refereeing) also said this in conjunction with my question.
On the Break, if the 8 ball goes off table it's not loss of game.
maha said:
how does it come up in a rotation game where you can drive an object ball off the table and it now is the right shot and you can do it.
Click to expand...
maha.
Picture this.
Two balls are tied up on the foot spot.
You broke/made a ball have a clear shot at the 9 and call roll out.
Instead, your roll out choice is to bank/ launch the 9 off table for it to respot behind the foot spot ball cluster.

It's confusing to me, but the WPA rules are written as such to seeming allow this.
Sounds like a shot Efren would pull off.

I'd like to hear Jewetts viewpoint on this matter.
Also, 50 yrs reffing 8 ball off table Toms said he' never seen that happen but I'm sure it will, someday somewhere.
 
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