Ball in Hand Ruling Question? Gray Area?

CSykes24

CSykes24

www.coreysykes.com
Silver Member
This past weekend, I was playing in a tournament and had the following situation come up:

My opponent had received ball-in-hand and was placing the cue ball behind to shoot a 1-9 combo. (I had thought it to be impossible in the first place; I moved the 2 to make the out more difficult.) In the event of placing the cue ball down, he moved an object ball behind the 1 ball just slightly while placing the cue ball down. I presumed that he placed the cue ball down where the object ball that was moved had once been.

Is this a foul? I assumed it to be so under the "his hand is part of the cue ball when placing" idea. I called him on it, but the director said since it was cue ball fouls only, I was able to put the object ball back where it was and play continued.

It didn't affect the outcome of the match, just the particular game.

Thoughts?
 
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If you are playing foul on all balls then it's a foul. Cue Ball fouls only, then you can replace the ball or leave it where it is. Now if when placing the cue ball, it touches another ball that would be a foul.
 
jay helfert said:
If you are playing foul on all balls then it's a foul. Cue Ball fouls only, then you can replace the ball or leave it where it is. Now if when placing the cue ball, it touches another ball that would be a foul.
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This is my understanding when playing cue ball fouls only. If the cue ball touches the object ball as he's setting it down, that is a foul. If his hand touches the object ball, that is not a foul.
 
When placing the cue ball down if you have ball
in hand is a foul, now on the other hand when
you are picking up the cue ball when your
opponent has fouled and you touch another ball
that is not a foul. I hope that helps.
 
If the cue ball is in your hand, and that hand that is holding the cue ball touches or moves another ball it is a foul it does not matter if the cue ball it self comes in contact because the hand is considered to be a part of the ball.

Black Cat :cool:
 
Black Cat 5791 said:
If the cue ball is in your hand, and that hand that is holding the cue ball touches or moves another ball it is a foul it does not matter if the cue ball it self comes in contact because the hand is considered to be a part of the ball.

Black Cat :cool:
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I gotta go along with that too. Good call!
 
jay helfert said:
If you are playing foul on all balls then it's a foul. Cue Ball fouls only, then you can replace the ball or leave it where it is. Now if when placing the cue ball, it touches another ball that would be a foul.
Click to expand...

And when you replace the ball, it gets 'put back' where everything it tougher.

I can't believe I am giving this stuff away for free...
 
All ball

In your post you state that the TD
said it was an all ball foul tournament,
then the director allowed the moved
ball to be replaced. This is contradictory.

However, in either rule set moving the other
object ball was a foul. It should have been
your turn.
 
Black Cat 5791 said:
If the cue ball is in your hand, and that hand that is holding the cue ball touches or moves another ball it is a foul it does not matter if the cue ball it self comes in contact because the hand is considered to be a part of the ball. ...
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That seems like a reasonable way to describe things, but is that in any written set of rules? Sometimes these ideas go around just by tradition and word of mouth and often they end up not being like the written rule at all.
 
BCAPL rules

Bob Jewett said:
That seems like a reasonable way to describe things, but is that in any written set of rules? Sometimes these ideas go around just by tradition and word of mouth and often they end up not being like the written rule at all.
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From 2012-2014 BCAPL rule book 1-38 Ball in Hand Placement

4. When placing or moving the cue ball, it is a if you touch or disturb any object ball with the cue ball or your hand that holds the cue ball. Your "hand" is defined as including the wrist up to a point where a wristwatch would normally be worn. Your opponent has no restoration option.

There apears to be a typo in that foul is missing after "it is a".
 
Thanks for all the thoughts. I thought it was a foul and got slightly disturbed by it, but it was nothing I could do when the option is left to the shooter.
 
But remember, you as the opponent had the option to put the 2 back where it was. The shooter can't complain if you put it 1/4 inch off. Just sayin.....this may prevent him from trying to squeeze it in a 2nd time.

It should have been called a foul in the 1st place.
 
tucson9ball said:
But remember, you as the opponent had the option to put the 2 back where it was. The shooter can't complain if you put it 1/4 inch off. Just sayin.....this may prevent him from trying to squeeze it in a 2nd time.

It should have been called a foul in the 1st place.
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YOu know it!:
Black-Balled said:
And when you replace the ball, it gets 'put back' where everything it tougher.

I can't believe I am giving this stuff away for free...
Click to expand...
 
Black Cat 5791 said:
If the cue ball is in your hand, and that hand that is holding the cue ball touches or moves another ball it is a foul it does not matter if the cue ball it self comes in contact because the hand is considered to be a part of the ball.

Black Cat :cool:
Click to expand...
This is the correct call.
 
OF course it is a foul. Only the cue ball can be moved if ball in hand is had. under no circumstances can an object ball be moved by any means. If it was by accident, you can be a nice guy and place the obj ball back to it's original position...
 
gregcantrall said:
From 2012-2014 BCAPL rule book 1-38 Ball in Hand Placement

4. When placing or moving the cue ball, it is a if you touch or disturb any object ball with the cue ball or your hand that holds the cue ball. Your "hand" is defined as including the wrist up to a point where a wristwatch would normally be worn. Your opponent has no restoration option.

There apears to be a typo in that foul is missing after "it is a".
Click to expand...

Was that written by Travis Trotter at 4 am with an ink dipped CueTec on a keno board?
 
gregcantrall said:
From 2012-2014 BCAPL rule book 1-38 Ball in Hand Placement

4. When placing or moving the cue ball, it is a if you touch or disturb any object ball with the cue ball or your hand that holds the cue ball. Your "hand" is defined as including the wrist up to a point where a wristwatch would normally be worn. Your opponent has no restoration option.

There apears to be a typo in that foul is missing after "it is a".
Click to expand...

Thanks, I hadn't seen that before.
 
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