Can cues get better?

measureman

measureman

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Just about everything we make has gotten better over time and made what came before obsolete
So just for the sake of argument let's say that Gus Szamboti cues are the best ever made.
Will there ever be a time when they would be considered good but not the best anymore?
Has the art of cue making reached it's limit?
 
the science

measureman said:
Just about everything we make has gotten better over time and made what came before obsolete
So just for the sake of argument let's say that Gus Szamboti cues are the best ever made.
Will there ever be a time when they would be considered good but not the best anymore?
Has the art of cue making reached it's limit?
Click to expand...


The art will probably stay much the same. The technology will move ahead. I think we will see the end of wooden shafts before too long. Many of us aren't playing with wooden shafts now the wood is just the filler between or around the real structure of the shaft.

The assembly of both the shaft and butt of the cue has a lot of room for improvement from the average. The best cues are as well built as anything can be I believe but greater consistent quality in manufacture is certainly possible and I think we may be using some new materials before too long that makes cues more consistent. The fancy may be all on the outside of a core that is what makes the cue actually play the way it does.

One rule that is being circumvented at the moment as I understand it is the rule against moving parts. If we eliminate that rule there could be a whole different world of cues, probably to the detriment of the sport though.

On the other hand there is a rumor that the rules are changing to bring back the mace . . .

Hu
 
measureman said:
Just about everything we make has gotten better over time and made what came before obsolete
So just for the sake of argument let's say that Gus Szamboti cues are the best ever made.
Will there ever be a time when they would be considered good but not the best anymore?
Has the art of cue making reached it's limit?
Click to expand...

No way! Stay tuned... ;):):thumbup:
 
measureman said:
Just about everything we make has gotten better over time and made what came before obsolete
So just for the sake of argument let's say that Gus Szamboti cues are the best ever made.
Will there ever be a time when they would be considered good but not the best anymore?
Has the art of cue making reached it's limit?
Click to expand...



No not at all, i have seen more changes in the cue world in the past 18 months than the past 18 years, for years what cue makers did was a secret or people just didnt have access to the information. Now with the internet, CNC and the shareing of ideas were seeing cues like never before.

For example SVB is staying here this week, I hit some balls with his Cuetec and let me be the first to say that cue is for real, I have some 10 year old ones that are horrible. What they are building now play great and they arnt expensive.

On the custom side look at Gilbert and Jacoby their fancy cues are off the chart these days, 3 years ago they were good looking cues with rounded edges because they were limited to the diameter of the bit, now they have it figured out how to make razor sharp points, diamonds etc with new equipment and teckniques. Same goes for Black Boar.


As far as playability more is known about wood these days and with that knowlege cue makers like Eric Crisp aka Sugartree makes some of the best looking and playable simple cues with no inlays. He is a genious with wood. Barry Szam builds better cues now than he did 10 years ago, he has some of the best wood there is because its old, Old wood is the key IMO to sweet hitting cues assuming the the construction of the cue is good.


Gus was so far ahead of his time and he rightfully will go down in history as the all time best cue maker, he blazed the trails for the top cue makers today. Same for Bushka.


We have alot more to look foward to in cues, will it ever peak out? no its like fashion it will just change, the new trend is bumperless cues, 15 years nobody wanted one now with high polished SS screws they are selling great, so the style of cues will change thus keeping it interesting. and the vintage cues will awalys be traded among the people who are into that.


it aint gonna end, just change its looks over time.
 
My honest opinion is that we will see little or no improvement from a technical standpoint in the years to come. As long as the tables we play on stay the same, and the balls we use stay the same, and the BCA rules we play by stay the same, then I think the status quo will remain unchanged. Necessity being the mother of invention, as it were.
Having said that, I would like to see the development of magnet balls that when arriving anywhere within a ten inch radius of a pocket would fall in. But, only when I was playing.
 
I was asked a similar question, only the question referred to the shape F1 cars.... as far as cues go, I believe yes, there will always be something "better" coming out just like golf clubs.
 
Yeah they can get cheaper.


lol j/k but seriousely yes. Just cause we cant forsee it downst mean it aint gonna happen.
 
JasonS said:
I was asked a similar question, only the question referred to the shape F1 cars.... as far as cues go, I believe yes, there will always be something "better" coming out just like golf clubs.
Click to expand...

f1 cars are different tho, too many rules are in place to prevent them from being even more amazing than they currently are. in comparison, there are much less restricting rules for building a pool cue. u can pretty much do whatever u want.

in f1, the make new rules all the time because as testing and racing puts more mileage on the cars, the teams figure how to constantly improve it while remaining within the rules. the governing body (or max mosley in previous season lol) introduce new rules and regulations so that teams have to redesign the car. the new rules are designed to slow the cars down in order to keep it safe.

what people dont realize is that these f1 cars can be a lot faster than they currently are but the governing body tries its best to keep the speed of the cars in check in order to maintain safety. making the car a lot faster might not make it less safe, but making it faster increases the probability of serious injuries when something goes wrong since its at a greater speed.

plus the drivers might not be able to handle it. they drive around the track with anywhere between 2-5 g's on their body. and its not just pressing straight down on them, it's coming from different angles. pilots can withstand higher g-forces but they have a g suit. racers dont, thats probably why u see these guys exhausted by the end of a race, apparently they lose up to 10-12 pounds per race (water weight from sweating) but thats insane. i cant think of any other sport where u would lose that much weight (without trying to) in one event. there was also a study that monitored driver heartbeats and found that some of them peaked at 180+ beats per minute. and for most of the race it was at a really high level, around 120-160 per minute. most people would be suffering from cardiac arrest if their hearts beat that fast. generally speaking, people who dont understand the sport dont realize how hard it is and how fit these guys are. i always hear people saying "how hard can it be, they just get in a car and drive" which might be one of the dumbest questions that i constantly hear.
 
Twenty years ago, I thought that other materials would soon (10-20 years) make significant inroads on wood for building the highest-performance pool cues. I was wrong. But I still feel it will happen some day.
 
Certainly all manner of things will change, and improve.

Machinery to build cues will get better, allowing more intricate designs and other, yet to be thought of, design improvements.

Materials will get better. Better solutions to stabilze wood. Better glues and epoxies to assemble cues. Better alternative materials out of which to, cost effectively, build cues.

Yes folks .... Things will change. We all hope ... for the better!
 
For cues to get better, we need three things:

1. A standard set of measures for cue specifications beyond taper, weight and length. With more measures, we could identify why one cue "feels" better than another, and then design for those qualities.

2. Objective measurement. Golf has robots for golf clubs. Predator and Meucci have cue robots, but who else?

3. Players need to have an open mind toward innovation and invention, and not a blind adherence to "tradition." If we stuck with tradition, we would still be using maces, or cues without any tips, or ivory balls (that didn't stay round), or wooden table beds, or cushion rails stuffed with rags.
 
I do not believe there will be any material to replace the maple shaft. There is a rhyme and a reason...
 
Interesting question

Have we reached the pinnacle of cue building craft...My answer would be yes and no. The artistic quality is sure to improve as technology improves the ability to transform what is in the minds eye to a reality in wood. Playability quality is kinda up for grabs IMHO. It has often been said, and truthfully so, that a top tier player can use a house cue and give up perhaps 1/2 ball or less by not using his or her own cue. I doubt seriously that any inovation in cue construction within forseeable time, will enable someone like SVB to improve their game by 1 or more balls by simply changing cues. Ask yourself this, Would Mosconi have played any better with one of todays cues and ld shaft.....My gut tells me NO...but we all know the story on opinions.....Dan
 
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measureman said:
Just about everything we make has gotten better over time and made what came before obsolete
So just for the sake of argument let's say that Gus Szamboti cues are the best ever made.
Will there ever be a time when they would be considered good but not the best anymore?
Has the art of cue making reached it's limit?
Click to expand...

Gus had better woods.
Today we have better epoxies.
 
Danktrees said:
what people dont realize is that these f1 cars can be a lot faster than they currently are but the governing body tries its best to keep the speed of the cars in check in order to maintain safety.
Click to expand...

If F1 cars were governed by the same rules used in 1977 when Mario won the WDC, those pesky little F1 cars would have 1050-1100 HP and go around corners at over 9 Gs and weigh in under 1100 pounds. The continues development of the venturi cars wuld allow technology to exist that could not be driven by human beings. As it is, after all the regulations to limit s speed, they can only realistically be driven in anger by (maybe) 100 drivers worldwide, maybe less.

Just try to image the acceleration potential of a car with 1 pound/HP. you won't find it outside of drag racing, and the F1 cars have to run 200 miles or 2 hours. As it stands, the 2.4 litre engines produce northward of 760 HP AFTER having been RPM limited to 18000 RPMs. This is over 300 HP per litre and more than twice the power output per unit size than NASCAR engines.
 
MitchAlsup said:
If F1 cars were governed by the same rules used in 1977 when Mario won the WDC, those pesky little F1 cars would have 1050-1100 HP and go around corners at over 9 Gs and weigh in under 1100 pounds. The continues development of the venturi cars wuld allow technology to exist that could not be driven by human beings. As it is, after all the regulations to limit s speed, they can only realistically be driven in anger by (maybe) 100 drivers worldwide, maybe less.

Just try to image the acceleration potential of a car with 1 pound/HP. you won't find it outside of drag racing, and the F1 cars have to run 200 miles or 2 hours. As it stands, the 2.4 litre engines produce northward of 760 HP AFTER having been RPM limited to 18000 RPMs. This is over 300 HP per litre and more than twice the power output per unit size than NASCAR engines.
Click to expand...

I'm sure this info is valuable to some......but think it needs it's own thread....perhaps NPR
 
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