Best One-Pocket Players

Eddie Taylor, who saw virtually every player mentioned in this thread, felt that Rags Fitzpatrick was the best he'd ever seen. To me, that means that Rags, at very least, is in the GOAT conversation with Ronnie Allen, Efren Reyes, Alex Pagulayan and Nick Varner.
 
sjm said:
This is generally well reasoned, but I don't feel we've arrived at the moment where striking accuracy has taken over quite yet. No doubt, Filler and Gorst have redefined what constitutes a safety and the trend is, just as you suggest, toward a world in which a superior moves game will not be enough to compensate for anything short of elite cueing skills.

Nonetheless, moves-oriented one pocket players like Tony Chohan, John Pinegar, Billy Thorpe, Evan Lunda, Josh Roberts, Justin Hall and others are still holding their own against virtually everybody.
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Hey Stu! I got through the wait list at Turning Stone so I'll see you around the corner!

We're not far apart on this but there is a little gap. That's ok. We all see things a bit differently. I certainly agree that Chohan, for example, can get there at any time with anyone. He demonstrated that nicely by winning the first set to 40 he played with Dennis O and has a resume that no one can ignore, such as the DCC this January in the one pocket.

At the same time he has lost virtually every match he's played against Alex (getting weight), Filler, Fedor, and SVB. And I think Tony is the strongest out of the group you just mentioned.

So can this group win sets off the top strikers? Certainly. Tournaments? Absolutely. But I consider that the same as how Alex Kazakis and Mario He and Aloysius Yapp can win events even with the top 5 players in them. They are close enough to be an ever present threat. But that doesn't mean they are at the highest level. Similarly I think this group, while always live, just can't perform at the same level as the top players I mentioned, and I think that when we zoom out and look from a higher level that seems clear.

But maybe not, because I value your opinion enough to leave room in my mind to grow. Only time and results will truly tell. Thanks for the post!
 
Tin Man said:
Hey Stu! I got through the wait list at Turning Stone so I'll see you around the corner!

We're not far apart on this but there is a little gap. That's ok. We all see things a bit differently. I certainly agree that Chohan, for example, can get there at any time with anyone. He demonstrated that nicely by winning the first set to 40 he played with Dennis O and has a resume that no one can ignore, such as the DCC this January in the one pocket.

At the same time he has lost virtually every match he's played against Alex (getting weight), Filler, Fedor, and SVB. And I think Tony is the strongest out of the group you just mentioned.

So can this group win sets off the top strikers? Certainly. Tournaments? Absolutely. But I consider that the same as how Alex Kazakis and Mario He and Aloysius Yapp can win events even with the top 5 players in them. They are close enough to be an ever present threat. But that doesn't mean they are at the highest level. Similarly I think this group, while always live, just can't perform at the same level as the top players I mentioned, and I think that when we zoom out and look from a higher level that seems clear.

But maybe not, because I value your opinion enough to leave room in my mind to grow. Only time and results will truly tell. Thanks for the post!
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also one can't simply sort them into shooters and movers/specialists, it's more nuanced. alex at this point isn't the same sharpshooter as he was before, but he's moving better than anyone in the world (imo). and some of the top dogs in rotation will have a more natural ability to adapt to one pocket. filler being the best example
 
Tin Man said:
Hey Stu! I got through the wait list at Turning Stone so I'll see you around the corner!
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Yeah, my trip is all set, too, so I'll see you there. Saw you just once at the US Open and you were, understandably, immersed in watching the late stages of the Engel vs Neuhausen match, so we never had a good chance to catch up. Let's fix that at Turning Stone.

No small achievement getting in on the wait list at Turning Stone. It's always oversubscribed.
 
only those that could win at any venue matter. artie was great but only played on his home table in his poolroom. for the most part. and took so long to play each game it was hard to compete against him.
he did beat almost everyone that tried him there.
 
where does earl heisler stand in the pecking order?
seemed to win alot at the sports palace regardless what road player came thru
 
he was one of the best at winning money. few if any could beat him after he wet down the tables. i remember the road players that always said don't play him on his gaffed tables as you probably couldnt beat him anyway. as he moved so good on them.
but hearsay with me as i never went down that way as many seemed to get hijacked if they won or hurt.
 
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there were so, so many top players back in those days that never went to play in a tournament and few tournaments anyway.
you played for cash if you wanted to eat. that was the way it was.
the real list is so long you cannot fit it on the internet.
 
maha said:
he was one of the best at winning money. few if any could beat him after he wet down the tables. i remember the road players that always said don't play him on his gaffed tables as you probably couldnt beat him anyway. as he moved so good on them.
but hearsay with me as i never went down that way as many seemed to get hijacked if they won or hurt.
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You Really have the Worst BS secondhand info on Artie I've ever heard!
I was there every day from 63 to 72 until they moved across the street.
There were fights in the room because of Drunks, the Only player I ever saw hit another player is when Artie busted Cecil. Cecil sucker punched Artie at the counter when he was paying the time and ran up the stairs and out of the PR.
 
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that post was about earl, bill. dont jump to conclusions over your idol.

the post above the one you quoted was about artie and it wasnt critical.
 
The "pure shooters" of today would find it really tough when you are either "on the brunswick" or froze to the stack every single shot.
Old school players have you stuck all the time and you can't run 8 or 10 from there.
 
maha said:
only those that could win at any venue matter. artie was great but only played on his home table in his poolroom. for the most part. and took so long to play each game it was hard to compete against him.
he did beat almost everyone that tried him there.
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This is Another statement by You that is Highly inaccurate! Artie traveled All over the Chicagoland area including many rooms on the Southside Also, to Milwaukee, Detroit and Indiana. He went to CA in the late 60's and to FL in the 70's, NEVER to the Northeast. In 70 or 71 'Country' from NYC called Paul Jones to have him bring me East to play some 3C action. When we got there and met up with Country he told us, "Billy, you can beat all the 3C players around the coast, just don't play 'Shorty' even." "And oh, remember to Allways win the first came, or the best you can do is break even!"
 
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maha said:
he was one of the best at winning money. few if any could beat him after he wet down the tables. i remember the road players that always said don't play him on his gaffed tables as you probably couldnt beat him anyway. as he moved so good on them.
but hearsay with me as i never went down that way as many seemed to get hijacked if they won or hurt
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As a fellow azbro told me, when I asked about the action spot at a town I was visiting:

'...and they'll bet whatever you want, coz they know you aren't leaving with it...'
 
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