A natural player?

[Bob Jewett]

Can you run 100 balls in straight pool? I'm also a C player and I can't. I'm not sure if you're truly aware of the reality of competition. You would have no chance of beating a 61 year old Babe Cranefield.

A friend of mine visited friends in Syracuse when Cranfield was about 65. He went to Cranfield's home room five nights in a row to watch Cranfield practice. He said Cranfield ran 200 or more on each of the five nights. Of course playing in your home room is different from playing on TV or in a tournament, but at that age I think Cranfield would have still been in the top 20 at 14.1 if he played in competition.

 

[boogieman]

Nah, I could. And I suck. Just me popping off but I'm not sure you're truly aware of how bad it was. Watch the video below. I bet I could beat him, it's sad. Very much akin to watching a golfer with the yips. Doesn't matter, he's gone and it has nothing to do with the thread anyway, lol. I'm sure he was great in his day.

What's the deal with that table? It looks like a 10' in some views but the overhead looks really distorted.

 

[livemusic]

A friend of mine visited friends in Syracuse when Cranfield was about 65. He went to Cranfield's home room five nights in a row to watch Cranfield practice. He said Cranfield ran 200 or more on each of the five nights. Of course playing in your home room is different from playing on TV or in a tournament, but at that age I think Cranfield would have still been in the top 20 at 14.1 if he played in competition.

I believe you Bob, it was just pitiful the way he played against Mosconi is the match I saw. I've never seen a pool player do that but I have not watched many videos of players 60+. It has to happen, just like in golf. I felt sorry for him in the match I saw, which I posted above. He got bad leaves often but he also had plenty of decent shots to try.

 

[jay helfert]

How good were those guys compared to the world beaters we have today?

They were among the best players of their era.

 

[jay helfert]

Jay said some guys stayed in the beach and drunk for months until they got called for a gamble match, then went there and rip their money off, then went back to the beach idling from pool for months again, what I would say to this is I doubt this is the truth, what I would say to Jay is that, were you with them in the beach for months while they werent playing pool? I bet you just heard somebody tell you this story, and I'm willing to bet that these guys are hustlers and they spread these rumors and talk so that some peeps call them for games, but the truth of the matter is, they are hiding somewhere practicing, a place where there's one pool table and they just practice daily and tell everybody they're not playing pool and just staying in the beach, this is how I see it.

Doesn't matter who you are, you must practice daily to excel in pool, its a tough game, I mean if you stop playing you still can play a little bit, but you will lose feel, accuracy, tough shot pocketing, alot of stuff, you may do them the first day when you are pool thirsty, but the 2nd set it will show that you havent been playing for awhile.

This is how I analyze it if somebody would have told me this story that Jay just said here few posts ago.

The pool grapevine was pretty strong back then. That was all we had to go on. I'm not saying that these guys didn't have someplace (like a bar) where they could hit balls around once in a while, but they weren't playing on any kind of regular basis and certainly not against any real competition. If they had gotten into action at any of the local poolroms the word would have gotten around pretty quickly.

To answer your question about whether they were "hustling" someone. Of course they were. These were world class players who could warm up by playing for twenty or thirty minutes and beat almost anyone short of a champion level player. Yes, they picked their spots. Swanee and Marino weren't about to try to sneak up on Richie Florence or Marvin Henderson. They knew better than that. The top players all knew each other, even back then.

A guy like Swanee (or Marino) could take off for a couple of months, get a call to go somewhere, and hit balls for a day or two to get back in stroke. It didn't take him long to get ready to play.

 

[jay helfert]

An epic match that I watched at The Den was between Ronnie and Marvin, right after Ronnie won the One Pocket division in Johnston City in 1970. Someone backed Marvin to play Ronnie some One Pocket for $6,000, in a race to six. That was a very sizeable bet back then. Ronnie came in like he was the King of the Walk and had his entourage with him. He thought he was unbeatable and so did I. But no one told Marvin he couldn't win. He tied Ronnie in knots game after game. I had never seen Ronnie so stymied before. He couldn't kick his way out of the traps Marvin put him in (and he tried). Marvin pretty much handled the great Ronnie Allen that day and won 6-2 or 6-3. After it was over Ronnie challenged Marvin to come play him in the Valley where his home room was (Big Momma's). Marvin wasn't interested. He had his nice little payday and spent the next few weeks enjoying himself with good pot, nice women and a cold beer or two. I got to hang with him a few nights and we had a lot of fun with no pool involved. I sure felt bad when he moved back to Detroit.

It was the only time I ever saw Ronnie lose at One Pocket playing even.

I think Marvin would be in the top 15 alround players today....even 5x10 snooker

 

[book collector]

Jay said some guys stayed in the beach and drunk for months until they got called for a gamble match, then went there and rip their money off, then went back to the beach idling from pool for months again, what I would say to this is I doubt this is the truth, what I would say to Jay is that, were you with them in the beach for months while they werent playing pool? I bet you just heard somebody tell you this story, and I'm willing to bet that these guys are hustlers and they spread these rumors and talk so that some peeps call them for games, but the truth of the matter is, they are hiding somewhere practicing, a place where there's one pool table and they just practice daily and tell everybody they're not playing pool and just staying in the beach, this is how I see it.

Doesn't matter who you are, you must practice daily to excel in pool, its a tough game, I mean if you stop playing you still. can play a little bit, but you will lose feel, accuracy, tough shot pocketing, alot of stuff, you may do them the first day when you are pool thirsty, but the 2nd set it will show that you havent been playing for awhile.

This is how I analyze it if somebody would have told me this story that Jay just said here few posts ago.

ROFLMAO, is that you Larry?

 

[pw98]

I dunno but I just watched an ESPN match between Mosconi, age 68 and Babe Cranfield, age 61. I would've had my hands full with Mosconi but I could have held my own and I'm a C player. I could have beat the babe handily. It was pitiful, he jerked his cue at impact on every shot. Didn't have many shots and made only a few. I know they were no spring chickens but it wasn't very impressive. Modern players are amazing with their control.

I know 75 year olds that would zip C players in a race to 10.

 

[BelleBelle]

It was a combination of talent, hand eye coordination and desire. Not sure your age but also back in the day the pool table was comparable to the modern day video game. just look how good these kids are playing video games.

 

[ShootingArts]

It was a combination of talent, hand eye coordination and desire. Not sure your age but also back in the day the pool table was comparable to the modern day video game. just look how good these kids are playing video games.

Years ago my brother and I were shooting pistol competition. His son was twelve and we set him up with a racegun, compensator and red dot sight. Put the sight where you want the bullet to go and you are in there much like some video games. He started out in C class where everyone starts. Took a few weeks to move to B, now he has to draw, gonna be tougher. Nope, twelve year old nerd blew through C and B class and would have moved to Master had the season not ended. He won his very first match and most afterwards.

After I retired from pistol competition I decided to go shoot one match the next year. Shot a 598 out of 600 with almost no practice. A little gun handling and fifteen minutes of live fire. The next year I did a little better, 600 with only a little gun handling. The next year I had an equipment failure but I could tell the feel was gone anyway. I was going to have to work a little if I was going to win.

Pool was much the same, I could easily come back from months away, years away was a different story. Those thinking they could beat Willie and Babe after years of poor health have to realize that health has more to do with their loss of skills than age. Poor health and medications can slow anyone's game. As for the yips, many a person has thought they could run with the big dogs until they tried to. Most leave a little wiser and poorer!

Hu

 

[smoochie]

A guy like Swanee (or Marino) could take off for a couple of months, get a call to go somewhere, and hit balls for a day or two to get back in stroke. It didn't take him long to get ready to play.

Again I disagree with this. If Swanee or Marino played at a high level of pool during any given night, rest assured that they didn't take months off prior to their playing, they might spread rumours that they were taking off for a couple of months, but in reality, they didn't, they were hitting balls every other night at least to stay in stroke, that's of course if they performed at a high level, now I don't know either one of them, all I'm saying that people tend to love to tell others that "Hey, I wasn't playing pool for months" I don't know they just enjoy the idea of others to think that they weren't playing pool, then as you said hit balls for a day or two then get back in stroke, that what they want you and others to think, but as I said if their performance is really good, rest assure that they are lying and hiding somewhere practising/hitting balls all year long.

At the end of the day, I know that these are stories you keep hearing, as I said in the pool world people love the idea of making others think they weren't playing pool at all, so they spread these rumours, I know what you are telling me is what you believe, but I guess we have to agree to disagree because I see that you really believe their stories.