CTE/ PRO ONE with Stan Shuffett

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dr_dave said:
Actually, according to the DAM truth, all of the top Filipino players use CTE to aim every cut shot, combo, carom, and bank! They even use CTE to aim kick, jump, and masse shots. Isn't it obvious ... that's why they rarely miss a shot. The possibilities with CTE are endless.

This CTE stuff is sounding better and better every day. Boy, I can't wait to play like a Filipino after I view and practice with Stan's DVD. CTE is probably what my game has been missing for all of these years. :eek::grin-square:

Regards,
Dave
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See, if you left that link out you would have a pretty good post there.
 
Neil said:
Joey might be eating about now, so I'll say something. Yes, Dave, it works on banks too. Instead of CTE, I just change to CTC and then pivot. Add a touch of outside english to negate spin off the rail, use a firm stroke, and wha-la. Of course, speed makes a difference on any bank, there's no changing that.
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Neil, shhhhh. Happy Thanksgiving.
 
dr_dave said:
I think I kick and bank better than most players at my speed, and better than many players better than me.

Sure.

For slow and/or long banks, I use the through-diamond rolling-ball system.

For fast-speed banks, I use a 1/3-diamond adjustment to the equal-distance mirror system aim.

For multiple-rail kicks and banks, I use the Plus or Corner-5 Systems.

I also use other systems in different situations.

Regardless of which system I use, I make adjustments to the "system aim" to account for spin, roll, cut angle, and distance effects where appropriate (based mostly on practice-based "feel" and understanding of the effects).

Regards,
Dave
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Sounds like alot of info just to bank a ball. Think I'll just pivot them in. lol
 
dr_dave said:
Joey,

I know this thread isn't about sharing detailed information, but could you at least expand a little on what you mean by this?

Are you claiming that CTE is also an "aiming system" for bank shots? In other words, it helps you arrive at a consistent and accurate line of aim for a wide range of bank shots, with no need for any "diamond system" or "aiming adjustment" ??? In other words, it eliminates the need for traditional kick and bank "diamond systems" and aim adjustment for speed, spin, and angle effects ???

Joey, I appreciate your desire to help people like Stan with sales of their products, but you sure are creating a high bar of expectation for his DVD. I honestly hope Stan's DVD meets or even exceeds all of the created expectations, but I honestly doubt it can. Regardless, I'm still looking forward to viewing it. I hope it comes out soon, before even more expectations are created.

Sincerely,
Dave

PS: I know you don't like it when I provide links to supporting resources and information, but I hope you don't think the links in this post are inappropriate. I honestly think the linked information is pertinent when considering any claims made concerning kick and bank shots "aiming systems."
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That is exactly what he is saying and it's exactly true.

Someday you will have the opportunity to enjoy what we feel. You may or may not understand it any better than we do but when you line up on a bank using Hal's methods and the ball splits the pocket all you will do is grin and shake your head in disbelief. Then you will move the balls around and try it again and get the same result and again you will grin and wonder.

After a while you will just accept that "it works" and start using it for all your bank shots. Once in a while though you will think you can just wing it and "feel" one in and when you miss the pocket you will be pissed at yourself for not doing what you know works.

The banking part of Hal's systems is one of the most underrated strengths of it. You all spend so much time trying to knock Hal and his systems that you can't even get to the banking.

So yes, that is exactly what Joey is saying, CTE can be and IS used to make bank shots. For one pocket CTE is the NUTS when it comes to banks because often you want to lag the ball to the pocket and CTE is the best way I have found to accurately make sure you are really going to the pocket.

And for the record I understand the mirror system/double the distance, Freddy's systems, how to use spin to transfer english, etc... CTE is still the best way to make any one rail bank in my opinion.
 
dr_dave said:
Actually, according to the DAM truth, all of the top Filipino players use CTE to aim every cut shot, combo, carom, and bank! They even use CTE to aim kick, jump, and masse shots. Isn't it obvious ... that's why they rarely miss a shot. The possibilities with CTE are endless.

This CTE stuff is sounding better and better every day. Boy, I can't wait to play like a Filipino after I view and practice with Stan's DVD. CTE is probably what my game has been missing for all of these years. :eek::grin-square:

Regards,
Dave
Click to expand...

I think this is exactly what will happen :grin-square:
Your fixin to go to the next level IMHO
Petey
 
dr_dave said:
Actually, according to the DAM truth, all of the top Filipino players use CTE to aim every cut shot, combo, carom, and bank! They even use CTE to aim kick, jump, and masse shots. Isn't it obvious ... that's why they rarely miss a shot. The possibilities with CTE are endless.

This CTE stuff is sounding better and better every day. Boy, I can't wait to play like a Filipino after I view and practice with Stan's DVD. CTE is probably what my game has been missing for all of these years. :eek::grin-square:

Regards,
Dave
Click to expand...

See, this is the kind of thing that shows that all you want to do is mock Hal and the efforts of those who wish to teach and try his methods.

Unfortunate and sad.
 
dr_dave said:
Actually, according to the DAM truth, all of the top Filipino players use CTE to aim every cut shot, combo, carom, and bank! They even use CTE to aim kick, jump, and masse shots. Isn't it obvious ... that's why they rarely miss a shot. The possibilities with CTE are endless.

This CTE stuff is sounding better and better every day. Boy, I can't wait to play like a Filipino after I view and practice with Stan's DVD. CTE is probably what my game has been missing for all of these years. :eek::grin-square:

Regards,
Dave
Click to expand...

It's posts like this that are divisive but you make these type of posts far too often.

Your true colors are showing. Your attempted ruse of "straddling the fence" on CTE is appreciated by your troupe of naysayers but your posts reveal your true nature.
 
JoeyA said:
It's posts like this that are divisive but you make these type of posts far too often.

Your true colors are showing. Your attempted ruse of "straddling the fence" on CTE is appreciated by your troupe of naysayers but your posts reveal your true nature.
Click to expand...

I think its a case of just not knowing any better
I beleive it will take him to another level
We will see
Petey
 
JB Cases said:
That is exactly what he is saying and it's exactly true.

Someday you will have the opportunity to enjoy what we feel. You may or may not understand it any better than we do but when you line up on a bank using Hal's methods and the ball splits the pocket all you will do is grin and shake your head in disbelief. Then you will move the balls around and try it again and get the same result and again you will grin and wonder.

After a while you will just accept that "it works" and start using it for all your bank shots. Once in a while though you will think you can just wing it and "feel" one in and when you miss the pocket you will be pissed at yourself for not doing what you know works.

The banking part of Hal's systems is one of the most underrated strengths of it. You all spend so much time trying to knock Hal and his systems that you can't even get to the banking.

So yes, that is exactly what Joey is saying, CTE can be and IS used to make bank shots. For one pocket CTE is the NUTS when it comes to banks because often you want to lag the ball to the pocket and CTE is the best way I have found to accurately make sure you are really going to the pocket.

And for the record I understand the mirror system/double the distance, Freddy's systems, how to use spin to transfer english, etc... CTE is still the best way to make any one rail bank in my opinion.
Click to expand...

John, do you know if Hal's banking system is going to be covered in Stan's video?

I remember talking to Hal several years ago and he said if I learned the system I would see all banks no matter how many rails. I really respect Hal from the personal contact I had with many years ago and am very tired of the naysayers. What Hal taught me worked and is used by many on this forum. Consequently, what evolved I feel will definitely be valuable.
 
GaryB said:
John, do you know if Hal's banking system is going to be covered in Stan's video?

I remember talking to Hal several years ago and he said if I learned the system I would see all banks no matter how many rails. I really respect Hal from the personal contact I had with many years ago and am very tired of the naysayers. What Hal taught me worked and is used by many on this forum. Consequently, what evolved I feel will definitely be valuable.
Click to expand...

I doubt that Stan will cover banking. I think that this is one of those things that people who learn CTE/PRO 1 will see once they have a good grasp of it.

Stan would really be the guy to ask. I am waiting on the video like everyone else :-)

I find with banking that once you play with it a little you find the EXACT adjustments for any one rail bank angle. What I mean by that is that for the most part it's CTE in reverse to find the line to bank the ball. I.e. that if you would start from the left edge to cut to the right then start from the right edge to bank back to the opposite pocket. That's ME talking not Stan or Dave or Tom Simpson, or any other instructor that has studied this in depth. Just me personally with my own personal experience.

I have to make these disclaimers because otherwise it is jumped on and certain people start in with "what version are you using, define it, give us mm instructions, etc...." So my point is that when shown CTE and this works with Hal's other systems as well, banking with them becomes WAY easier for me.
 
JoeyA said:
It's posts like this that are divisive but you make these type of posts far too often.

Your true colors are showing. Your attempted ruse of "straddling the fence" on CTE is appreciated by your troupe of naysayers but your posts reveal your true nature.
Click to expand...

JoeyA said:
It's posts like this that are divisive but you make these type of posts far too often.

Your true colors are showing. Your attempted ruse of "straddling the fence" on CTE is appreciated by your troupe of naysayers but your posts reveal your true nature.
Click to expand...

Remember not too long ago posts like these when he would chase Geno around??


_____________________________________________________________________________
Agreed. This thread has provided lots of advertising and marketing, but very little useful information, discussion, or insight. I'm glad Gene has had great success with sales and lessons; but it is very disappointing to me (and others?) that Gene still hasn't told us what PERFECT AIM is. I hope Gene will now be willing to share some of his ideas and opinions, and be open to discussing them. At a minimum, he should at least describe briefly what PERFECT AIM is and why it is different and/or better than alternative methods. Then, we would at least know what he is selling and marketing.

Here are some questions I have asked previously in the thread, along with several more specific questions, that I hope Gene will answer. Gene seems to have strong opinions on these matters, but he has not shared any of his ideas with us. It seems like he, and all of us, could learn and benefit from sharing ideas and discussing these topics.

Questions for Gene:

Do you think everybody has a dominant eye?

Do you think somebody's "vision center" can be somewhere between the eyes, and not aligned with a dominant eye?

How do you recommend people should align their dominant eye or "vision center" differently on straight-in vs. typical cut vs. thin cut vs. spot aiming?

I would think that with straight-in shots and spot aiming (e.g., kick shots), you would want your "vision center" (dominant eye for some people) aligned with the center of the CB. With thin cuts, people have suggested it might be a good idea to align your "vision center" with the edge of the CB. With cut shots, some people seem to recommend keeping the "vision center" aligned with the center of the CB, and be consistent with this so you can train yourself to always see the angle of the shot from the same perspective. What do you think about this? Do you recommend shifting the head more as the cut angle increases? If so, how can one be consistent with this?

One option is to always align your "vision center" through the contact-point-to-contact-point line. That way, you have a clear alignment target, and the head shift toward the angle of the shot might help you see the shot better, provided you are consistent with the shift. What do you think about this?

What is PERFECT AIM? (I'm not looking for your standard marketing answer here ... instead, I hope you will provide an actual description of what it is and how it is applied, in a short paragraph.)

Would the following be a fair and accurate first sentence of the description of PERFECT AIM, based on your previous posts:
PERFECT AIM: A system for aligning your vision for different types of shots: straight-in shots, typical cuts, thin cuts, and spot aiming (e.g., kick shots).
Also, it would be nice to have some additional sentences. Here's an example of what this expanded description might look like (but I'm not suggesting this is PERFECT AIM, because I'm still not sure based on what I've seen and read so far):
??? With straight-in and spot-aim shots, you align your dominant eye with the center of the cue ball. With thin cuts you align you dominant eye with the inside edge of the CB. With cut shots, you shift your vision center toward the inside edge of the CB. ???
Please provide us with better sentences that more accurately represent the basis of PERFECT AIM. I think if you open PERFECT AIM up for discussion, and if you share some of your opinions, you might learn some things that might help you improve how you teach it to students in the future. We might also learn from your ideas on these topics.

Thank you very much. I hope you don't feel my questions are inappropriate or "out of line." I also hope you don't think the answers will "give away all of your secrets" and reduce the amount of future business you might receive. Actually, I think the opposite can be true. I think if more people new what you were trying to sell, they might be more interested in working with you to learn how to develop the skills necessary to use your system effectively.

Regards,
Dave
________________________________________________________________________________




Always the same bit. dr_dave is disappointed that the information isn't just given away. He invades the thread with link after link to promote his product then has the nerve to say "This thread has provided lots of advertising and marketing, but very little useful information, discussion, or insight".?? LOL

I have to say my hats off to Stan and Geno though. These two men are real men of character. They never lower themselves to play the silly games that dr_dave seems to enjoy.

How many times must JoeyA ask that you stop spamming his thread dr_dave? I hope that your actions of late are reflected in your product sales. Maybe then you will realize how you come off when you are constantly attacking something you know little or nothing about.
 
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LAMas said:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neil
... Instead of CTE, I just change to CTC and then pivot. ...

CTC? Center of CB to center of OB then pivot? Like BHE?:confused:
Click to expand...

Yes, I guess so. Post #963 contains a link to a Dave Segal video that attributes CTC+pivot banking to Ron Vitello. Dave says he is pivoting his whole body rather than just pivoting his back hand around his bridge (as one would do for BHE).
 
Been there...........

eezbank said:
Remember not too long ago posts like these when he would chase Geno around??


_____________________________________________________________________________
Agreed. This thread has provided lots of advertising and marketing, but very little useful information, discussion, or insight. I'm glad Gene has had great success with sales and lessons; but it is very disappointing to me (and others?) that Gene still hasn't told us what PERFECT AIM is. I hope Gene will now be willing to share some of his ideas and opinions, and be open to discussing them. At a minimum, he should at least describe briefly what PERFECT AIM is and why it is different and/or better than alternative methods. Then, we would at least know what he is selling and marketing.

Here are some questions I have asked previously in the thread, along with several more specific questions, that I hope Gene will answer. Gene seems to have strong opinions on these matters, but he has not shared any of his ideas with us. It seems like he, and all of us, could learn and benefit from sharing ideas and discussing these topics.

Questions for Gene:

Do you think everybody has a dominant eye?

Do you think somebody's "vision center" can be somewhere between the eyes, and not aligned with a dominant eye?

How do you recommend people should align their dominant eye or "vision center" differently on straight-in vs. typical cut vs. thin cut vs. spot aiming?

I would think that with straight-in shots and spot aiming (e.g., kick shots), you would want your "vision center" (dominant eye for some people) aligned with the center of the CB. With thin cuts, people have suggested it might be a good idea to align your "vision center" with the edge of the CB. With cut shots, some people seem to recommend keeping the "vision center" aligned with the center of the CB, and be consistent with this so you can train yourself to always see the angle of the shot from the same perspective. What do you think about this? Do you recommend shifting the head more as the cut angle increases? If so, how can one be consistent with this?

One option is to always align your "vision center" through the contact-point-to-contact-point line. That way, you have a clear alignment target, and the head shift toward the angle of the shot might help you see the shot better, provided you are consistent with the shift. What do you think about this?

What is PERFECT AIM? (I'm not looking for your standard marketing answer here ... instead, I hope you will provide an actual description of what it is and how it is applied, in a short paragraph.)

Would the following be a fair and accurate first sentence of the description of PERFECT AIM, based on your previous posts:
PERFECT AIM: A system for aligning your vision for different types of shots: straight-in shots, typical cuts, thin cuts, and spot aiming (e.g., kick shots).
Also, it would be nice to have some additional sentences. Here's an example of what this expanded description might look like (but I'm not suggesting this is PERFECT AIM, because I'm still not sure based on what I've seen and read so far):
??? With straight-in and spot-aim shots, you align your dominant eye with the center of the cue ball. With thin cuts you align you dominant eye with the inside edge of the CB. With cut shots, you shift your vision center toward the inside edge of the CB. ???
Please provide us with better sentences that more accurately represent the basis of PERFECT AIM. I think if you open PERFECT AIM up for discussion, and if you share some of your opinions, you might learn some things that might help you improve how you teach it to students in the future. We might also learn from your ideas on these topics.

Thank you very much. I hope you don't feel my questions are inappropriate or "out of line." I also hope you don't think the answers will "give away all of your secrets" and reduce the amount of future business you might receive. Actually, I think the opposite can be true. I think if more people new what you were trying to sell, they might be more interested in working with you to learn how to develop the skills necessary to use your system effectively.

Regards,
Dave
________________________________________________________________________________




Always the same bit. dr_dave is disappointed that the information isn't just given away. He invades the thread with link after link to promote his product then has the nerve to say "This thread has provided lots of advertising and marketing, but very little useful information, discussion, or insight".?? LOL

I have to say my hats off to Stan and Geno though. These two men are real men of character. They never lower themselves to play the silly games that dr_dave seems to enjoy.

How many times must JoeyA ask that you stop spamming his thread dr_dave? I hope that your actions of late are reflected in your product sales. Maybe then you will realize how you come off when you are constantly attacking something you know little or nothing about.
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Thank You Sir,

Stan is very knowledgeable. The few coversations we have had on the phone were a real treat. This guy is trying to help pool with some great info. I for one know how much work it is to put something like this together.

When something like CTE and Pro One has so many players pumping it and trying to tell players that it works you need to get on the band wagon and learn it as fast as you can. Why wait. It doesn't make any sense.

The biggest complaint I have with Perfect Aim after I give a lesson is: Where were you 30 years ago.

I know for a fact that this is the same response that Stan gets when someone really learns and understands how Pro One works. Don't wait even a week.

Players need to spend a few bucks so they can really understand these great aiming techniques such as Pro One instead of just having little bits of info and trying to figure it out theirselves.


What's $50 or $100 bucks. It's a very small investment compared to the amount of money and time we all have in this game of pool.

My advice. Buy the video and then get on here and tell the world how much you wish you would have done it weeks ago.

To me perchasing Stans video is a no brainer.

I can't believe you still havn't ordered it.


Go Stan and Go Pro One................
 
eezbank:
Always the same bit. dr_dave is disappointed that the information isn't just given away. He invades the thread with link after link to promote his product then has the nerve to say "This thread has provided lots of advertising and marketing, but very little useful information, discussion, or insight".?? LOL
Click to expand...
This is a really clueless, biased and unfair criticism of Dr. Dave.

99% of the links he posts are to FREE information that he has spent years developing, researching, writing, organizing, updating and maintaining so that everybody can have FREE access to the greatest library of FREE pool information in the world, including all of his many published articles and many, many excellent instructional videos that he has spent his own time and money creating. He has one thing for sale there (VEPS), and most of that is also available FREE on his website.

Dave is BY FAR the most prolific, authoritative AND GENEROUS source of FREE, OPEN AND UNDISPUTEDLY ACCURATE pool information anywhere. When it comes to unselfish and valuable contributions of hardcore knowledge that everybody in pool can use, Dave is the unchallenged MAN, and neither Stan Shuffet nor Geno Admachino with their (by comparison) paltry and expensive offerings are worthy to hold his jockstrap.

In fact, it's shameful of Gene, the most egregious commercial spammer of AzB who almost never makes a post that isn't a direct promotion of his for-sale product, to chime in here trying to take commercial advantage of your misplaced criticism of Dr. Dave.

You owe Dave an apology for your clueless criticism, and should beg him on your knees to post even more links to his FREE, valuable and on-topic information.

pj
chgo
 
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It is interesting that many of the biggest cheerleaders for CTE were singing the praises of "Perfect Aim" not too long ago.

Based on the product claims and gushing reviews, it seems odd that the practitioners of either method would have any use for the other.
 
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