Another "Jelly" thread

easy-e

easy-e

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Just to satisfy my own curiosity.............

Let's say a player offers to let you buy him into a big tournament with expenses paid (air fare, hotel, rental car, tournament entry). He agrees to play for half of his winnings. Suppose he wins $10,000. How much would you throw him as a "thank you". Just to make it easy, let's assume the expenses totaled $1,000.

***Obviously this hasn't happened, but I debated this with my buddy the other night and wanted your input.
 
Varies

some would not 'throw' him anything than the 50-50 split, since the $1,000 came out of your pocket, but personally I would jelly him $500-1,000 extra.
 
easy-e said:
Just to satisfy my own curiosity.............

Let's say a player offers to let you buy him into a big tournament with expenses paid (air fare, hotel, rental car, tournament entry). He agrees to play for half of his winnings. Suppose he wins $10,000. How much would you throw him as a "thank you". Just to make it easy, let's assume the expenses totaled $1,000.

***Obviously this hasn't happened, but I debated this with my buddy the other night and wanted your input.
Click to expand...

The right thing to do is for the sponsor or backer to get himself even, then split the 9,000. Tipping the player is good also, but is up to the discretion of the backer. If I backed a player in this type of arrangement, I'd probably throw him an extra 500, about 10%.
 
easy-e said:
Just to satisfy my own curiosity.............

Let's say a player offers to let you buy him into a big tournament with expenses paid (air fare, hotel, rental car, tournament entry). He agrees to play for half of his winnings. Suppose he wins $10,000. How much would you throw him as a "thank you". Just to make it easy, let's assume the expenses totaled $1,000.

***Obviously this hasn't happened, but I debated this with my buddy the other night and wanted your input.
Click to expand...


Ok so he gets $4500. I think I might go another 500 but thats it. Tough
money there. Risking a grand to make 4k.

I do think risk level needs to be looked at as well. For your 1k what odds did you have of losing money. If it was minimal then I TIP more.

I once gave a player 70% of a take. He was broke and got a game where he was stealing. Figured I would rather take 30% before someone else did.
 
The arrangement I have made before is that I will pay entry fees and if the player cashes the entry comes out first and the player gets 70% after that. As long as it is agreed on up front, and the backer is not stealing, I don't believe in throwing extra.

I do however always jelly a player I have in a calcutta if they place high enough to warrant it. (assuming they didn't get 1/2)
 
I'm no expert at this, and I'm no millionaire either. I can't do this as a little hobby. First of all, a player doesn't "let" you sponsor him. He looks for sponsors. Usually he can't find one. If I think a player has an excellent shot at the money, and I decide to sponsor him, my chances are less than even. That's no big deal if you own Mars or Ben and Jerrys, but it is to me.

If I sponsor a player to a tourney, and he wins, and I paid all expenses, I split the winnings after expenses. I think the player was lucky to find me...Tom
 
frankncali said:
Ok so he gets $4500. I think I might go another 500 but thats it. Tough
money there. Risking a grand to make 4k.

I do think risk level needs to be looked at as well. For your 1k what odds did you have of losing money. If it was minimal then I TIP more.

I once gave a player 70% of a take. He was broke and got a game where he was stealing. Figured I would rather take 30% before someone else did.
Click to expand...


Another issue to consider is if you have did this with the player in the past. I know I have a real close friend, and we have bet on and "with" each other numerous times over the past 5 years. We made an agreement a long time ago to never tip each other because we have won and lost together and just look at it as "our" money, no matter who is doing the playing. I think many road partnerships probably operate the same way, at least we did.
 
1on1pooltournys said:
Another issue to consider is if you have did this with the player in the past. I know I have a real close friend, and we have bet on and "with" each other numerous times over the past 5 years. We made an agreement a long time ago to never tip each other because we have won and lost together and just look at it as "our" money, no matter who is doing the playing. I think many road partnerships probably operate the same way, at least we did.
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I know a few guys who have a "No Jelly" policy when it comes to road partners. Keeps everyone on the same page and makes for happy road dogs.

The biggest issue when it comes to any kind of Jelly is when people do not spell out an agreement before hand. A friend and I put a player into a tourney paying airfare and entry with the agreement that should he cash all expenses come off the top and the rest is split 50/50. He lost his first match and fought hard for 2 days to cash. After the expenses and split he made about $300. I Jellyed him a $100 because of how hard he fought instead of just sending it in. My profit on the deal? $50 not counting MY expenses for hotel, gas, etc. But it was worth it to see my horse run :D If he would of ran through the tourney and snapped it off making a good score for everyone I probably would not have jellied him because he knew the deal going in.

Like one poster mentioned, in today's climate the PLAYER is lucky to find the HORSE and should make his deal up front with no expectation of jelly. Just good business. That way no one goes away feeling they were shorted.

I could tell you about the time I let a player out of stake deal that we already posted the dough for to be a good guy cause he got a better deal. Cost me $7000. Know how much jelly I got from the player for letting him out of the deal and being a good guy? $0

My stakehorse days are over but if you do it right it can be fun and enjoyable. Do it wrong it's a mess.
 
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tpdtom said:
I'm no expert at this, and I'm no millionaire either. I can't do this as a little hobby. First of all, a player doesn't "let" you sponsor him. He looks for sponsors. Usually he can't find one. If I think a player has an excellent shot at the money, and I decide to sponsor him, my chances are less than even. That's no big deal if you own Mars or Ben and Jerrys, but it is to me.

If I sponsor a player to a tourney, and he wins, and I paid all expenses, I split the winnings after expenses. I think the player was lucky to find me...Tom
Click to expand...

Can't be summed up any more succinctly than this. As long as the player agrees, then this is a fair market set up.

The problem is, is when "sponsors" (backers) work the deal to where it is actually "fair" for all sides (the sponsor gets a fair return based on the risk taken, and the player gets a free shot at money he had NO CHANCE at before..)... A lot of players feel "entitled" to the backers money and will find any way they can to get a larger part of it.

They will justify it to themselves by saying the backer is a scumbag for taking 70%, etc.

It's a dangerous world out there for folks who have money.. :D

Russ
 
Here is an interview Chad did with Billy Incardona in Olathe a year ago. Listen to Billy's view on the Horse/Player relationship and what he thinks about it in todays game.

Billy as usual comes with the knowledge and wisdom.

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=the+action+report&sitesearch=#

The stakehorse stuff starts at about 11:40. There is some audio dropouts. This was my first interview I produced using wireless mics. Actually this is the first interview I ever produced period. :D
 
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The Master

If you spread the jelly right it will grow 10 fold. The all time King of Jelly was a guy named Schindler. They even made a movie about him. He was a hero. If you made his list it was gold. ;)

Ray
 
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