Another Farorate thread

[The_JV]

You must be a very good, well rounded player JV. I’m not the one who stated this first. Kentucky said pretty much there was no way at 480 listed fargorate I could run an 18% B&R rate on avg in the tournaments I play. And if so he won’t take my word on it and I’d have to prove it. It doesn’t have anything to do with fargorate. But the general consensus is that in order to be a certain level you would need a certain level of offense to achieve said level.

Also I’d say i don’t think a 600 could beat the ghost 7-0. Unlike Kentucky I wouldn’t need proof. But there he is at 600 beating down the ghost 7-0. That’s like 700+ level offense. He didn’t miss a shot so there is no way to compute the actual level of his offensive play without any misses. But if an avg 650’s offense is even with the ghost, even that 650 will have a rough time 7-0ing the ghost.

This is why the ghost is rated at 650. It takes the avg offensive play of a 650 to play even with the ghost.

Dr Dave has even addressed break and runs as a sign of fargorate level. I think a 500 was 5-10% or maybe a 600 was 10%. This is off memory. A 600 has probably run a 3 pack at least once and a 700 a 6 pack. It’s just an estimate of avg offense of each tier of player is all.

Apologies for singling you out. Guess you're just the most active recently and have seen your comments contain both fargo rate and ability to put racks together.

I consider myself a strong "club player". Not special but one of those guys that make locals say "oh shit" when they see my name in their part of the bracket....lol. I have developed more of a well rounded game over the last few years and have been known to grind out sets that I struggle offensively in.

I play against the ghost a fair bit in various games and say I'm probably <10% without BIH and ~70% with it (per set). That BIH is a massive difference. I generally play what I call "semi-pro" ghost. Wherein I take BIH only if I don't have a clean pot on the first ball.

 

[Willowbrook Wolfy]

I’m a 558 Fargo and my best ghost set was 7-2. (9’ GC with 5” pockets). I was actually up 6-0 on it and had a real good chance to blank him. I have a video of it in one of the prior year ghost threads.

Now my avg score is probably a 1.5-7 loss I’m guessing. But sometimes it all just comes together.

That’s awesome. Were you shaking? I probably would’ve been. 4-0 and then-SCWHACK on a 2ft shot is about my best start ever.

Hey there is another way you could play the ghost. With a spot. Just play the ghost until you run 1, and start the count there. It’s a bit easier as you have a small advantage and a bit more confidence at the beginning of the race. I used to play like that when it was a lot harder to run more than 1 or 2 per set.

We probably all know it’s pretty frustrating missing an easy one at the get go then all of a sudden your down some games without even 1 on the board. Plus if you ever start over down 0-4 or 0-5 that’s giving you the edge on the next one anyway. So why not just start with a runout?

 

[iusedtoberich]

I found it. Video is edited to remove all the dead space. I was probably very nervous at the end, but it was 2018 and I don't remember. I hear myself in the video saying "stay with it" towards the end. I also don't know why the video still has the sound. It's a Metallica album playing. I'm surprised Youtube didn't block it. Maybe because its unlisted?

When it was 6-0, I played bad position from the 7 to the 8 and missed the 8. Looking back now, I have no idea what my intended position was.

The balls were brand new Cyclop, fresh out of the box. I recall it was like playing on brand new Simonis. The Simonis on my table was 6 years old at this point.

 

[soyale]

Dr Dave has even addressed break and runs as a sign of fargorate level. I think a 500 was 5-10% or maybe a 600 was 10%. This is off memory. A 600 has probably run a 3 pack at least once and a 700 a 6 pack. It’s just an estimate of avg offense of each tier of player is all.

as per fargo

600	Has run three-in-a-row multiple times and maybe four-in-a row a time or two. High Run in 14.1 of 50-60. There are generally around 30 players at this level per million population
500	A good local league player. Runs out first time at the table in about 5% of the games. Close to the median of players in the FargoRate system
400	Runs out first time at the table in about 1% of the games—once or twice a league season.

mind you this is “first time at the table” not after the break.

 

[Atorontopoolplayer]

Apologies for singling you out. Guess you're just the most active recently and have seen your comments contain both fargo rate and ability to put racks together.

I consider myself a strong "club player". Not special but one of those guys that make locals say "oh shit" when they see my name in their part of the bracket....lol. I have developed more of a well rounded game over the last few years and have been known to grind out sets that I struggle offensively in.

I play against the ghost a fair bit in various games and say I'm probably <10% without BIH and ~70% with it (per set). That BIH is a massive difference. I generally play what I call "semi-pro" ghost. Wherein I take BIH only if I don't have a clean pot on the first ball.

Ha, had to play you in a tournament a couple years ago and definitely said o shit to myself when I got you round one
I .. did not perform well . Would like to think I'd hold my self together better/ give you a better game now. (Still out ranked by like 60 fargo points)

 

[9BallKY]

as per fargo

600	Has run three-in-a-row multiple times and maybe four-in-a row a time or two. High Run in 14.1 of 50-60. There are generally around 30 players at this level per million population
500	A good local league player. Runs out first time at the table in about 5% of the games. Close to the median of players in the FargoRate system
400	Runs out first time at the table in about 1% of the games—once or twice a league season.

mind you this is “first time at the table” not after the break.

I live in a small town population around 15k and we have 6 players with over 600 Fargo. Well 5 and one is in the 590 range but should probably be over 600. There is another guy that rarely plays anymore that doesn’t have a rating that was well over 600 when he played but is a little older now and doesn’t play as much.

 

[soyale]

I live in a small town population around 15k and we have 6 players with over 600 Fargo. Well 5 and one is in the 590 range but should probably be over 600. There is another guy that rarely plays anymore that doesn’t have a rating that was well over 600 when he played but is a little older now and doesn’t play as much.

sounds like you guys have a strong community!

 

[Coos Cues]

I live in a small town population around 15k and we have 6 players with over 600 Fargo. Well 5 and one is in the 590 range but should probably be over 600. There is another guy that rarely plays anymore that doesn’t have a rating that was well over 600 when he played but is a little older now and doesn’t play as much.

We have 30k population and only two 600 players and they are both under 610.

 

[9BallKY]

We have 30k population and only two 600 players and they are both under 610.

The last tournament I played in was a small handicapped tournament. There was I believe 27 players and 10 had over 600 Fargo and 5 more in the 580 range.

 

[Rodney]

I live in a small town population around 15k and we have 6 players with over 600 Fargo. Well 5 and one is in the 590 range but should probably be over 600. There is another guy that rarely plays anymore that doesn’t have a rating that was well over 600 when he played but is a little older now and doesn’t play as much.

sounds like you guys have a strong community!

3 people, 3 houses in a row on my street the combined Fargo rating is over 1900.

 

[Coos Cues]

The last tournament I played in was a small handicapped tournament. There was I believe 27 players and 10 had over 600 Fargo and 5 more in the 580 range.

How is livability? I've had just about enough of the drug addicted scroungy career homeless criminal zombies Oregon has attracted from everywhere with the stupid Portland voters legalizing all drugs and criminalizing law enforcement. Coos Bay has been my home for decades but I'm thinking seriously of getting the hell out of here.

 

[9BallKY]

How is livability? I've had just about enough of the drug addicted scroungy career homeless criminal zombies Oregon has attracted from everywhere with the stupid Portland voters legalizing all drugs and criminalizing law enforcement. Coos Bay has been my home for decades but I'm thinking seriously of getting the hell out of here.

It’s a pretty quiet place overall we have a big lake that draws a lot of tourists. We also have our share of drugs addicts but I’m sure that’s about any place you go anymore

 

[The_JV]

I live in a small town population around 15k and we have 6 players with over 600 Fargo.

We have 30k population and only two 600 players and they are both under 610.

My home town is something like 160k. Rough thinking has maybe 10ish >600 players. A few bottom end, couple in the middle, and another few high end. There's a handful of strong shots that can't be bothered to chasing fargo reporting. I'd say those guys are ~625...

 

[nicksaint26]

Wolfy just don’t give a shit.

Nice vid Kentucky. Do you ever miss? I thought I made you play worse? Now looks like you were going for the 1 in the side on most breaks. But racks 1 and 7 why not go pro ghost and no ball in hand? I could understand rack 7 after playing a perfect match. But rack 1 the 2nd ball had 3 pockets to go to. Maybe 4. With easy shape on next ball even if you were off shape a bit. That would’ve been 1 rack with no BIH for me. Not saying I would’ve ran it. But you would’ve.

And no way you are only a 600. Never seen a 600 run over a 4 pack. Seen it two times. Even with a shot off the rack 5 break. That’s 36 balls maybe 40 max. 2 on each break would be minimum 32 shots. Maybe it was just your day, but ive never seen a 600 go over 40 shots without missing in 9 ball. You made it look easy. And on the first try. I did see a 630 put up a 6 pack one time recently. But that same guy used to keep up with semi pros 20 years ago. And probably was closer to a 700 back then playing daily.

I’d say you are at least a 650. You didn’t get off shape as much as a typical 600 would. Plus made more balls in a row than I’ve ever seen a low 600 make. And I’ll add to it. Making that many in a row didn’t phase you at all. If it didn’t happen often you’d at least be a bit more “showing”. 675 all day. Maybe your defense and strategy are what’s holding you back. But going off the video I’d say if that’s your break it’s what is keeping you at 600. You might have been breaking for a certain spread but you were using a template which people say wires the wing ball and usually didn’t have a good shot on the first ball. But that’s going off 7 racks and an assumption at this point.(I can’t be 100% nice)

I’ll still play you even!

Edit: sorry I’m editing but that last part was based off experience. I play a guy occasionally in league/tournaments that always breaks for the 1 in the side, and I enjoy playing him because he almost always makes it and screws himself on the break half the time. Which in turn leaves me a better chance to get to and control the table. He’s somewhere in the 500’s.

The reason you think he is higher than a 600 is the same reason you think your Fargo is higher than it is. You are overrating yourself imo.

 

[9BallKY]

My home town is something like 160k. Rough thinking has maybe 10ish >600 players. A few bottom end, couple in the middle, and another few high end. There's a handful of strong shots that can't be bothered to chasing fargo reporting. I'd say those guys are ~625...

I’m not really concerned about Fargo either I played my first Fargo tournament about 4 years ago and I still haven’t reached 200 games. I am currently at 626 (banger level). My first Fargo tournament I played absolutely terrible and I had never been there or shot a ball on the tables. So I started pretty low and from there I played another one about a year later with the same scenario. Didn’t play good but went up a few points.

The last Fargo tournament I played in was about a year ago. The day of the tournament about an hr before my first match I had a reaction to some medicine I take and I won my first set but lost my second set to a guy with around a 615 Fargo then I won another set against a 650 player then lost my last set to another 620 player so overall just on my tournament performance I’m rated about right. Whether it’s accurate or not I really could care less I just like to play.

 

[Coos Cues]

The reason you think he is higher than a 600 is the same reason you think your Fargo is higher than it is. You are overrating yourself imo.

The reason I think he's higher than 600 is because that's what I am with almost 3k games in and I want no part of this guy's action

 

[SBC]

Because you’re a fish who thinks he is a shark! My bad a sheep who thinks he is a wolf.

Was thinking that as I was reading.

Whatever spot the better player gives...they can always give more.

I would play alot of guys with the 8 of a game...
When the bet was right...I'd give 7 out and the breaks. Inevitably they would say, " You can't win with that." Then I win because they aren't runout players...

 

[SBC]

Mine does. Which is why i thought it funny that Kentucky mentioned playing the ghost on a 9 footer instead of the “kiddie” table. I have a better chance on the 9 footer.

If a 7 footer is considered a “regulator” like a lot of people try to say. It tells me a lot of people believe a higher level player goes down a bit on them. I’ve always thought this was bs. But in order to regulate something you need to meet in the middle. So if not using handicaps the lower players actual skill has to go up and the higher levels down. And it’s also funny because I’ll bet if you ask Mike Page wins/losses are probably the same on either. The only time I see the 7 footer really helping out somebody is if they aren’t that good and can’t make long shots.

I believe the same as what you stated Gustav

If you pocket a lot of balls and can make most of the harder shots regularly but aren’t good at shaping there is more room to move around on a 9 footer. And even playing great shape most of the time it’s easier to get in trouble or blocked on a 7 footer. less room= more clusters and smaller lanes regardless of the game.

If you pocket the hard ones regularly but get out of shape often, the 9 footer gives you more room for shape error to still pocket the next ball. Also you have more wiggle room to get back into shape too. Shape errors are less costly on a 9 footer most of the time because 2” out of shape on a 9 is translated to 3” out of shape on a 7 footer or something to that effect.

In a sense. The only time a 7 footer would make anyone better is if they shape better than pocket balls. Or if they safety a lot. Cause safing is easier on a 9 footer. But that safety point is mute when playing someone good that can kick/jump well People that can pocket all the harder shots but not shape the best should play better on a 9 footer.

So maybe a 7 footer would be a regulator sometimes, but it doesn’t automatically make a mid range player better or give the lower skilled player a better chance. It’s better for some worse for others depending on their skill set, and probably at any level.

Any player who plays well on a 9 footer is going to play strong on a 7 footer. There aren't any tough shots.

 

[SBC]

The more this guy types the more he sounds like a 450.

Boy don't know what he don't know.
Sounds like a great customer.

 

[SBC]

You’re right all that really matters is having fun , however you are the one that came on here bragging about how you can run 20% of the time. When you do that someone is going to call you out and say prove it. That’s all we ask is prove it.

If I say I can beat the 9 ball ghost 90% of the time you bet every dime you have that someone is going to say prove it. Now if I say I can beat it occasionally nobody cares because that is believable but when someone with a 480 Fargo says they can break and run almost as good as pro players that’s not believable and someone is going to call you out. I don’t really even gamble anymore the only reason I play is for fun.

But like basementdweller said until you realize that you don’t win the game by making a bank on the one your never going to play at a high level.

At my best, playing 2 or 3 tournaments a week and practicing 15 to 20 hours a week home..and after specifically working on my break...I ran just over 20%. It's a very tough thing to do unless you break well enough.

The ghost didn't want to play me. I won about 60%.

At that level I'd estimate I was like 680.
Ran 168 in straight pool.
Broke and ran 7 racks of nine ball on a 9 foot.
12 pack of 8 ball on a 7 foot.

There's not enough going on to practice like that anymore. I enjoy still being about to play well after long stretches of barely playing.