ABP boycotts Berhman's event

JAM said:
Doug, I remember when you wrote that letter. It is a shame nobody replied. I don't get it. You're offering to help. That offer deserves at least a reply, yea or nay!

REPLY TO DOUG, ABPpros!
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I am past caring Jen. As I said at the end of my letter, I will not be repeating the offer.

The other offer that you were privvy to involved ten fully sponsored international events has now passed into oblivion for the same reasons.

They took a lot of work and time to set them up and I will not be investing any more time on any suchj projects in the future.
 
Scott Lee said:
Excuse me? C'mon Shawn...if you can't even list people who are owed money, including how much and from when...you guys are just flappin' your gums. This is not some secret society, where you get penalized for giving out "secret" information. Post up...or piss off, imo! :rolleyes:

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
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The funny thing about it all, is that they don't want to post their names. They are afraid of being boycott'd....lol. That list of players is bad enough. APB needs a professional rep and not some pool player trying to rep them. Spend some money and hire a rep and a PR firm.

In athletics and sports, scholarships are given to people to go to college. I wish they did that for pool players...lol
 
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peteypooldude...It was not a cheap shot...it was a FACT. To be fair, when I said to the guy, "Do you mean Archer?", he replied, "Yes." Then I asked him if he knew who JA was, and he replied that he had "seen him on tv". Oh, and I watched the guy run two racks of 10ball, so he was no APA 2! Several of the people there called the event 'lackluster'. That is not a cheap shot...that's what people who were there said. As far as people knowing who I am...what does that have to do with the price of eggs? JA is easily 100x more famous than I could care to be. That fame, plus a dollar, will get you a cup of coffee at McD's! It's true that I do much better financially than many of the top pros...but I also work hard at it. I'm away from my home up to 200 days a year...that's a hell of a lot of road expenses...not to mention time away from family, etc.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

peteypooldude said:
Must have been an APA 2 you were talking to. If they dont know who JA is, then they have trouble figuring which end of the cue to use.
Another nice cheapsh1t
Only people heard of you are on AZ
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brandoncook26 said:
This is actually pretty common. There are many B level players in my area who wouldn't know any of these guys. I asked a guy that plays in 3-5 tournaments a week, probably a low- mid B, if he's heard of Shane Van Boening. He had no clue who I was talking about. This has happened multiple times when I've asked many different people.

How can there be enough money to go around in pool when the people who are the potential market couldn't tell you anyone who is a pro? The key is getting all these people who play pool to learn about pool and associate the game with the faces. How can you make money when the audience you're shooting for doesn't even know professional pool exists?

I am literally one of two people in a town of 350,000 who has ever bought a TAR ppv. That actually seems like a lot when you look at some of the numbers. If that number stood, TAR would have 800 viewers in the US. Since they only get about half that, that means in the US there is probably one ppv purchaser for every 500-600,000 people. You tell me where the money is supposed to come from to grow this sport?
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It is about the same here. When I go to a big event with a buddy
I am constantly having to point out this or that Pro.
It is hard for me to believe that they dont know who they are.But they are seldom on TV . Hopefully steaming will change some of that.
I may have stepped out of line with Scott. I have been looking at negative threads and may have taken it wrong. But with the post he quoted I do think it was meant in a negative way.
Have a great day Brandon
 
Scott Lee said:
peteypooldude...It was not a cheap shot...it was a FACT. To be fair, when I said to the guy, "Do you mean Archer?", he replied, "Yes." Then I asked him if he knew who JA was, and he replied that he had "seen him on tv". Oh, and I watched the guy run two racks of 10ball, so he was no APA 2! Several of the people there called the event 'lackluster'. That is not a cheap shot...that's what people who were there said. As far as people knowing who I am...what does that have to do with the price of eggs? JA is easily 100x more famous than I could care to be. That fame, plus a dollar, will get you a cup of coffee at McD's! It's true that I do much better financially than many of the top pros...but I also work hard at it. I'm away from my home up to 200 days a year...that's a hell of a lot of road expenses...not to mention time away from family, etc.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
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As I stated earlier, I have been reading negative threads for 2 days.
I apologize
 
peteypooldude said:
It is about the same here. When I go to a big event with a buddy
I am constantly having to point out this or that Pro.
It is hard for me to believe that they dont know who they are.But they are seldom on TV . Hopefully steaming will change some of that.
I may have stepped out of line with Scott. I have been looking at negative threads and may have taken it wrong. But with the post he quoted I do think it was meant in a negative way.
Have a great day Brandon
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I will be waiting for my apology as well.

It feels good to know somebody owes you something.

Apology accepted in advance.
 
book collector said:
I would like to see the ABP sponsor their own "North American Open " or whatever name, tournament this year.
If you take the $500.00 per player x 256 players which the tournament has had no problem filling lately, thats $128,000.00. {Paid ahead}
You will need to have all money paid for entry at least 2 months ahead of time and make it a first come first in basis after that. The only way to get an entry after the field is filled is to buy one from a player.
Add vendor booth rentals, concessions, discounted spectator tickets for buying ahead and take your futures into your own hands gentlemen.
Take the "in hand" money and get everything set up and it will happen. People don't come to see promoters, they come to see the players and their friends.
I can't imagine that Greg Sullivan and company will not get involved in this.
The worst case scenario is that no one but the players shows up and you are all out 500.00. The same as you would have been at any other tournament.
The best case scenario is that you will decide your future.
I have some other ideas if anyone from the organisation would like to contact me. {I will talk to anyone who is legitimate , but if you just want to tell me how stupid I am, lets save ourselves the trouble.}
If it were me and with all the previous problems I would not waste any more time expecting a different outcome.
I think it is time to move on and see what it is like to be the first one to count the money.
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Actually this is the first year since 2000 that they have had a full field!
 
Shawn...How is that different from ANY poolplayer, amateur or pro, when they go to play in any tournament anywhere? You pays your money, and you takes your chances. Don't like the odds?...don't play. Seems like a pretty good model to follow. FTR, I think your organization's goals are good. I just think your tactics are poorly timed.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

ABPpros said:
The hotels wouldn't take a postdated check , the airlines wouldn't take an IOU to come to the Open, Gas station wanted my money before I fueled up to come to the Open ! Oh, and Our entrees had to be sent in before we started the event . Does anybody see a pattern here ? If we paid all of our expenses with a credit card, 30 days from then the card company wants there money or we pay huge finance charges ! Please tell me all you guys and gals understand what I am saying ?
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peteypooldude...Apology accepted! I've been telling pro players for more than 10 yrs that the way to make $$$ in pool is to do exhibitions (yet they choose not to...acting as if it is beneath them as pro players). People will pay to be entertained. It has always been that way, and that doesn't change. Do all pros possess the skills necessary to be a good entertainer (and it's a LOT more than just skill on the table)? Not hardly...but it isn't rocket science. They could learn if they wanted to. I do try not to be negative with or about the pro players...but come on, they need serious reorganization...and a leader who is NOT a poolplayer. JMO.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

peteypooldude said:
As I stated earlier, I have been reading negative threads for 2 days.
I apologize
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Shawn...Surely you cannot be serious? Are you saying that every pro who plays in the US Open 9Ball tournament cashes? Ummmm...NOT. Oh, and the comment about sponsors getting "money back"...sounds like you're expected to part with a share of your winnings. That's called a BACKER, not a sponsor. Sponsors, the extreme few of them out there, do not put up money or goods with the expectation of always getting cash back. They do it out of love for the sport, and respect for the players. Oh, and btw, Neil is quite a good player...not in your league, but he can play.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

ABPpros said:
LOL, you are obviously not a pool player ! What Pro actually goes to an event and doesn't expect to win or place high ? come on now. try telling a sponsor that you did great in the tournament but he can't get a return on his investment cause you didn't get paid. Yeah, that will go over good.
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Exactly

Scott Lee said:
Sponsors, the extreme few of them out there, do not put up money or goods with the expectation of always getting cash back. They do it out of love for the sport, and respect for the players.
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A sponsor is someone who supports a player and hopes for a return on investment that doesn't involve a percentage of winnings.

Sponsors are looking for players who will promote their product or service. Or someone who's image will cast a positive light on anything they are involved with.

Tiger Woods lost sponsors because his image was tarnished, and sponsors no longer wanted to be associated with him.

Why would sponsors want to get involved with a group of players who are trying to punish a guy who has worked hard and risked his own money to try to support them and their sport?
 
Shawn...I'm pretty sure nobody wants to "bare with you" or worse, see you BARE (I know I sure don't! :eek::D). Some of us here might better BEAR with you, if you answered the very few questions that people have posted. All you say is...in due time. That's a cop out. I mean, for crying out loud. WHO hasn't been paid? All of you keep harping on that issue. According to BB, the answer is nobody.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

ABPpros said:
There is always more to the story that the public doesn't know about ! Please bare with us . I know this proble will get resolved ! I HOPE !!!
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Perhaps there is no resolution.

None of us are going to wait around or care.

There will still be a US Open and I am sure there are many out there, who wants to have the title...US Open Champion.
 
Johnny...Maybe it would help if you at least knew how to spell Barry's name correctly. :rolleyes:

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

ABPpros said:
Hi Brandon. I did not make the posts last night. I don't know what was said. With everything going on everybody on our side is on edge. Things will probably get said from emotion. This problem with barry Bearman has been going on for a very long time. The ABP has been in talks with Barry for 14 months. The ABP did not ask for this. Your apology is accepted. THANKS
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Neil...You make some great points, and I agree with them. That said, I will be a 'devil's advocate' for a minute. Barry has been talking about tv coverage for many years...so this is not news. IF it happens great...but I'm not gonna hold my breath...and as a player I wouldn't play or not play based on whether there was tv coverage or not.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Neil said:
Something else- look no farther than Hopkins events. You have an amateur event that draws thousands. And, along side it, you have a pro event. Just look at how few of those thousands attended the pro event. Not very many at all. The vendors are there for the amateurs, not the pros. The pros drawing ability is very low.

Look at the numbers on PPV's, a few hundred at best. Archer and a few others are travelling around giving clinics. Sure, they get to make a little extra, but really, what kind of numbers are they getting?? Maybe a couple dozen in any given location? Sorry, but the name recognition is just not there yet.

Yes, the top players play great. And, IMO, it really takes an A player or above to really realize just how good some of you really do play! No one is questioning your abilities on a table. Just your drawing power. What you guys need to be doing is whatever it takes to get your names known. THEN you will have a little clout to be able to dictate terms. As it is now, you are going all in on a pair of two's and hoping your opponent folds.

And, as Jay also stated, if Barry gets T.V. coverage like he is trying to, you guys will all miss the boat on that name recognition. You guys all want to be treated like celebrities, but what are you doing to get that recognition besides just playing?? When Johnny does a clinic, does he take it upon himself to get ahold of the local news crew before he gets there to let them know that a Hall of Fame player and multiple world champion will be in their town for an exhibition?? Maybe he does, I don't know. But, if he's not, why not?? Does he spend a couple hundred of what he will make to have the local pool hall have someone put flyers up all over town to get his name and picture out to the general public and not just pool fans, and not just in the local pool rooms? Lot's of things you guys can and should be doing first before you take the measures you are.
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Scott Lee said:
peteypooldude...Apology accepted! I've been telling pro players for more than 10 yrs that the way to make $$$ in pool is to do exhibitions (yet they choose not to...acting as if it is beneath them as pro players). People will pay to be entertained. It has always been that way, and that doesn't change. Do all pros possess the skills necessary to be a good entertainer (and it's a LOT more than just skill on the table)? Not hardly...but it isn't rocket science. They could learn if they wanted to. I do try not to be negative with or about the pro players...but come on, they need serious reorganization...and a leader who is NOT a poolplayer. JMO.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
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You hit it right on the head. You can't live off tournament winnings especially not in pool. Even the top sports you find the majority of players income comes from outside. Be commercials or endorsements, personal appearances, teaching and so on. Look at sports that have no prize monies like swimming or gymnastics yet many still eek out a living at what they love. That is the whole point, to stay off the end of a shovel and doing what you love.
 
Personally, even though I don't condone Barry's past slow pays, he is the promoter and he is the one taking the financial risks (to the point of his detriment). All the players have to do is pay their fees and show up. I think it is pretty immature of them as a group to make demands while having a minimal stake in the event. Even though Barry may make mistakes, what other promoter in the States is offering similar payouts?

I think the ABP needs to get off their collective asses, put in the work, and see if they can come up with something better. If they were in such great demand, the beer companies, auto makers, etc., would be standing in line to sponsor events. (Maybe I'm blind, but I haven't seen that happening.) Until they can develop their own events, they're pissing in the wind as far as I'm concerned, and should stop sh*tting on one of the few decent events they can be involved in stateside.
 
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