No Jardin (sp?) played in both the Platnium singles (winner) and Gold Men's teams. Matt Edwards (New Zealand) also played in Gold 9 ball teams and Gold 8 ball teams.
BCA Nationals 8 Ball - Fargo Discrepancy
- Thread starter banditgrrr
- Start date
No Jardin (sp?) played in both the Platnium singles (winner) and Gold Men's teams. Matt Edwards (New Zealand) also played in Gold 9 ball teams and Gold 8 ball teams.
JC
Coos Cues
So Russ moves up to a 656 and Joe to a 686. So what will it take for this to "correct" itself in the Fargo system? It seems like anyone who watched the final match could see that Russ is more skilled. So the system isn't going to be perfect. Ever. Oh well.
JC
I see that now looking at the rosters from some other teams.If my team is over we will just play the platinum.They like to play but just not many teams.
It's not. It can't be. No system ever can be. But this one is as close as is possible IMO. And it is miles better than anything else out there. Once everybody has a lot more games in the system I think it is going it is going to be pretty darn good and it seems at lot more people are seeing that now. Heck isn't like it is bad right now. Like I said it is already miles better than the next best system both in terms of what it can do and take into consideration and also in terms of its accuracy. It is just going to get better and better over time.
On a slightly side note, one of the main reasons no system can even be perfect is because there are always trade offs that have to be made. Think of anything you can think of that you would like to be better about FargoRate. The thing is, you could improve any of those things to near perfection but something else will be affected and will get worse so with every improvement comes some other drawback. Ultimately what you have to do is find the perfect compromise where everything is fairly good and nothing is too bad and finding that perfect balance and compromise is as good as it can ever get. That is where Fargo is now. All it needs to fulfill a little more of its potential is more data, more players with more games in the system and that will come with time. It is actually ramping up pretty quick and with the exposure from Vegas and pressure from the players more and more league and tournament directors are going to be submitting their match statistics and the data is going to ramp up at an even faster rate.
It's just amazing that this is all the info you have on someone who plays in a tournament every weekend. I get that you couldn't possibly get info on every match that every person plays but it's not going to be accurate with just a handful of situations on someone. This is why a players history should be visible. It definitely makes these numbers seem more credible.
Not to pick on Ron, he's a friend of mine, but your history doesn't nearly tell the same story as just taking a look at his azb profile. He's a strong B player and always does pretty well on the predator tour and tri state tour. Your info on him and number you've stamped on him suggest he's a very weak player. I'm happy he won the tournament and took advantage of his low ranking.
http://www.azbilliards.com/people/7892-ron-mason/
What's it amazing?
FargoRate doesn't have a scrubbing mechanism to pull information from misc. tournaments and leagues. Data needs to be submitted.
The amazing part is all of crying done by a few of you about people who try to make the pool environment better.
You all remind me of my kids, all kids for that matter. You try to find fault, when the fault is you do not understand. Mike has been kind enough to pull out data that answers your questions. It is always answers the question.
Except for a few people, who actually want to learn, the rest of you say "but". You should say wow, that makes sense, and thank you.
All this *****ing by a bunch of keyboard cowboys who think they are the voice of pool is embarrassing. You are the whining employee who brings up problems where there are none, and should be fired.
You guys maybe professionals in your field. Mike, Steve, FargoRate, Mark and Ozzy are the professionals in theirs. They don't tell you how to do what you do. It is time you act with professionalism and do the same.
To end this. You guys crying you deserve to know who and why. They do not owe you any explanation. If you don't like it then don't play.
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Have you considered that maybe, just maybe... My "crying" is an attempt to improve his system? Make it better? More accurate? You've heard of constructive criticism before, right? I guess there's no possible way that maybe, just f*cking MAYYYYYBE, his system isn't perfect?
But it's cool... I'm just crying and making loud noises. Continue being butt hurt.
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Like I said. You do not understand it.
You are correct you are just making loud noise and people are sick of it.
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Good, be sick of it. I'm only gotta get louder. And maybe it's you that doesn't understand.
I have been in the system for about 6 years. Watched at least 10,000 games under the system. Played in hundreds of tourneys under the system. Spent many hours with both Steve and Mike discussing it, along with systems from Jeff Sagarin in comparison.
Do I understand all of the math? No. do I need to? No. Am I the expert? No. Am I the voice of FargoRate? Definitely not.
Am I qualified to say it works amazingly? Definitely.
I definitely have a better understanding than you, as proven by your posts.
Again. Just say thank you.
Don't worry I won't reply to you comments any further.
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What you're not understanding is it's not about the system he has in place, it's about the obvious holes in it that leads to players being poorly rated. The system has potential, it's just not there yet. And if he doesn't listen to and actually consider the concerns of myself and many many many others, it's just going to be what it is.
I don't need to thank anyone for Fargo lol. He's not curing cancer buddy...
one more thing im nit understanding is how my 3 man team won the platinum 9 ball division and my rating went up 30 points yet my teamates fargo dropped 2 points.
Mike stated earlier that the team results have not been added to the system. Even if they were added your individual rating would never change at the same rate as someone else unless you were an exact clone of each other, which is impossible
Post #74 is a good explanation how it could happen.
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People speak of accuracy. Here is an earlier post by Mike.
New Rating System
[quote name="Corwyn_8" post=5415973]
I agree. There are some underlying assumptions--like that we don't have paper-rock-scissor situations--that we can only really test by looking at the results.
Here are some of those interesting results. We can do a small case study on ME. I have a rating of 632. That rating is based on 5500 games played against nearly 400 different opponents, with no more than a few percent of my games against any particular opponent.
There are six players (all of whom themselves have thousands of games against many opponents determining their ratings) against whom I've played at least 100 games total--generally several tournament matches and perhaps some league games.... I'll show the expected versus actual against those, and then I'll include my teammate Linda Zsedeney to get a bigger rating range
Larry Wentz (500) expectation, 174 to 69: actual, 179 to 64
Rory Hendrickson (725) expectation, 40 to 76; actual 40 to 76
Dustin Hansen (576) expectation 69 to 46; actual 79 to 36
Bruce Wheeler (610) expectation 62 to 53; actual 67 to 48
Tim Blinn (576) expectation 67 to 45; actual 64 to 48
Gary Dandurand (517) expectation 72 to 32; actual 75 to 29
Linda Zsedeney (434) expectation 55 to 15; actual 54 to 16
These are all close with the exception of games against Dustin Hansen, who has moved up about 50 points since most of those games were played.
Now if you look at Rory (you've already seen he beats me 76 to 40), we can see how he does against a few others. He is a 725, and he's played 38 games against Justin Bergman (795) and 43 games against Dennis Orcollo (813)
Bergman (795) expectation 14 to 24; actual 14 to 24
Orcollo (813) expectation 15 to 28; actual 14 to 29"
https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?ur...share_fid=2711&share_type=t&share_pid=5416054
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New Rating System
[quote name="Corwyn_8" post=5415973]
I agree. There are some underlying assumptions--like that we don't have paper-rock-scissor situations--that we can only really test by looking at the results.
Here are some of those interesting results. We can do a small case study on ME. I have a rating of 632. That rating is based on 5500 games played against nearly 400 different opponents, with no more than a few percent of my games against any particular opponent.
There are six players (all of whom themselves have thousands of games against many opponents determining their ratings) against whom I've played at least 100 games total--generally several tournament matches and perhaps some league games.... I'll show the expected versus actual against those, and then I'll include my teammate Linda Zsedeney to get a bigger rating range
Larry Wentz (500) expectation, 174 to 69: actual, 179 to 64
Rory Hendrickson (725) expectation, 40 to 76; actual 40 to 76
Dustin Hansen (576) expectation 69 to 46; actual 79 to 36
Bruce Wheeler (610) expectation 62 to 53; actual 67 to 48
Tim Blinn (576) expectation 67 to 45; actual 64 to 48
Gary Dandurand (517) expectation 72 to 32; actual 75 to 29
Linda Zsedeney (434) expectation 55 to 15; actual 54 to 16
These are all close with the exception of games against Dustin Hansen, who has moved up about 50 points since most of those games were played.
Now if you look at Rory (you've already seen he beats me 76 to 40), we can see how he does against a few others. He is a 725, and he's played 38 games against Justin Bergman (795) and 43 games against Dennis Orcollo (813)
Bergman (795) expectation 14 to 24; actual 14 to 24
Orcollo (813) expectation 15 to 28; actual 14 to 29"
https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?ur...share_fid=2711&share_type=t&share_pid=5416054
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JC
Coos Cues
How in the world did you lose 16 games to Linda? The 400 range players around here will not win a game from me. Not one, not ever. You must "favor" her.
And Larry should consider quitting pool.
JC
well I know they will not be the same.Just trying to figure how i went up 30 points?I olayed minis.Surely 3 mini tournaments race to 3 cant raise me 30 points.I didnt play singles.He only played teams also.But he dropped 2 points.We shall see.Just trying to understand it better.Dont know what they could have raised me with of they didnt add the teams yet.
If you were the same FargoRate number as Mike she would win the same amount against you.
I played Linda in a handicapped tourney 8-2 was the race. Broke dry and she got out. Then she broke and ran. I lost 2-0. She was screaming, that is the first time she had ever done that.
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And yes, I DO favor her; she is my scotch doubles partner